The controls in my 3-series are generally excellent. Silky-smooth to operate and feel like they will last for ages. However, I don't like the indicators (no sniggering at the back, there!)
They feel nice to operate, but they re-center themselves as soon as you use them to signal. If the indicators cancel themselves after the turn, then all is well. However if they don't.....AAAARRRGGGHHHHH!!!!!
EXAMPLE. I signal right, and make a right turn but the indicators don't cancel. I move the indicator the other way, and suddenly I am signalling a left turn. So I quickly try to cancel that, and I am signalling a right turn again. So I try to cancel that, and I am signaling a left turn.
So I travel down the road looking like a soldier on the march - left, right, left, right.
No wonder BMW drivers don't use their indicators..........just kidding! :-)
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So I travel down the road looking like a soldier on the march - left, right, left, right.
People often say keyless entry and auto parking brakes are answers to questions nobody asked, but for me, it would be this. For any manufacturer to think they could improve in any way on the conventional, simple, functionally perfect, mechanically self cancelling indicator switch is just unfathomable. This is a tiny, innoffensive device which does exactly what it was designed to do, and perfectly well, and has done for years. Why change it?
It's even more pointless than the entry system and the parking brake examples, because you still need to move the stalk manually to operate the indicators. It genuinely baffles me why such indicator setups exist.
Edited by DP on 08/12/2009 at 12:51
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I find that I, more often than not, cancel the indicators myself anyway. I hardly ever let them self-cancel.
I think it's because I spent a lot of time drving Citroens with no self-cancellation funtion in my early driving days. I am a person prone to irritability and the indicators staying on longer than I want them to is a source of irritation to me.
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My otherwise excellent Forester has remarkably poor ergonomics. Turn lights on by L hand column stalk but fumble under R side of dash to find the fog light switches, wipers operate by R stalk but pulling stalk only gives wipe, for wash push end button, no individual controls on dashboard vents as they are completely governed by the heater controls.
My partner's Golf is by comparison a model of logic but I do agree with AE about the rear wash/wipe.
alfalfa
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My fog light and main beam switches are located just below the head light control switch (classic german layout) the problem is I sometimes accidently knock the switch when getting in or out of the car, switching my head lights on only to be comfronted with a big blue warning light.
You can just about see the problem here.
s167.photobucket.com/albums/u141/amazingtrade/?act...g
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Our Kia which has indicators on the right and wipers on the left. I don't know how many other cars are like this, but all cars I have driven in my motoring career have indicators on the left, wipers on the right. I don't know if one way is better but I prefer the way I'm used to.
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Our Kia which has indicators on the right and wipers on the left. I don't know how many other cars are like this but all cars I have driven in my motoring career have indicators on the left wipers on the right. I don't know if one way is better but I prefer the way I'm used to.
runboy,
Was going to mention this in my earlier post but forgot, completely agree with you. I have driven japanese cars which are like this as well. I also find the location of service parts on modern cars silly as well. For example my Ford Focus has a pollen filter which has to be changed every year. To get to this you have to remove the glove box! Why do manufacturers insist on tucking service parts in the depths of the car when they know it is going to take the owner so much time to get to? Is it to make us go and get our car serviced at dealers?!
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For example my Ford Focus has a pollen filter which has to be changed every year. To get to this you have to remove the glove box!
That is sad. On the old Focus, and also the old Fiesta and Ka, the pollen filter was easily accessible by removing the scuttle panel cover.
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The Chrysler Cruiser I now have, still fairly new (to me), does have one annoying fault. When revved to 4,000 or more with head or sidelights on, it has a tendency to turn on its front foglights, which then stay on after one has turned the car off and got out. It can take several sharp taps on the end of the stalk to make them go off.
It's a bit of a mystery.
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The most annoying thing to me is the wash/wipe combination. In very cold weather I liked to be able to test if I was going to get water through to the screen before switching on the wipers. With "modern" cars (i.e. those built in the last 15 years or so) it seems popular to combine the two, so if the screenwash is frozen you just get salt smeared all over the windscreen and have to stop and clear it by hand.
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There really can't be much worse out there than the Almera's combined heating/ventilation/radio controls!!! They absolutely defy all logic and explanation - even after 3 years of ownership.
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I've found by far the most logical dashes are Fords, they spend a fortune on getting it right and its just pure logicaly. My Corsa has annoying things like electric window switches on the door shelf.
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Kias now come with the indicators on the conventional (for the UK) left side.
Like others, I can't get away with Ford's 'pull for dip and pull for main beam' stalk.
The indicator beeper is quiet on the CC3, so it's easy to bowl along with the indicator still flashing if it hasn't self-cancelled - particularly easy to do if the roof's down.
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The indicator beeper is quiet on the CC3 so it's easy to bowl along with the indicator still flashing if it hasn't self-cancelled - particularly easy to do if the roof's down.
Never driven one, is there no warning light on the instrument cluster?
Used to be easily missed on some classics where the repeater was on the end of the indicator stalk, I think early Mini's were like that.
I still like a foot control for the dipswitch but I guess there isn't enough room in the footwell of most modern cars.
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...is there no warning light on the instrument cluster?...
Yes, but it's small and not very bright, making it easy to miss.
I've been alerted by the repeater on the door mirror still winking a few times.
That warning method only works for right turns, because you can't see the nearside door mirror repeater from the driver's seat.
Early Minis did have a light on the end of the stalk which, slightly oddly, was green.
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DISLIKES:
Civic FK3:
Fog-light turn switch on LHS stalk, one way for front then again for rear or other way for just rear - actually quite easy to turn the fogs on by mistake and difficult to decide how to turn them off again....
Wiper stalk - up once for flick, down for intermittent, standard then fast - opposite way to Ford / VAG / BMW / Vauxhall etc
Ford Mondeo 3 / Focus 1:
Pull-pull for main beam - just about every other manufacturer has push for main beam and pull for flash
Cruise controls on steering wheel not illuminated at night - meant hitting the off / restore button by mistake was easy - despite 'braille' type indentations
BMW E91
The soft stalks which either press against a spring or 'click' but don't 'stay' in position - not a problem once you're used to it but confusing to the uninitiated.
Lack of a temperature gauge in a £33K car
LIKES:
Illuminated vent controls on Audis (although now a £150+ option I believe - there's no glovebox light as standard on a £30K A4 these days IIRC).
The push for rear wiper option on Ford / VAG / BMW disliked by another poster....
Auto lights and wipers on my E91 BMW, they were rubbish on my A4 B7 though.
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A pet hat of mine is the climate control in the Audi A3 and TT. Instead of using the simple but effective VW Golf system, they've replaced the rotary controls with controls that look rotary but are in fact toggle switches. Absolutely pointless. Also the text driven Navigation system that Audi use is illogical almost to the point of violence, though you could argue it serves you right for being a cheapskate and not ordering the graphic driven system.
For good ergonomics I think the Mercedes W124 achieved a pinnacle for its time. Brilliantly intuitive automatic gearbox gate without the necessity of a release switch on the lever, idiot proof cruise control operation, and a parking brake with just the right amount of well engineered "clonk" when you release it are examples. Bizarrely I also prefer the big chunky easy to reach electric window switches in the centre console to the ones buried in the door armrests of modern cars.
On my BMW I like the way someone has clearly spent an unhealthy amount of time making sure the operation of all the switches and minor controls is as smooth and pleasant as possible.
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....even the iDrive(!)
Yep. I still think the i-Drive is the best of the current infotainment systems, though it's reaching its usability limits with the internet functions. The latest version has lost something of the minimalist appeal of the original with the presets and the Menu button in case you get lost. I think I'm the only person in the world who liked the "Forced Feedback" control wheel of the original i-Drive as well.
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I liked it - my pet theory it just wasn't suited to right handed UK (RHD) usage. I'm a Southpaw and found it intuitive. A Right handed person in a LHD would find it OK I assume.
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I liked it - my pet theory it just wasn't suited to right handed UK (RHD) usage.
Ah, I hadn't thought of that as my BMWs have been LHD. I can imagine this or any infotainment system is bit of a handful to operate with the left hand - for non-lefthanders obviously!
I guess this is why the original Lexus IS200 had a proper, removable, remote control for the built-in navigation system.
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The Chrysler Cruiser I now have still fairly new (to me) does have one annoying fault. When revved to 4 000 or more ...
4000 rpm, you boy racer. Act your age Mr Lud and keep the revs down.
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2 litres, bit of a lump of a car, redlined at 6500, only way to make it pick up its skirts and scurry a bit, what are you complaining about young man? Want me in the way do yer?
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