02 2.0d 320d starting problems - kr24
Hi,
Hope you can help this newbie!!
I am experiencing problems with my 100000mile e46 320d. Car will not start when primer pump NOT heard to run and conversely will start if pump is audible.
Been messed around by BMW a bit, firstly it was definitely air in the fuel rail, which was bled and I was charged £135 for the pleasure. Fault still apparent.
Secondly DDE warning lamp illuminated (think due to ezeestart being used to start engine as we were stuck 300 miles from home). Diagnostics this time threw up a fuel air mixture problem which was either an inlet manifold flapper valve problem of Air Mass Flow meter. On adice the AMF was changed...£335(luckily under warranty)! Fault still apparent.
I have been telling them about the primer pump not running seems to be the issue,however, they have been unable to reproduce.
I am now looking at investigating the fault myself,therefore, I was wondering if someone would be so kind as to let me know 1. Where is the primer pump relay and its number/position 2. Location of pump and accessability. 3. Where to source a pump (new/reconditioned) and if possible cost. 4. Has anyone got more info, i.e. other factors that may cause the pump not to run (sensors, pressures etc)
Any help would be much appreciated. Regards, K

Edited by Pugugly on 13/10/2008 at 22:53

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - Pugugly
Have you considered an independent specialist ?
02 2.0d 320d starting problems - kr24
Hi,
Caught between a rock and hard place. BMW dealer that has been dealing with the fault is familiar and I thought best place for knowledge ;-/
Also girlfriend drives the car and is only home at weekends...when garages are shut. We are dependant on the car to get her 250miles to work
02 2.0d 320d starting problems - Screwloose
K

I'd love to know how you bleed a fuel rail - the pressure is staggering and there will be no air bubbles in there. [Self-bleeding anyway.]

There are two fuel pumps on a common-rail M47TU. One in the tank and one externally. As you can hear it; it's likely the external one that isn't functioning; failures are common.

The fuel lift pump relay is behind the glove box [the L/H end one] and feeds both pumps.
02 2.0d 320d starting problems - kr24
Screwloose,
Thanks for your reply.
The pump I can hear/not hear is audible from the pasenger footwell.
Ill look for relay at next available oppertunity.
K
02 2.0d 320d starting problems - bishop51
did you sort the problems out.ive got a non start 320d 2002,heard a strange noise for 3 miles before it just cut out on tickover and had to be relayed home,gi
ot a feeling no disel getting up to engine.
thanks for any help
russell
02 2.0d 320d starting problems - fedupbmwower
Hi Russell,


I also have a 320d, I have owned the car for around four month?s, and have experienced the same problem.

I took the car to my local garage who after a number of tests advised I required a new Air Flow Meter, as my car not only had a starting problem when hot, it also had a loss of power.

I agreed to the replacement, which has cost just over £300, however, once this had been replaced it didn?t seem to resolve the starting problem.

The ECU describe ?low fuel pressure? / low air pressure, which they thought related to the Air Flow Meter problem.

However, after further investigation it would seem that the ?pressure sensor? that is housed within the fuel pump is faulty and requires replacing.

The fuel pump also is worn and therefore I am having the whole pump replaced at a cost of £1100!

The total repair bill is just over £1700.

I have shopped about to try and find the best deal and I couldn?t find anyone that would do the work cheaper.

I am based in Bournemouth on the South Coast, and would be happy to give you the details of my garage?

Good luck.

Dave
02 2.0d 320d starting problems - bud
hi
I own a 53 plate 320d touring and i have recently come across this problem too , if you don't hear the pump prime the car wont start. i have just replaced the in line fuel pump which i located under the vehicle in the tunnel next to the exhaust accessd by removing 4 screws in a panel under the car. I only used a 2nd hand pump to limit cost (£220 new from bmw) if it helps this is the same pump used on the rover 25 series ( incase you know of any rover breakers ) this seamed to cure the problem up untill a day or 2 ago then the problem came back . But i do believe it is this pump at fault as when i was under the car i got my girlgfriend the turn the key and i could feel the pump click but not turn so i believe to power is getting to the pump just it it not turning ( i.e the impellors inside are sticking). For a cheaper new pump i would try andrew page or euro car parts if you have these near you. hope this helps. will post more as i find ..
02 2.0d 320d starting problems - msbmw
Hi Mate, Im having the same problems, did u manage to get the problem fixed? if so, what was the problem/fault?
02 2.0d 320d starting problems - Pugugly
The original poster has not been here since 08 - I've e-mailed him for you asking him to pop his head around the door.
02 2.0d 320d starting problems - kr24
Hi all,
I'm sorry that I have not been looking in for a while.
The fix cost me approx £8.00 .......
The fault lay with a relay found around the fuse box panel above the glove box.
I can't remember the relay numbers , however, I removed the glove box and swapped the two light pistaccio green (which sit side by side) over and hey presto, pump runs every time.
I called local BMW parts desk and bought a pair of relays for approx. £8 each. Problem solved.
Not happy with BMW, following approx £600 and two months of pain, surely this must be a known problem?????? Or at least diagnosible by a competent technician with drawings and manuals..... Anyway, I hope this helps.
Best regards,
K
02 2.0d 320d starting problems - msbmw
Cheers mate

Edited by Dynamic Dave on 24/01/2010 at 02:08

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - b68ap

Hi msbmw,

did the relay sort it?

I have a 52 plate 320d and it fails to fire on some occasions.

When i turn the key the engine turns but does not fire, i left it for a few hours and then its started fine - i thought the problem was solved until a few days after it didnt start again, left it over night and then it started again. I have googled the poblem and it seems as though it either the fuel supply pump or the relay - im hoping its the latter..

thanks in advance

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - stolly

Hi mate,

I have exactly the same problem with my BMW 53 plate 320d. It turns over everytime but intermittently fails to start. It generally starts from cold but not when its been running and then engine switched off for a few minutes.

thanks in advance

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - Pikey 1

Hi, Sorry to 'jump on the bandwaggon' but I to have a BMW 2002 320d which is having trouble starting when the engine is at running temperature!!

Did you guys get your starting issues resolved, if so which relay/pump is the problem? Thanks in advance Paul.

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - Collos25

http://www.bmwswirlflaps.co.uk/

You may want to read this it may be of concern to you or not but its worth reading.

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - Pikey 1

I'm still struggleing with this issue starting from warm, anybody help??? Thanks Paul.

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - BMWJOE


I have a 53plate 320 coupe diesel 2.0TD. I have had this same problem, if i dont hear the electric fuel pump kick in and "hum" so to speak the engine wont tick over, it started last winter when freezing and i could sit for upto 15 mins flicking ignition power on and off untill i heard the pump then the car would start and run perfectly. then as the weather got warmer the problem went away, i was expecting it to come back this winter however to my dismay it has happened in the hottest april on record which now eliminates a cold start issue. and its happening almost every time i get in the car. i have put it into the garage and its there as we speak, however i am expecting them to say its the fuel pump that needs replacing, but i think i will get the car back and replace the relays (as above) and hopefully this sorts the problem at a fraction of the cost. i have had it in a garage before when the problem was intermittant but could not reproduce the fault when hooked upto diagnoistic machine, one way the check the pump would be to safely connect a direct 12v power source to the pump to see if it runs up ok, if it does you know its either relays or wiring or connection issue, more than likely the relays, i will change the relays and let you all know how i get on.

Joe

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - KevinT
I have just changed my fuel filter (136bhp M47 engine) and the car now fails to start. Google led me to this post, but it seems that changing the fuel filter is a common problem of these engines failing to start.

I did get mine to fire up and run for 10 seconds on 3 separate occasions after which it appeared to die due of fuel starvation (plenty in the tank, btw).

Joe - I'd like to hear how you get on with replacing the relays, so please post back as I suspect my relays may have died on me - not sure how changing the fuel filter could cause this however!

Cheers

Kevin

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - Collos25

If all you have done is change the filter then you have air in the system a specialist BMW garage have the equipment to do this in minutes.

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - mickeybo

A more positive way to get your car running again aquire a aerosol can of brake cleaner

undo intake pipe (rubber) whilst cranking spray sparingley into air intake, (never fails)

Regards Mickeybo

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - bud

hi i changed my inlet manifold not long after getting my e46 320d m sport tourer after heaing about the swirl flps getting sucked into 80,000 mile plus engines and wiping out the engine and turbos . Recently though after talking to some garage lads through work (motor factors) i have now heard you can just take the swirl flaps out altogether as they basically only close the air supply off when you stop your enginge so stop run on , one of the lads we deliver to did this on a cars that had uneven running and the car ran better and smoother than with the flaps in . So i still have my old inlet manifold in the loft (being the horder i am lol) i now intend to remove the swirls flaps and at a later date replace the new manifold with the old flapless one , will update if this swap goes well on not

steve

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - unthrottled

they basically only close the air supply off when you stop your enginge so stop run on ,

No, that's not what swirl flaps do at all. You're confusing the swirl flaps with the anti shudder valve which chokes off air to the engine to prevent shuddering upon shut down.

Swirl flaps are like EGR valves-a misunderstood component that people like to remove because they don't see any discernible benefit to it.

Swirl flaps are closed at low revs when the air velocity across the two intake valves is too low to promote sufficient air motion. The restriction increases the turbulence of the air entering the cylinders and promotes cleaner, less sooty combustion. The restriction does reduce the amount of air entering the cylinder so they are opened at highe revs where the air velocity is sufficiently high anyway.

Properly functioning swirl flaps are a useful (if not fundamental) component to a 4 valve diesel engine. BMW, like all manufacturers don't waste money on hidden components that are extraneous.

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - Hanno82

Hi, this is how I fixed the problem

Symptom: My e46 320d M47N engine was starting fine in the mornings and then when I drove around the block and I came back it was struggling to start. Only after switching on and of the ignition a couple of times I could hear the high pressure pump humming for 30 seconds and then my car would start perfectly

Fixing the problem: I started with a process of elimation. This was taking out the glove compartment and changing the relays at the back of the glove compartment. My bmw agent gave me the numbers for what these green relay numbers might be, it was either ending with a number 566 or 700. After I changed these relays and the problem was still occuring. I then took the car to a bmw specialist friend that did diagnostics on the car. He found that he could not get diagnotic readings from the dme (computer box). He also pointed that when he turn the ignition the temperature gauge would jump into the red, though the car was still cold, and he indicated that this might be a electronic problem.

The big fix: I got a secondhand dme, ews and key, and replaced the ones that was in the car. I opened the key that I just bought and replaced the PC board and chip with the one that orginally started my car. Now the car was starting and I could hear a few relays switching that I didn't orginally hear when I turned the ignition BUT now my key couldn't remotely open my doors. I reprogrammed the new key to work with the car's central locking as follows

1) Sit in the car and close all the doors

2) Turn the ignition on and off quickly

3) Press and hold the Open button while doing step 4

4) Press the Close button 3 times

5) Release the Open button

Conclusion : Check if your car temperature gauge jump into the red when turning the ignition. Check if you can hear at some point the high pressure pump (located on the engine). Check if it is not time overdue to buy a new car with less problems :-D

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - Agent8

Hi,

I've had exactly the same problem as Hanno82 occur to me a month ago. I've got an e46 320d compact 2003 ES automatic.

The hot starting problem was intermittant. Only occuring once the engine was properly hot. The engine would not start. But would turn over healthily.

And the dash would come up with an odd set of lights (Battery, Traction Control, Hand Brake and Auto Gearbox Warning next to the gear P sign). The temperature gauge would also go straight into the red at 100% max to the right (despite having been sitting at 50% when driving it).

Also it was noticeable that you could not hear the fuel pump under the passenger seat.

I took it to a BMW garage. They did diagnostics and told me it was an error in the CAM bus network: a sensor, the wiring or a control unit. They said they would then spend a further 3 hours + work to check the wiring, sensors and control units.

So I then found an independant BMW specialist to try to troubleshoot the problem. He couldn't get the diagnotics to work properly when the error was replicated and the ECU (DDE) didn't record any errors.

After trying some of the things from the thread, checking fuses, changing relays and looking at swappnig out a sensor or two the mechanic came to the conclusion it was the DDE that was faulty. He ruled out everthing he could before suggesting biting the bullet and replacing the DDE. So for £900.00 we replaced that and no problems since, the error has gone (fingers crossed). And it's been two weeks of commuting to work and doing a couple of long drives at weekends. Testing each time on switching off to see if the error occurs.

So thanks for the posts, it helped point me in the right direction.
Nick.

02 2.0d 320d starting problems - aaronc1234
Don't know if this forum is still active but I am experiencing the exact same fault and I have removed the glove box and can see three green relays that are all the same, but I cannot find the 2 sitting side by side that is said to be swapped here. Wondering if anyone has any advise on where these relays are situated or is it two of the three I can see. Thanks in advance, Aaron
 

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