Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - thesoupdragon

OK,

Feeling a bit stressed here guys. I bought a car last weekend from a registered car dealer in the midlands. It was described as "mint" but the bodywork wasnt and as I had travelled a fair distance to view I was a bit grumpy. Anyway the car drove nicely and I negotiated a discount from circa £4600 to £4000. Drove home 200 miles no probs. Two days later red light came on and it needed water adding. I did a 50 mile trip yesterday and again at last few miles red light came on and it needed 1.5l water. I cant see any leaks.

I called the dealer today and said I am not happy with the car and would like a refund . He said but you got a discount! I said it isnt up to scratch and has an issue at which point he said "write me a letter"

I am not sure what to do really. Should I take it to Toyota and have it diagnosed or should I insist that the dealer either fixes it or takes it back?

I have driven Toyota petrol cars for over 10years no with no probs but this is my first Toyota diesel. Its a 57 pate btw with 74K onthe clock service history for every 10K or so and 12 months MOT

SD

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - monkey66

Good morning SD.

Regardless of you getting a discount or not, within your consumer rights you are entitled to reject the car within a limited period of time. It is also within your rights to ask for a repair or replacement.

If you visit the consumer advice website and you'll find various templates of letters to help you out.

Remember, these are consumer rights, not consumer negotiation points. It may take some time to get the result you're looking for but stick to your guns. You'd find a lot of value in giving the consumer advice line a call.

I'm going through something similar myself just now so fully understand how stressful the situation is.

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - thesoupdragon

Thank you Monkey, I wasnt aware of the advice service you mentioned so I will give a good read over

Cheers

SD

Edited by thesoupdragon on 06/08/2015 at 11:07

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - FP

As I understand it, you need to decide very soon whether you are going to reject the car. The law says this must be done within a resonable period - in practice, within a very few weeks.

As has been said above, the discount is irrelevant.

If you want to try to get the dealer to fix it, that's your choice, but it will probably prevent you from rejecting the car later, depending on the outcome. (For example, a repair that lasted for a few months before the problem reappeared will mean you won't be able to get a full refund.)

My suggestion is that you don't deal with anywhere but the dealer you bought from in the first instance - it simply complicates things. I'm afraid that goes with the territory when you buy a long way from home.

Edited by FP on 06/08/2015 at 13:52

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - thesoupdragon

He has told me I have to write to him formally otherwise he cant respond.

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - FP

"He has told me I have to write to him formally otherwise he cant respond."

Don't see a problem with that. You will want to cover yourself in every way (in case it all gets legal) and keeping a record of correspondence is a good idea.

Just decide which route you're going down.

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - Falkirk Bairn

Send any letter RECORDED DELIVERY....proof of delivery dates can be very important futher down the line.

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - pd

You're not really at the rejection stage yet on a car of this value IMO - the dealer is entitled to have a go at repairing it. Only if they don't, or fail to do so, are you entitled to a refund.

To be honest, the dealer doens't sound too promising on the helpful front.

It could be something minor wrong with the car in which case you're probably best just biting the bullet and fixing it but it could well be the headgasket in which case it is a different ball game - I'm afraid to say that head gasket failure on this engine is quite common and on a Verso the engine has to come out to repair it so is no small job.

Be aware that if the dealer does nothing then you could be looking at 6-8 months, considerable time and considerable up-front costs to take it to court.

Edited by pd on 07/08/2015 at 11:48

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - thesoupdragon

OK worst fears confirmed, cylinder head gasket gone and that means possibly the head too. I have had this car 1 week, can I ask for a full refund?

Toyota Garage said it should not have been sold to me end of story!

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - 72 dudes

In theory, yes. Car was faulty at time of sale and was not of satisfactory quality given its age, mileage and the price paid. Sale of Goods Act.

Getting the garage to agree this will be much tougher. You might have to settle for them carrying out a repair (at their expense).

Discount given is irrelevant as that was the agreed price before anyone knew there was a fault.

How are your negotiating skills?

Edited by 72 dudes on 08/08/2015 at 12:26

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - thesoupdragon

I have a feeling they want us to have the head gasket changed at a garage of their approval but of course the head may be damaged too!!

Toyota want £2600 to replace the gasket then send the head for testing etc. if the head is gone the bill will be more than we paid for the car

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - Andrew-T

I have a feeling they want us to have the head gasket changed at a garage of their approval but of course the head may be damaged too!!

If the head is taken off for a new gasket, it will most likely be skimmed at a local engineering specialist. Not an expensive job (£50-ish). No idea whether a Toyota dealership will inflate the cost compared with an indy, for example.

I had a HG replaced with skimming a year or two ago for £500-600, admittedly on a much simpler car. Getting the engine out will add a lot, but that much?

Edited by Andrew-T on 08/08/2015 at 18:04

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - pd

The supplying dealer is within their rights to try and repair it if they wish - how, who and what they do is their business - the key thing is that they deliver a "satisfactory" car at the end of it all.

Personally, if I was the selling dealer, I would look at a refund or supplying/sourcing you another car and send the Verso to auction and never want to see it again.

The 2.2 diesel is a known troublesome engine and headgaskets going in all cars it is used in (Lexus included) is quite common.

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - thesoupdragon

This is all a learning curve for me. We have been driving Toyota ( petrol) for the last 11 years with not a hint of problems.

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - thesoupdragon

They have asked for it back to assess / fix it. It is not driveable so its gonna cost me £200 to have it trasported............ not happy

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - alan1302

This is a reason why you should always way up pros and cons of buying a car from a long way away. An expesniev lesson though!

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - thesoupdragon

Update, garage said they wanted the chance to fix the car. I shipped it back to them at my expense on a low loader Friday 14th August. 7 days later they haven't been in touch. I have texted with no reply and I called to be told it was in the workshop and they didn't know how long it would be. They now have my car and my cash. I am on holiday but am back at work Monday and need transport! What a terrible experience and a thoroughly appalling garage.

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - 72 dudes

I think you need to send them a recorded delivery letter, detailing your experiences and the complaint from start to finish.

In it, you should summarise by saying you expect the repair to have been completed to your satisfaction by (insert a date, probably Friday 28th August) or you will be forced to begin proceedings which will culminate in you claiming a refund in full.

Then go down the Small Claims Court route.

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - thesoupdragon

OK, picked my car back up today with a replaced head gasket. The sales guy said it had cost him over £600 to have the work done and he had also replaced a "stuck" injector free of charge.

Great I thought.

He then told me that he had forgotten to stamp my invoice with his "normal" stamp that shows that he has sold me a third party warranty that states that all claims are limited to £250 per claim. I told him I hadn't bought a warranty, I had the car three days and it broke down and I had returned the car to him under the sale of goods act. He asked me for £350 towards the work done but I declined his kind offer!! He told me his solicitor had said this was how it should be. Tough was my reply. It seems he is selling cars on a daily basis and trying to pass off his obligations by selling people third party warranties.

Ok he said I ill give you a refund on the car of £3500, I paid just over £4000 for it. I said if he gave me what I paid for it I would walk and that would be that.

He called his solicitor and then came to me and said, it was my mistake for not stamping your invoice with the warranty terms and you can take the car.

I have given it a 200 mile run today and it seems OK and I will check the oil and water tomorrow and every morning for a few weeks see how it goes.

Thanks for all of your input guys!!

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - FP

Another dealer who is as close as dammit to a crook.

Glad you stood your ground. The warranty is indeed a red herring, and nothing to do with whether a document had been stamped. The phone call to the solicitor probably never actually took place, but was a face-saving exercise.

I hope the repairs hold up for you - best of luck!

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - thesoupdragon

Now the weathers has turned a bit colder this car has the blue light on permanently ie not getting up to proper operating temperature. I dont think it has a thermostat and that the dealer may well have removed it due to overheating issues when they replaced the head gaskett. I have asked them about this and they said , this is normal for this engine to be running with the blue light on.

I have asked them for a refund as they have failed to fix the car satisfactorily and they have stopped talking to me

it looks like I am going to have to go down the small claims court route.

Anyone done this before?

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - concrete

There are many on this forum who have a good knowledge of how the small claims track works. I have used it twice,I am no expert, but here goes. The issuing of a summons is the easy part, you fill out the forms, provide the level of detail they request and pay a fee up front. This fee is refunded from the plaintiff if you win as are all the attendant court costs. The court will inform you of hearing dates etc.

Firstly the opposition will try to get the case heard in their local court. Do not have any of this. Stand your ground, make them travel to you, it makes the process less appealing to them. Second is the hard part. FULL details of the whole sorry saga. But use bullet points to illustrate your points, do not write an essay. Good, clear, incisive points and as much paperwork as you have, all in chronlogical order on numbered sheets and keep a reference master sheet to list roughly what information is which sheet, a full copy for the judge and the opposition too, this will really endear you to the judge. Do not cloud the issue with emotion, be as dispassionate as possible. Sometimes the summons scares the opposition into paying up, sometimes they play brinkmanship and throw in the towel on the day of the hearing. If they do they give in or don't turn up, they lose. If they turn up and the case is heard, then questions will be asked by the judge. Be clear and polite and fairly brief, sometimes the opposition get rattled and the judge has to remind them of their place. This scores points for you. Call everyone sir or Mr, the judge will tell you how to address him. Don't get involved in a slanging match. Speak when you are spoken to and never interupt. From what I have read you have a decent case, but do your research. Remember, the judge will keep things fair. It is quite an informal hearing, without all the legal jargon. Don't be Perry Mason, if in doubt, politely ask for clarification. With a good case, good manners and dressed smartly you should be able to win this one. Best of luck and keep us informed.

Cheers Concrete

Toyota Corolla Verso 2.2 D-4D - Returning a Car - pd

The first thing you have to prove is that there is something wrong with it. A light being on doesn't really prove that - you need something which proves it still has a major fault (engineer's report etc.).

You also shouldn't really use it. If you are arguing that it is not fit for purpose then - as the purpose of a car is to transport you from A to B - if you continue doing that with it then you case is weakened.