Which is better for day to day average use (yearly mileage 6 to 12k miles)?
I don't really understand why people nowadays prefer diesel cars. Except for 4x4s (where huge torque is required from diesel engines), I can't see any good reason for going for diesel (the cars tend to cost more) and parts are expensive as well.
Moderators, if the topic is discussed before please merge this thread. I could find this comparison afer a search.
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You seem to have answered your own question with your obvious dislike for diesels. I'd also think that with your mileage there would not be a financial advantage. I do 40,000 miles per year and then the costs do come into play. I also think that a diesel is more refined at constant motorway speeds because they generally cruise at lower revs than petrol vehicles.
Good Luck
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Petrol is cleaner than diesel ~ if it runs down the pump nozzle or drips onto the ground it just evaporates.
Stepping in the inevitable pool of diesel at the pumps plays havoc with the soles of your Guccis. It then gets transferred onto your car carpets and then onto your house carpets. Who cares about any possible saving in car running costs if your car and house reeks of diesel? I always ask my diesel-freak friends to remove their shoes before they come in our the house. They don't object so they realise it's true.
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L\'escargot.
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Diesels tend to be quieter at cruising speeds, and the sound that there is is of a lower octave, so is less intrusive. Diesels tend to make overtaking easier in my experience. They also don't have ignition problems, fuel trim problems with lambda probes etc... and they don't catch fire as easily.
The exhausts last pretty much forever too. They also make good partners with automatic transmission.
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Diesels quieter at cruising?, been in a Transit?
I reckon diesels are noisey at any speed, only it is the poor so and so outside that hears them, if you are padded up in your plush motor.
Don't forget that to get any decent performance, diesels have to have all kinds of gizmos added. Turbos, intercoolers, fuel heaters, catalytic converters, particulate cleaners ( that need replacing) ,common rail technology that is still giving trouble in places.
So my advice ,is get a diesel if somone else is paying for the car and maintenance, or you do many miles in France, where fuel is one third cheaper.
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Diesels quieter at cruising?, been in a Transit?
A friend's mk4 1.8 Non turbo (!) mk4 Fiesta was perfectly acceptable on the motorway, believe it or not. I was stunned how quiet the thing was. I'm sure it was quiter than my 1.3 of the same mk and year.
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Diesels quieter at cruising?,
Quieter? Not necessarily - they operate under higher pressure than a petrol and won't be quieter than a petrol although because they'll be spinning at least 1,000 rpm or less at cruising speed, they will feel more relaxed but not noticeably quieter. At cruising speed if you're concerened about noise, your choice of tyre will be almost as important as fuel. I've been a big diesel fan for ages but my for latest car I've switched to petrol because the petrol engine version (Octavia 2.0TFSi) is better IMO than the lumpy diesel. If I had wanted to buy an Accord I'd probably have gone for a diesel. Mondeo? Petrol probably. Avensis?Diesel maybe. If you're doing low mileages you'll always feel the inherent vibration in a diesel around town and short journeys (not a bad thing but definitely not as smooth as a petrol) and IMO you'll be better off in a petrol. For the miles you're going to be covering, any fuel saving you make in a diesel (£5 a week) will be outweighed by the much lower costs of buying and slightly lower running costs of a petrol equivalent.
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Can anyone confirm if diesel cars require less frequent gear changes - as they produce huge torque at low RPM?
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Can anyone confirm if diesel cars require less frequent gear changes - as they produce huge torque at low RPM?
Huge torque but the gears are a higher ratio to take advantage. For me it's not su much not having to change gear, it's the fact I can quite happily drive around without exceeding 2000rpm if I want to, but flooring it still results in a very healthy shove from the turbo. 50mpg if I'm sensible, too.
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I've yet to see this "inevitable pool of diesel at the pump". The only place I've seen messy diesel pumps is in a haulage yard, admittedly the lorry refuelling pumps used to be messy on the motorwy service stations, but at normal filling stations the diesel pumps are just as clean as the petrol pumps.
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I always ask my diesel-freak friends to remove their shoes before they come in our the house. They don't object so they realise it's true.
As was drummed in to me to do as a kid and I still do to this day, I expect all visitors to remove their shoes at the front door.
Period!
My Czech wife has introduced another level of this to the household and expects slippers to be worn downstairs (yes, we have visitor's slippers!) and taken off at the foot of the stairs, too. Stocking or bare feet only upstairs, if you please!
Back to the thread; I know exactly what you mean, with a V70 reeking of diesel for this reason just last week.
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I am on my second diesel car and have found it cheaper to run than any petrol car I have had. For a start there is no cam belt, the engines on well maintained diesels last forever and I get 45 mpg from a largish saloon and decent performance too. The local main dealer gives me 40% off labour charges and I get free MOT tests. I do a fair mileage and a full tank seems to last for ages: the downside is diesel fuel smells really grim if you get it on you.
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Good lord! My 306 HDi must be unusual - it has a cam belt! Is it really the only diesel with one?
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re. gear changes, i changed from a 2.0lt petrol nissan to a 1.9pd bora and find i have to change more often. the diesel wont pootle around at low revs (sub 1200) at entrance to open roundabouts
for instance. same higher up the rev range. so effectively working in much narrower power band.
i do however prefer the diesel on the motorway. it will cruise at 80mph on speedo very comfortably
and pull up steep inclines like shap with great gusto, not bad for just 100hp. jag.
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I have one of each at the moment.
If you do mostly slow speed or town driving then, without question, petrol. You can quite happily pootle along in 3rd or 4th down to quite low speeds and thus have to change gears a lot less. My petrol car will quite happily coast along at 30 in 5th.
Whereas the diesel has to be in 3rd at 30mph otherwise the tall gearing will pull you over 30mph. I find that I also have to use the brakes more on a diesel as the drive train, again, tends to pull for longer after easing off the throttle.
I fI were buying a newer car now. It'd be petrol.
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I only bought a Jag S-Type diesel because of road tax & the fact that it's be included in any 4 x 4 type RFL increase. Even then the 2.7 is in RFL Group F in Auto form. Would I have bought a diesel otherwise no. The 3 litre is pretty much the same economy in the real world, sounds nicer & will be long term much cheaper to run. The complexity of the diesel is horrifying, luckily it's under Jag warranty.
Having spent a fortune on a CR diesel before I'd sworn I'd never have another, but the road tax issue is what changed my mind. A goverment just focused on CO emmissions is the cause.
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Modern diesels are fine till they come out of warranty and then you have many expensive parts waiting to go wrong any of which will negate any savings made on fuel.An example would be a mondeo tdci or an 1800 petrol after three years athe petrol will be the much better motor to run no turbos or fancy high pressure pumps etc.
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I have to say I've run three diesels ( a 405 and two Passats) to at least 150,000 miles each, way out of warranty, and have never had a single thing go wrong with an engine, or clutch for that matter.
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I was a confirmed diesel disliker until co car tax made it daft not to at least consider a diesel.
I was really surprised when I drove a couple of VW PD diesels -- I loved the grunt & shove.
My previous car was a Volvo T4 which was very quick and grunty (especially with a mild tweak to the wastegate actuator vac tubing) but terrible economy.
My current Passat is every bit as quick on the road in terms of overtaking ability, motorway maneouvers etc and much more relaxing to drive. It also uses at least 50% less fuel in all conditions.
The only time you're aware of the diesel clatter is at idle, once rolling the Passat is quieter.
Modern cars are expensive full stop if they go wrong, irrespective of the type of fuel they use.
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My experience of 3 diesels over 13 years:
A4TDI, 106 , Yaris.
NO engine problems. Zip.
Easy servicing.
All would chug along in town in 3rd between 10mph and 30mph. And in 4th 23 to 30.
All very quiet above 20mph.. from outside. Inside all very quiet over 5mph.
Exhaust systems last 10 years plus.
Fuel consumption 50mpg (town) -65+ (motorways).
All this scare stuff about complex bits etc.. is carp IF you avoid Mercedes (stuck glowplugs), Ford and PSA (questionable quality at times) and anything Renault..
Generalising posts are of course meaningless.. You cannot generalise and be correct... imo
madf
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And what do you find next to the diesel pump nozzle holder......A petrol pump nozzle holder.
Petrol spillage evaporates......Thats good for the environment too is it
Decide which car you'd like, test drive both engine types and make your choice.
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Petrol vapour is heavier than air so the fumes linger at ground level and soak into the forcourt base causing a risk of ingnition at the flash point level normaly waist height .
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"Petrol vapour is heavier than air so the fumes linger at ground level and soak into the forcourt base causing a risk of ingnition at the flash point level normaly waist height ."
Apart from the bit about petrol vapour being heavier than air, that is total garbage.
We have had lots of P vs D thread on here. There is no right answer - there are die hard petrol fans and die hard diesel fans. For most people however, it's a combination of the right car at the right price, regardless of the fuel - and many don't even notice (witness the number of diesel cars getting filled with petrol).
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RichardW
Is it illogical? It must be Citroen....
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