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Ohy es I forgot about that one, Fog lights in the rain. Makes seeing the road even worse!
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"On a busy motorway or dual carriageway, they shouldn't be used at all, particularly in the rain!"
I was driving along the M1 near Luton during the day in heavy rain and dark sky. Kept my distance. Had trouble seeing any lights in the spray ahead. If the fogs dazzle you then you must be too close. I'd rather see the back of a pile up illuminated and stop in time rather than crash into it because of poor visibilty.
Edited by spood on 05/10/2009 at 19:58
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Fog lights in the rain?
I have driven in rain spray so bad that you couldnt see ordinary car lights at 30 metres let alone 100.
They are for use in poor visibllity. Rains spray is poor visiblity.
Edited by Altea Ego on 05/10/2009 at 20:10
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I00 metres is 100 metres but how are we meant to judge it? When I was flying we were required to have a visibilty of 2 miles, for low flying - we used to treat this as 1 mile to the left, one mile to the right = total 2 miles and go flying anyway! Personally I don't mind switching my fogs on and off as often as the changing situation may require it. It is also confusing that, if one can see the sun, the visibilty is about 72 million miles! I often wonder how much effort is put into the siting of fog lights on cars and the design of the beam pattern too.
Edited by Armitage Shanks {p} on 05/10/2009 at 20:11
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100 meters is a lot of gas or electrickery.
Yours (re)
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You shouldn't be driving so fast that your braking distance exceeds your visibility. It doesn't matter if you can see the car in front, or not, as long as you are able to stop. If the motorway is busy you shouldn't have your fog lights on. the glare from fog lights makes it more difficult to judge distance, and masks brake lights. Fog lights should only be on if the visibility is less than 100 yards, and you can't see any headlights in your rear view mirror.
I think it should be made law that a buzzer goes off inside the car when the lights are switched on! I'm convinced they cause more accidents than they prevent.
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100m in fog is difficult to judge, but the distance between each set of the 300yd, 200yd, 100yd motorway slip exit countdown markers is just over 90m, so if the fog is that thick you are driving in seriously reduced visibilty. That doesnt seem to stop other drivers go past me in mist/fog at 80mph with their fog lights blazing. Perhaps if the fog light switch was linked to a 30mph speed limiter in the engine management system, they might not be so quick to turn them on. The best though are those that havent read the handbook properly, driving on a clear night with their fog lights on wondering why their rear window is still steamed up !....
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Perhaps if the fog light switch was linked to a 30mph speed limiter in the engine management system they might not be so quick to turn them on.
I've said this oft times before, though the original idea was postulated by a Mr. Clarkson I believe.
I would also like to see fog light switches be of the type whereby switching off the ignition cancels the switch, so that the next time the main lights are switched on (now on journey home and fog has long since cleared) the driver does not bimble along oblivious to the fact that he's blinding everyone behind him.
If anyone doesn't believe that rear fog lights are a pain on a wet road (assuming visibility has cleared) they should try it from a truck driver's perspective. The damn things reflect off the wet road surface, and if one has to suffer them for any length of time it can give you an unpleasant headache. Unlike a car, you don't often have the opportunity in an HGV to accelerate and overtake the offending vehicle; flashing ones headlights has no effect most of the time since if the driver can't see that he's illuminating the world behind him in red, he's also unlikely to notice a truck flashing his headlamps!
I agree with previous posters that they're largely an irrelevance now, especially since rear lights on modern cars are so much better than they were.
Worst ones are Peugeot 207, centrally mounted in the lower bumper and as bad as those laser pens if you're unlucky enough to be following one.
Edited by Harleyman on 05/10/2009 at 22:34
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This topic has been done to death a thousand times, but still the season is approaching when I shall be sitting in a traffic jam on a misty morning and PING! the driver of the stationary car in front of me will switch their rear fogs on.
I have said before that in an average year of taxi driving, covering 100,000 miles in 12 months, I reckon I used to use the fog lights for a cumulative total of about an hour ;-)
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I wonder if the rear fog light user's ever twig why they get whacked up the back when they brake in heavy traffic....could it be with all those 21W bulbs blinding the poor geezer behind he didn't see the odd brake light?
Truck's done 390K kms now, i'm sure the only time the rear fogs have been on is to test 'em.
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100 metres is approximately the length of a football pitch - used to be 100 yards.
Agree with the use of fog lights normally being very sporadic. Not used mine for several years...:-)
Mind you, at 8 o'clock this morning, on a trip into Liverpool, the number of motorists seen driving with headlights on was remarkable in view of the excellent visibility.
They should have gone to SpecSavers.
Edited by Stuartli on 06/10/2009 at 01:16
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I would also like to see fog light switches be of the type whereby switching off the ignition cancels the switch
Most cars have this now.
Vauxhall work by either switching off the ignition or the lights. Have done for approx the last 10 yrs or so.
Ford work by switching off the lights, as do Pug's & Citroen's.
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What a dreary thread.
Some people get their knickers in a twist because some other people use their front or rear foglights in visibility the twisted knicker blokes think is too good to justify switching them on.
How insufferably, intolerably, despicably, boringly and stupidly faffing and irrelevant.
Narrow your eyes or something, wimps.
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Now cross-refer to post re vitriolic Backroom members!
Edited by Armitage Shanks {p} on 06/10/2009 at 07:05
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I can only presume that you must fall into at least one of two categories.
1. You are one of those people that switch on their fog lights at the first sign of rain, or light mist, and have never questioned why you do it.
2. You don't pay any attention to anything around you when you drive, so seeing beyond the car in front with its fog lights on, doesn't concern, or interest you. You probably never look much further than the end of your bonnet anyway!
I don't think its boring, or irrelevant to be concerned about other peoples mindless, and ill thought out actions, which put other peoples lives in danger.
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I don't object to the correct use of fog lights, be they front rear top bottom or even underneath, when poor visibility renders their use advisable; what I do object to is the retards who forget to switch them off when the fog clears, and don't know what the illuminated symbol on their dashboard means .
If this never affects you I can only assume that you do not drive at night when it's raining.
I would also refer the learned gentleman to the "vitriolic" thread. ;-)
Edited by Harleyman on 06/10/2009 at 09:31
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>>Some people get their knickers in a twist because some other people use their front or rear foglights in visibility the twisted knicker blokes think is too good to justify switching them on. >>
Actually Lud, it's illegal to do so if unnecessary. A lot of the "fog lights on" brigade are doing it for image purposes rather than the intended use of such lights.
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Sorry about the vitriol if it offended anyone. Late at night and so on.
I think my car has fog lights at both ends but I don't know where the switch is. Never use the things.
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Actually Lud it's illegal to do so if unnecessary. A lot of the "fog lights on" brigade are doing it for image purposes rather than the intended use of such lights.
This is one thing I've never got. Why do chavs in their chav motors think that driving around with fog lights on is cool? Are they pretending they are in the World Rally Championship or something???
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Actually Lud, it's illegal to do so if unnecessary.
Tell me about it. My Bentley had a large, single, central foglight, more or less useless like all foglights. Nevertheless once in fog in Somerset late at night I used it. Presently the road plunged into the teacup-shaped depression in the middle of Frome, where owing to the street lights the fog seemed less thick. A young copper stepped into the road right at the bottom there and stopped me. He said my foglight was on. I said I knew it was, there was fog back there on the road but there seemed to be less here. The cheeky little carphound looked me in the eye and said: 'You're not a local man, are you?'
Tsk. Yokels.
(Note: I know I have posted this before).
Edited by Lud on 07/10/2009 at 00:27
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@ LUD
Have a lie down. It'll soon pass off....
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> Ford work by switching off the lights
Hmm, some years ago, I always used to wonder why it was when you saw someone driving along with their rear fogs blazing away, they were invariably driving a Ford Sierra.
Then I drove one. The switch was on/off and not cancelled by the ignition. It had the legally required warning light built into the centre of the circular switch. The switch was carefully positioned so that it was hidden behind the steering wheel rim from the POV of the driver.
To cap it all, since Ford elected to wire the things so that the 21/5w bulbs were side/fog lights and provide a seperate 21w brake light, there was always a moment of uncertainty when you switched lanes and found one in front with bright red lights on the back as to whether it had its fogs left on or it was braking. Nasty.
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They should try it from a truck driver's perspective. The damn things reflect off the wet road surface ... Worst ones are Peugeot 207 ...
Harley - at least if you are driving a truck you are higher above the road. In a car the reflection angle is more glancing, so the glare is stronger if anything.
I think you mean the 206. That central foglight is one of their most noticeable features.
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>> I think you mean the 206. That central foglight is one of their most noticeable features.
If you're old enough to know or remember, Rovers in the 1950s were there before anybody else
www.workingcars.com/media/pictures/photos/Rover%20...g
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To me the first rear fogs in Autumn are the equivalent of the first spring Cuckoo.
Had mine last night on a crystal clear evening. Approaching a junction which is known for drivers changing their mind quickly, slamming on and using a slip road. Car in front pulls across, then I see the car in front of that is braking. I pull out to overtake, car does not pull over but carries on at same speed. I then think the brake lights are stuck on.
Catch up and see they are actually the rear fogs. Very young driver trying to be trendy by using the parking lights/front fogs combination (on a NSL dual carriageway) had also turned on the rear fogs.
I doubt me flashing my rear fogs as I passed actually resulted in the driver doing anything.
I've probably driven over 250,000 miles and had conditions where foglights should be used on no more than a dozen occasions.
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>>I've probably driven over 250 000 miles and had conditions where foglights should be used on no more than a dozen occasions.
Couldn't agree more, my last 9 cars have had front fogs and the number of times I could legally have used them is probably less than 10.
Rear fogs are useful in poor visibility during daylight imho: spray, snow or fog. I have to admit that they rarely seem necessary (to me) at night - maybe ambient lighting level is a factor ?
As an aside, BMWs with the active lighting setup shorten their HID's beam when you switch the fogs on, this caused me to switch them off as I preferred the 'normal' beam pattern.
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Up here in North Yorkshire, I have had numerous occasions where I have been extremely thankful that I have front fog lights fitted. Up on the moors, on roads with no markings (and certainly no cats eyes) I have used the front fogs to be able to see the edge of the road so I can make some sort of progress. Often it is the wider, lower spread which allows me to follow the verge, and keep an eye on the dry stone wall. Main beams just give you complete glare and you can't see a thing.
I probably need them 9 or 10 times a year.
The other times I use them (although less frequently in recent years) is in heavy snow at night, when the large flakes can be very distracting when they show up in main beams. The lower spread from the fogs can make it easier to see what is happening.
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Yes, I think you're right - I used to live in North Yorkshire and always specified front fogs, they're useful for seeing the near side edge of the A172 or A169 etc from memory and you get 'sea frets'.....now I live in the South East there is very little opportunity to use them legally.
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>Perhaps if the fog light switch was linked to a 30mph speed limiter ...
They seem to have worked this out in Germany - fog lights can only be used if the visibility is less than 50m. Further, if the visibility is less than 50m, there is a maximum speed of 50 km/h. Simple really.
BIG
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