In today's Metro NW edition there is a story on how dirty number plates can cost you up to £1000 and it is a quote by a Chief Constable. Also he says how one in three motorists are unaware of this rule.
I am one of "middle england" and I can't believe such a penalty which is out of all disproportion to the "offence" and also that a CC takes time to actually talk about it when there are IMHO other more pressing issue like uninsured and untaxed drivers etc.
Is this just me or what do other BRs think?
What next? Sorry sir your car has not been cleaned for a week? That will be £XX. I know I am taking it to extremes but I just wonder sometimes where the priorities are and again this is an example of hammering the honest motorist.
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stevek, I think this is to do with numberplate recognition (speed cameras).
Stu
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There was an article by Adam Nicholson in the Saturday Telegraph a couple of weeks ago on this very subject. Driving his otherwise well maintained but dirty car in a rural area in Sussex for rural purposes he was stopped by police for IIRC a dirty screen or number plate.
That said it appears to have been used solely as an excuse to stop him to look for anything else they could find.
It still worries me because I live in Sussex and I can think of much better areas for the police to be directing their efforts
Wasn't there a case recently when some one was done for not have filled his screen washer?
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Hmmm....£1000 fine or spend 20 seconds on your plates with a sponge provided by your local filling station when you're next there.
Agree it's an OTT punishment but the powers that be won't let some dirt get in the way of cameras and ANPR.
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Firstly, I can think where words of warning are given regarding an empty washer bottle. Yes, it can be a danger in wintry conditions where the screen can become quickly coated in salt and seriously reduce vision, but if you can be given 14 days to fix a problem on your motor then really strongs words should be enoough.
Secondly, I do believe the number plate penalty to be valid. I know it may sound petty, but how would you feel if your car was hit by someone/a pedestrian was hit by a car/van with an unreadable number plate, therefore stopping any chance you have of tracing the driver. And of course speeding through speed cameras could mean getting away with it.
It's the same for people who tow trailers with a srawled on registration number on the trailer that can only be seen a foot away, or even borrowing your neighbours trailer who still has their number plate on.
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Yup. £1000 for a dirty number plate, or a couple of hundred for a hit and run?
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Well we don't know all the facts here but I'd have no problem being stopped by the police for having obscured plates or windscreen and I'd be able to see their logic in so doing even if it was almost a pretext for something else. The former is illegal and the latter dangerous. Yes, not filling a washer bottle might seem trivial, that is of course until the driver with no ability to clean their windscreen suddenly finds him/herself unable to see out for some reason and has an accident as a result. It's often relatively trivial factors which are the cause of major accidents and when that comes to light at the subsequent inquest everyone then exclaims "oh how stupid, fancy doing that!"
Surely when we're driving cars, flying planes, operating machinery etc. we all have a responsibility to exercise due care. Sadly, it is the failure of some people to do this which requires the sort of legislation we're now referring to. If everyone acted responsibly there'd be no such laws, no fines and no punishments necessary.
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Yes it does seem a bit tough but that is the maximum fine payable not the minimum. We should remember that there are those who deliberately drive around with obscured plates for all sorts of reasons - none worthy! I'd expect a pinch of common sense would be applied in assessing which offenders fell into which category and fines to be levied accordingly. Hence I wouldn't expect someone who'd just driven through a blizzard to be done at all (let alone for £1000) but would think someone caught driving a car with a heavy and obviously well established coating of grime obscuring his/her number plates should be treated more harshly. It is important that number plates are clearly visible for all sorts of reasons and whilst (like me) people may not wash their cars regularly they ought to be checking that their plates (and indeed lights, windows etc.) are relatively clean - that really isn't a very onerous task.
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The article refers to "drivers who do not clean their plates". I understand the comments about deliberately obsured plates and yes there should be appropriate fines.
Its not an onerous task and of course very easy to do.
You do make a good point about lights. Is there a similar penalty for dirty lights?
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Muscovites have been subject to on-the-spot fines for having dirty CARS for many years, and keeping a car clean there in winter can't be easy!
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Its very simple and actually quite sensible. The police are getting hot - very hot - on number plates. Type style, conforming to regulations, cleanliness etc. - Why? Because Automatic Number Plate Recognition cameras are sprouting up like weeds. Ok some is for speed (like specs) some for congestion charging - but mainly to catch quote
"other more pressing issue like uninsured and untaxed drivers etc."
Thats why more and more people are using nice clean regulation CLONED plates.
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... The police are getting hot - very hot - on number plates ...
Yup, it certainly seems so around here.
I have two neighbours with personalised plates that spell their name ('ish, in a contrived way), and both of them have reverted to the correct font and spacing in the last few weeks.
It strikes me that this is not coincidence.
BTW, I was working with an American colleague two weeks ago, who asked me to explain the various number plates formats that she could see (ie pre and post the change of a few years ago).
When I explained, including that under the XXX 999X and X999 XXX systems, we couldn't even use I, O, Q, U, and Z, for clarity reasons, she said that it all seemed far to complex to her. She couldn't see why we don't simply allow people to spend the equivalent of the US$50 that she did, and choose any plate they like up to so many characters in length, that a standards committe has approved as being non-offensive. Her plate is exactly her first name, gap, and surname initial, all letters, no numbers.
My opinion is that this is pathetic vanity, but it does seem that with ANPR and other tools, having to build the intelligence in to a sequence of digits plate that we do (year and location) in order to track someone down is archaic?
Sure, enforce sizing and fonts like the end of the world depends on it, but perhaps allowing 'real words' might actually help people remember the hit and run car?
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The police were very keen to retain a date-based number plate when the subject came up for review prior to introduction of the 51 plates.
Their argument was that vehicles are often used in crimes, and witnesses usually tell them the year letter and the vehicle type. We are so used to the format that, it seems, we see that first and remember it easily and reliably. So when the police are asked to find the black S-plate Subaru it actually thins the field of potential cars enough to help.
If we allowed a free for all in choice of plates then, yes, some would be a lot more distinctive and memorable IF you had time to read them in full. However, offenders might avoid such plates and choose an obscure one - try remembering that when they speed past. Even a quick glance will tell you the year identifier.
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I was somewhat bemused to see a numberplate (single digit) + DONNA in a cash&carry car park on Monday.
Wonder how long before Donna gets a tug?
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Wonder how long before Donna gets a tug?
Shouldn't this be in the Haynes Manual thread? ;o)
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In today's Metro NW edition there is a story on how dirty number plates can cost you up to £1000 and it is a quote by a Chief Constable.
This is a quote from Richard Brunstrom CC N Wales in case anyone didn't know.
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I thought this thread was related to the thread on the new Haynes manual.
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Since I put my first pencil on the Note Book dirty and obscure number plates has been an offence and thats going back some.
The fine mentioned (level 3 on the standard scale) is the maximum that can be imposed and when have you heard that being awarded?
...and yes Stevek, lights on motor vehicles ahve to be mainatianed in good working order and CLEAN.
DVD
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Just like the poor motorcyclist who\'re persecuted for having tinted visors (which cut down summer sun glare amazingly as do sunglasses) The Police will go en masse to the countryside and stop them and use an expensive densitometer to measure the transmissive properties of the visor, then BANG, you\'re nicked you tax paying scum minding you\'re own businees and enjoying yourself........meanwhile in suburbia, unlimited numbers of criminals commit the most heinous crimes which are now seen as just one of those things and all sorts of excuses are made for them.... Yuk.
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Sorry ST and those of you ilk, but I am begining to find your postings highly offensive
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Edited. I agree it went beyond the point of being acceptable in its original form.
If anyone still finds ST's post offensive in its revised form I suggest they vote with their feet. Mark, Dave and I will moderate, but we won't be responsible for removing all debate that causes upset.
I should add that this isn't aimed at anyone in particular. I've noted a small increase in the number of "please sir, x was being naughty, well, not naughty, but I got upset and I'm ever so sensitive" threads and want to nip them in the bud.
No fighting.
Marbles will be returned to contestants at the end of each match.
If you break someone else's action man, you replace it.
Anyone found to have baked their conkers is barred.
Er, should I put that last one in the Haynes thread?
No Dosh
mailto:Alan_moderator@honestjohn.co.uk
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Thanks ND that was all that was needed. A difficult task performed with great aplomb again.
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Thanks HXJ, much appreciated.
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8< SNIP!! 8<
Longdriver, any more outbursts like that, or inapropriate language, and you\'re out.
DD, BR Moderator.
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Wether we like all this motoring legislation or not the fact remains that if we as drivers obeyed the laws of motoring to the letter very soon the speed cameras would go as no fines could be issued: traffic cops would spend their days playing golf and magistrates would have to spend their time wondering why the courts were empty. So fight back, clean your plates, avoid bus lanes, park legally and get all the wardens made redundant, obey speed limits etc etc
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... The police are getting hot - very hot - on number plates ...
To which I replied...
"Yup, it certainly seems so around here.
I have two neighbours with personalised plates that spell their name ('ish, in a contrived way), and both of them have reverted to the correct font and spacing in the last few weeks.
It strikes me that this is not coincidence."
Well...
Believe it or not, after two legal weeks, one of the aforementioned neighbours has just reverted to his original, illegal, set!
Either he's very brave in sticking up a metaphorical two fingers to the Establishment, or he's just plain dumb. Perhaps both?!
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...or he's now got the MOT certificate...
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...or he's now got the MOT certificate...
Thought of that, smokie, but the car is (or was until the new plates were fitted) a 52 Celica.
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Are we gonna have new motors coming out with little wiper blades and washer jets on the number plates next then ?
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No, we'll have rfid chips.
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