Credit Repair & Hire - Possible Disputes? | Legal matters | Back Room Forum

Mon 12 Sep 2011 08:11

Credit Repair & Hire - Possible Disputes? - hy288

Hi,

My car was involved in an accident about 3 weeks ago. In summary, my car (Nissan 350Z 3.5l V6) was parked along a street next to a Showhome we were viewing at the time. The guy living across the street reversed and hit my driver side door. Fortunately he drop by and spoke with the sale advisor regarding the damage he caused. I got his details and he admitted liability, also got details of the sale advisor as a witness in case.

I advised my insurer (Esure) and eventually was passed to their non-fault handlers (Helphire). Helphire got in touch next day and advised they would handle the full claim - arrange repairers, no excess, replacement car, sort out costs, claim from the third party etc. In an unlikely event they couldn’t recover costs back a separate insurance policy would be used for this situation; So that no costs would every come back to me.....as explained

By the following week, parts were in order via the bodyshop after assessing damage.
That same week Helphire advised that the third party had admitted liability on the incident.

Parts were in this week and so repairs could commence (told approx 5 days work).
I made arrangements for the hire car and was hit with a host of letters - T&Cs; all of which seem pretty worrying when you read them. The daily hire rates (£206!), agreeing on liability for repair/hire costs etc, interest charges etc. It's quite different from how they initially described things over the phone.

At this point, I was already involved and as liability on the TP was established I thought it would be fine to continue. Due to the age of my car the category of hire car was downgraded (SP05?) for which I was ok with.I ended up getting a BMW 320d which was more than adequate.

The hire car arrangements were made on the Tue 06/Sep and I got the car on the Thu 08/Sep. However, at the same time I received a letter from the third party insurer offering their services (including hire car for £139 daily). This I received around Wed 07/Sep.....
The letter states I need to immediately advise Helphire on the offer if I have a hire car in place. But never mentions any outcome if I didnt take their offer?
I advised Helphire on this as I did not want to cause any issues on reclaiming hire costs later on! Helphire advised me that as I've already been in touch with them and arrangements made, I can ignore the TPs offer.

So far I have signed for the hire car docs. I have yet to sign and return thier credit repair agreement despite that repairs are already underway.

My questions are:

1) Can you advise me if I don't take the TP offer on the hire car and or repair, will this cause issue on dispute of costs?

2) I’ve accepted to only take a hire car at the time of repair to mine. I was also happy to downgrade to the lower category class of hire car. I have indicated I have no other car and need a car to commute to work daily, travel to client sites when necessary, domestic needs (shopping etc), and social visits (family / friends). Based upon this and the proceedings so far (i.e TP admit liability), do you reckon this case would be clear cut and should be resolved without any possible dispute i.e. hire costs etc

Having read some experiences, I am obviously concerned with the route I have taken so far. I'm am regretting this and worried of the potential hassle it will lead to - Legal invovlement on disputed costs, providing financial information, justifying everything etc.

This has been the 5th day of hire since last Thu, and I'm hoping repairs will be complete in the next day or so. But if it extends, should I consider returning the hire car to stop costs creeping any higher?
Any advice would be appreciated.

And apologies for the long post.
Many thanks

Reply | Report as offensive | Link

Mon 12 Sep 2011 14:12

Credit Repair & Hire - Possible Disputes? - ifithelps

I share your concerns.

You are obliged to keep the costs of your claim as low as is reasonable, which I think is where the third party's offer of a cheaper hire car is coming from.

Having said that, you are not psychic, so they cannot reasonably expect you to take up a cheaper offer you were unaware of at the time you accepted the hire car you have.

It's good the hire is coming to an end shortly, most of the disputes seem to revolve around people who have taken a credit hire car for weeks on end.

If there is a dispute in your case, it should be about a relatively small sum - the difference between your hire cost, and the cheaper cost offered by the third party.

That should only come to a few hundred, which in the grand scheme of things the third party insurer may not consider worth worrying about.

In terms of reducing possible future hassle, I would return the BMW as soon as possible, even if that caused some inconvenience.

One moral of the story is to claim off the third party insurer directly, but tell your own insurer 'for information' what you are doing.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link

Mon 12 Sep 2011 16:03

Credit Repair & Hire - Possible Disputes? - hy288

Hi,

I just wanted to make sure I wasnt expected to cancel the existing hire car and then proceed to take the TP one? As you've mentioned I'd rather not have any come back hassle on all this.

I gave the bodyshop a phone this morning to check on the progress and when we would expect it to be complete. They are now telling me towards the end of the week, the quickest being around Thu 15/Sep. Then again possibly Fri 16/Sep. Which means a few more days than the expected 5 days...

In terms of costs the hire agreement rate indicates £187 from 7days up. So thats approx £1496 for 8 days and £1683 for 9 days (ExVat). Compared to the TP rate of £139 that they offered in their letter. This equates to a difference of a few hundred i.e. £400-500.

So I guess what your telling me is that these costs are not too much to worry about provided the hire does not go on for another week etc?

I totally take your point in returning the car asap. I certainly do not plan to take the car any longer than by this Friday (9 days total). As I'll certainly try and make other arrangements if need be. If you think otherwise then let me know...

Should I be concerned that the bodyshop would try to delay the repairs? As this may be agreed with the hire company in order to extend the hire car period?

The fact that I am technically entitled to a courteousy car if i go thru my insurer via an approved garage (most basic Micra or something?). And also, the fact that financially I would be able to manage to hire a car of some kind (maybe not longer than a few days). Would these 2 points mean I'd be liable to the disputed charges if the claim was to be disputed in anyway?

Oh btw, the repairs are going to be in the region of 2k exVat..

Reply | Report as offensive | Link

Mon 12 Sep 2011 17:26

Credit Repair & Hire - Possible Disputes? - ifithelps

You are clearly thinking along sensible lines, although there is no 'right' or 'wrong' way to proceed.

I would stick with your current plan on the assumption your car will be ready by this Thursday or Friday.

A rethink may be required if this tips into the following week.

Returning the hire car and contacting the third party insurer to avail yourself of their offer would be one way to proceed.

Or return the hire car and ask the repairer for whatever cheap and cheerful car they have, just to keep you mobile.

That may concentrate their minds a little, as well.

I doubt they will string out the repair time on purpose, assuming their income comes only from the repair, not the hire.

You are certainly fulfilling your obligation to keep the cost of your claim down.

If you get your car back later this week, I think you will hear no more about it.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link

Mon 12 Sep 2011 17:50

Credit Repair & Hire - Possible Disputes? - hy288

Firstly, many thanks for your advice on this.

While I spoke to the bodyshop this morning. I did query for a free car....however, the reply from them was Helphire are responsbile for getting you a car sir. I even asked to confirm that they were an approver repairer for my insurer (Esure). They confirmed yes we do work for them. I then replied that seeing that I'm an Esure customer and i'm using you as the repairer I am entitled to a free car am I not? They said that since the repair was managed by Helphire, Esure technically are not involved! So hence, we would not give out free cars. He then went on to say didnt Helphire give you a hire car...etc

So like you my thinking was to hand the hire car back and just use whatever cheapy car was available at the bodyshop. However, doesnt look like they are playing? Not really sure what other tactics I can try to get them onboard on giving me a free car...?

I might consider and call Esure tonight to see what their line is on it. Incidently I am some what concerned in the situation whereby i get my car back and its not up to scratch. Rework needed....are they telling me i have to got back on the hire car route in order to get a car.....

I kinda assumed that helphire gives them a better labour rate or something but in order to agree to string things out for helphires benefit...? Maybe i'm just thinking too much into it.

Btw, just curious have you had involvment with these hire companies in the past?

Reply | Report as offensive | Link

Mon 12 Sep 2011 18:16

Credit Repair & Hire - Possible Disputes? - ifithelps

The bodyshop is correct in the sense you are not claiming from esure, you are claiming from the third party insurer.

In that respect, it would have been simpler had you contacted the third party insurer directly, and claimed through them.

Doing so would have also avoided any problems with a hire car, since you would have got one provided by them.

Given the above, there's little point in calling esure, but you could call the third party insurer.

For completeness, there is another matter you should consider.

Rightly or wrongly, esure may load your premium at the next renewal, because you have been involved in an accident, even though it was not your fault.

Since this possible extra expense is caused by the third party, you are entitled to claim that cost from them - in theory.

Practically, it can be difficult to prove and quantify a cost that has yet to be incurred, and may not be.

One way is to get a letter from your insurer to say they intend to load your premium next time.

You then use that letter to negotiate a payment from the third party insurer.

There are too many ifs, buts and maybes in the process for me to think it worthwhile, but you may think differently.

If you call the third party insurer about the hire car, you could mention you are concerned your premium will be loaded in future.

You won't be the first claimant to raise that question, so they may have an answer.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link

Mon 12 Sep 2011 19:57

Credit Repair & Hire - Possible Disputes? - hy288

I've not been involved in this sorta stuff with regards to accidents and the general process.But based on what I know now, I would not do the same and really regret the route so far!! A learning experience (not a good one) I think on the safe side I'd just ensure I claim from my own insurance period.

At the time, my insurer (Esure) made it sound that this was the normal process for non-fault claims by using their claim handler Helphire; despite that they knew I was fully comp. I guess a combination of this, and a fault of my own for not being more careful enough has put me in this position which was totally uneccessary.

When you mention about calling the TP insurer, are you suggesting that if my car is still not ready by Thur/Fri this week, and it gets delayed further.....that I let the TP insurer know that I've decided to cancel the hire car with helphire (although after 8-9 days use) in order to keep costs down? However, the situation is that my car is still getting repaired and I obviously no longer have a car to keep me mobile.
So is there any chance if they the TP insurer will sort something out for me i.e. free car (and definately not another hire agreement!)

Do you reckon they would be happy to help? Or would it go against me seeing that I've already used 8-9 days of Helphires hire car at the higher rates. Would they not think that if you are happy to cancel and live without the car (despite the inconvience), then there is no reason why you had to have the car in the first place! Then obviously use this information at their advantage and dispute the whole hire costs to date....If you see what i mean?

Although one declares all claims and accidents (including non-fault ones). I would not expect any insurer to factor non-fault ones in the premium cacculation?

If I do end up getting written evidence from Ensure about increase premiums. Do I just get my existing handler Helphire to negoiate?

One important thing which springs to mind is that If i negoiate with the TP i.e. increase premiums or free car. Does this not potentially voliate anything between me and Helphire. As they are the ones that manage and negoiate the claim on my behalf. It sounds complicated, but I obviously wont want to break any agreement going behind their backs uncase they discovered......and then foot the oustanding bills to me...

Thanks!!

Edited by hy288 on 12/09/2011 at 20:00

Reply | Report as offensive | Link

Mon 12 Sep 2011 20:39

Credit Repair & Hire - Possible Disputes? - ifithelps

Relax, you have done nothing wrong.

When you are involved in a non-fault accident, you are faced with a number of ways of proceeding.

You have simply chosen one, instead of another.

Your only possible problem, if you have one at all, is the hire car.

Given that you are getting stressed by this, I suggest you do nothing for the time being, in the reasonable expectation your car will be repaired by the end of this week.

But if it's not repaired by this time, I think you need to contact the third party insurer to voice your concerns about the rising cost of the hire car.

It is in their interest to assist you, because doing so will reduce the cost of your claim against them.

I agree possible future premium hikes are not worth worrying about, but others may take a different view.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link

Mon 12 Sep 2011 22:29

Credit Repair & Hire - Possible Disputes? - hy288

Ok....many thanks for all your advice!

I really appreciate all your time and patience in answering my questions. Its honestly has helped me clarify a number of unknowns, and put alot of things at rest.

I might seem still rather stressed, but I'm certainly feeling a lot better having confirmed alot on the detail of the situation.

Anyways, I'll let you know how things get on.

Will kick back with a glass of wine now :)

Cheers!

Reply | Report as offensive | Link

Tue 13 Sep 2011 01:13

Credit Repair & Hire - Possible Disputes? - Avant

Welcome to the forum, hy288. And many thanks, Ifithelps, for taking the time and trouble to provide the advice.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link