this country and how would such a system be arranged. For a start I think the cost would be prohibitive.
There's a huge amount of unaccompanied trailers travel in exactly this way, but i think the number is diminishing.
It should be a cheaper way to operate, as the docks involved are very highly geared up to operate these systems, but its cheaper for the foreign towing truck to travel on our roads, cheaper fuel, no UK road tax (we including our own hauliers pay for the roads for them to use with absolutely no contribution), and lower wages....we even subsidise them by supplying free fresnel lenses in a vain attempt to prevent the subject of this thread....something they should already be doing themselves.
By the way it doesn't mean there's a British driver at the wheel of a home registered truck either.
We've had this argument many times, but the playing field still slopes towards the home goal, and neither this nor the next govt will do anything about it...it doesn't mean votes.
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Why not build HGVs with a steering-wheel in the centre (McLaren style)?
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Hang back or overtake.Oh and get a set of air horns.They might not see me but they'll hear me.
Edited by jc2 on 07/03/2009 at 09:18
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>>......... get a set of air horns.They might not see mebut they'll hear me.
The last thing we need is more car-generated noise pollution. tinyurl.com/aev9r7
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Noise pollution - like this, you mean ? tinyurl.com/dmnysb
I think the use of ear-splitting horns - as a last resort, only to be used in life threatening emergencies, are perfectly reasonable. Better than whipping out a firearm, anyway.
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and side on he looked like any other hgv and i had assumed he was a rhd truck as i couldnt see his plates
But you'd have noticed the RH door bristling with mirrors (one at the very top looking down, two looking back) as opposed to a British truck having the kerbside mirror, well, on the kerb side? My 9 year old daughter often travels in my truck in the holidays, and she can spot LHD trucks using this method before I can.
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I was pulling away from some lights on a roundabout once, in the centre lane.
A LHD artic on my nearside then decided he was in the wrong lane and did a slow speed pit manoeuvre on me. Even then he did not realise that he had hit me. I felt like cork in a jacuzzi. The worst bit was hearing him go up through the gears as he pushed the little white van sideways. On my right I could see all sorts of street furniture heading for me. All I could see through the nearside window was a huge grille with VOLVO written on it. I think he only saw me when he steered right, forcing me up the kerb (and into his view I suppose).
When the Police arrived he accused me of cutting in front of him.
Look, he said, my truck is in this lane..... which of course it was by now.
Luckily there were witnesses and the skidmarks were pretty obvious evidence for Mr Plod.
Have a look at the front of a Volvo F10. It's huge.
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Why not build HGVs with a steering-wheel in the centre (McLaren style)?
Or better yet why not educate the average car driver that a 44 feet unit and trailer combination is slow moving and cumbersome and thus needs to be treated with caution?
Before this starts a flame war and brings the usual tart responses, some perspective. I am a driver of cars for almost 30 years and 3 years ago obtained my Class 1 LGV licence as a sideline for work related matters. I do the odd weekend to keep my hand in so to speak. So I am in the position of seeing it from both sides.
What never ceases to amaze me is the average car drivers approach to large vehicles. An example is cars joining motorways, every time I drive an LGV at some point I am usually forced to slow down by a car entering the motorway who is completely oblivious to the lumbering giant in the slow lane. I can and do move to the middle lane if traffic allows but come on, surely the average driver understands the need to be aware and sympathetic of traffic already on the motorway, especially something that cannot easily move out of the way. Also having seen regular comments on this column how much dislike is published about LGV's daring to use the middle lane, causing great offence to the MLOC, I try to avoid going there. ;-)
I am not chosing sides either but I would say your average truck driver has a better awareness of the road than a car driver, any day of the week.
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They are big. They are driving in a foreign country on the "wrong" side of the road. Ther will be those who disapprove of them being here but for now they are here.
Give them room, drive defensively. It won't avoid all incidents but speaking for myself I try, as much as possible, to keep well away from non-UK trucks. I never come alongside them on their blind side at roundabouts for example. I always hang back.
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Good advice Humph - although on that occasion he was actually stationary at the lights when I pulled up alongside him and was in front of him when we pulled away.
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Must've been scary madux. An elderly aunt of ours was side swiped in similar circs only recently. I don't suppose there was much you could have done to avoid your guy. I just try to keep well away when possible although I accept it is not always practical to do that.
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I just try to keep well away when possible although I accept it isnot always practical to do that.
I have never been so frightened in all my life! I had to take the rest of the day off as I couldn't stop shaking. All I could hear was him changing gear as he pushed me sideways towards a lamp-post........ To add insult to near-injury they docked my pay for going home early.
I think, on reflection, that the only way I could have avoided that shunt was if I had accelerated harder instead of dawdling along.
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Give them room drive defensively.
Good advice Humph, but you're not normal..;)
What i mean is you are not the average car driver who uses their car to go to work, pop to the shops, visit Mum etc.
You are a very high mileage pro car driver, and you see whats happening on the roads daily, so you see and read the road situation as well as any good truck/coach driver, just from a lower seat.
Its not the same for someone who travels 10K a year and probably only a few major trunk road trips a year, they can't be expected to summarise the foreign-ness of every truck they approach, half the time car drivers are just trying to navigate their way around the increasingly congested road and find their way about, they can't really be expected to fine tune progress up the middle lane of a motorway assessing each truck as they approach to forward guess its potential for side swiping them.
I don't have any answers for this problem but i can forsee some govt knee jerk reaction when someone important gets wiped out (thats a deliberately cynical jibe at politicians, not meant at anyone here who rightly regard all of us as equally important), probably along the lines of banning trucks from overtaking or something equally idiotic thereby penalising all for the stupidity of the few...as usual.
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You are a very high mileage pro car driver
Aw shucks GB, you say all the right things.......
;-)
( never claimed to be normal, but that's another story.....) tick tick tick.......
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Dave E, you are missing the point completely, the driver of the truck is supposed to be a pro and should have complete awareness of whats going on around him/herself at any time regardless, and as a pro should be capable of taking all necessary precautions as well as making reasonable safe progress.
Its not a car drivers responsibility to make allowances for the cumbersome nature of a truck, thats the truck drivers sole purpose, if anything the truck driver should expect and be able to respond to anything a car driver is likely to do, many car drivers will not be long term experienced and won't have the foggiest idea what makes a truck tick.
As to the subject of middle lane use, well if more truck drivers used their loaves a bit a were just a little more courteous and restrained and patient and didn't carve so many car drivers up we wouldn't get quite so much flak.
On this forum i believe most anti truck comments have been fair, i post fairly regularly and most regulars here know what i do for a living, i think its pretty well balanced as a rule, and even the most ardent trucky must cringe sometimes at the antics that many truck drivers, British and otherwise get up to on the roads.
As with everything it takes one plonker to undo years of goodwill.
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Its not a car drivers responsibility to make allowances for the cumbersome nature of at truck thats the truck drivers sole purpose if anything the truck driver should expect and be able to respond to anything a car driver is likely to do <<
GB
I thought I gave a balanced view of what was being said. Clearly not, or are you missing the point?
I have to disagree with most of your response. The above quote underlines the ongoing problem on the roads in general. Yes, a professional driver should be aware of what goes on around him on the road and drive accordingly which I think is more or less what I said but that rule applies to ALL road users. You are making excuses for the idiots that drive as thought the road belongs to them and damn anyone who does not get out of the way. That is more akin to the daily dog eat dog traffic conditions on British roads. For me as an occasional trucker and what I see going on in front of me, it never ceases to me amaze me that there are not more accidents involving LGV's and cars. And to repeat, I am on the side of LGV drivers.
ps I don't know what you do for a living, you will have to enlighten me.
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That is more akin tothe daily dog eat dog traffic conditions on British roads.
I drive a car transporter now, have for about twenty years and was on various other haulage for about thirteen or so years before that, that doesn't mean to say i know owt yet, i'm still learning..;)
You've stated the truth in your post, that ''a professional driver should be aware of what goes on around him on the road and drive accordingly''
thats the argument in a nutshell, you just cannot expect the normal car driver to be as competent as a high mileage experienced driver of any vehicle.
You also were correct with ''idiots that drive as though the road belongs to them and damn anyone who does not get out of the way'', to be honest i've seen that type of mentality increasing in truck driving over the years (the foreign truckers have their own standards, some good some not), we really do have to get our own house in order first, throwing stones in glass houses here.
I drive for a living, if i can't do it competently by now i 'need a good kick up in the ****'
that should be said with a fine Irish lilt and is a regular quote from my long departed lovely Mother..;)
Anyone who drives trucks for a living should be competent and safe, its what we do therefore goes with the territory and other roads users have a right to expect good predictable driving practice.
The average car driver is not a pro, their vehicle is just a means to get from A to B, their job or profession could be anything, you can't expect the same degree of expertise that you would expect from someone who covers 75K or more a year and is paid very well for their labours.
I don't expect to be as good at nursing/accountancy/selling as the pro's in those fields, so why should i expect a normal car driver to be so finely attuned to everything happening on the roads.
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The average car driver is not a pro their vehicle is just a means to get from A to B their job or profession could be anything you can't expect the same degree of expertise that you would expect from someone who covers 75K or more a year and is paid very well for their labours. I don't expect to be as good at nursing/accountancy/selling as the pro's in those fields so why should i expect a normal car driver to be so finely attuned to everything happening on the roads.
Agreed to a point GB, BUT.... some car drivers out there should never have got a licence!
as I have said before, I believe that as part of the learning process new drivers should (if possible) be taken out in/on all common types of road transport, or if that is not possible, they should at the very least be shown the differences in operation.
by that I mean visibility, use of available road space etc. either on a video, or inter-actively.
is it really that hard to realise a long vehicle will at times have to use more than one lane to turn?
is it really that hard to realise a fully loaded vehicle isnt as quick as a race car?
I feel the education is lacking and thats where the main problem lies.
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I came across this video yesterday, and was absolutely stunned at the antics and irresponsiblity of this euroclown in his LHD eurotruck. The potential for killing innocents on the road goes without saying.
Any police in here that can point this towards their traffic department. Obviously not done on UK roads, but can't Interpol or someone track this guy down and prosecute him before he kills someone?
tinyurl.com/bf2m9n
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"Anyone who drives trucks for a living should be competent and safe, its what we do therefore goes with the territory and other roads users have a right to expect good predictable driving practice."
And every trucker has the right to expect the same. But you soon learn to treat everyone on the road as a complete numpty if you want to stay safe.
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