09 1.6 Anyone know how to remove the rear seats? - Awed

I am attempting to remove a rear seat from my 2 week old 59-plate Berlingo Multispace VTR. I was a wee bit annoyed to discover that on this model the seats did not clip out as the salesman assured me they would, but ho-hum.

My problem is this: the single seat is held in with 4 bolts, the double seat with 6. Of these, 3 are TORX ("star") bolts which undo easily with a T30 "L" shaped TORX key about 6 inches long. The other bolts - there seems to be no reason for the mix - are some other sort I cannot quite fathom. I *think* they need a 5mm hex key - that kind of fits in (and no other size does, e.g. 5.5mm is too big), but when I press a piece of blu-tack into the bolt head and examine it, the pattern is not quite right - it seems to have very slightly protruding vertical "ridges" along the edges of each side, and a pronounced "dome" shape (or "bowl" really, as the blu-tack is the inverse of the bolt head). It does have 6 sides and the edge-to-edge distance is 5 mm, but I am just not totally sure this really is a hex bolt. However, no other known bolt type ("polydrive", "spline drive", etc., etc) matches either.

Moreover, I cannot budge these suspect hex bolts. I have a long-handled "L" shaped hex key as sturdy as the TORX one which undid the three TORX bolts, but the hex key just grinds round and slips out. I am not sure if this is because they are not meant for a hex key or if it is just that these hex bolts were tightened much more.

Can anyone help? Is this a true hex bolt or something else, and if so, what? How can I budge 'em? Do I need to fork out for a proper torque ratchet and socket + 5mm hex bit? I am concerned that there will not be enough space to fit one of those into the 3" gap between the top of the bolt and the bottom of the seat cover.

I want to be able to remove and replace the seat (occasionally), so I am only interested in being able to undo and redo the bolts, not anything more permanent (angle grinder, plastic explosive, etc.)

Why does it all have to be so hard? Why couldn't they use TORX bolts throughout?


{Header given a less vague title}

Edited by Dynamic Dave on 27/10/2009 at 00:14

09 1.6 Nuts and Bolts! - Awed
Addendum : on second thoughts, I am not sure the weird bolts are not "poly drive" which is also called "ribe" (it appears). The "ridges" don't appear very pronounced, but it's difficult to know how realistic the bolt pattern pictures on the net are and to compare them with the pattern pressed into a blob of blu-tack.

Anyone know how common this type of bolt is on a modern European car, esp. for an application like a seat fastener?
09 1.6 Nuts and Bolts! - steve_earwig
In the absence of anyone who actually knows: I can't see any variation in the parts diagrams, they *should* be the same seats... I can see 4 what look like torx head bolts and 4 what looks to be self-tapping torx heads which are marked "SCREW RLX 4.2x13" whatever that means.

I reckon you need to find that salesman again, give him a slap upside the head and get him to sort you out.