Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - halmereincarnated

Just after advice on the cambelt change please. £700 at main dealer. Is it worth the risk of letting a mainstream garage do it to save some money. And what should they actually change. Belt, pulleys, water pump? Thanks.

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - Bromptonaut

I think I'd want this sort of work done by a franchise or at least a VAG specialist.

As to what they change, that will be engine type dependent. I'd certainly expect pulleys, tensioners etc to be changed. If the water pump is driven by the cambelt that too.

On my 2016 1.2 petrol Fabia the pump is apparently on the back of the engine.

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - thunderbird

Just after advice on the cambelt change please. £700 at main dealer. Is it worth the risk of letting a mainstream garage do it to save some money.

When we bought our 2018 Fabia 1.0 TSi (same engine as Audi built in the same factory - Audi simply add an "F") we were told it was 3 years 30,000 mile interval which seemed crazy, our previous Focus models that had belts were 10 years or 100,000 miles. So I dropped an e-mail to Skoda and they replied

we recommend the cam belt is first checked at 60,000 miles, and every 20,000 miles thereafter. If there is no damage at these points the cambelt will not need changing. If the belt is not changed, regardless of condition, it must be replaced at 120,000 miles or when the vehicle is 5 years old, whichever comes first.

Based on that your belt is due on time (ours will be due next year) and if we still have the car I will be getting it done. It might not be at a Skoda garage, I will check the price at other VAG group garages, they can all do the job correctly with VAG parts and all give a 5 year warranty, try getting that from a local garage

Have looked and VW charge £699 including tensioner, Seat charge £539 for a cambelt "kit" fitted (I would expect this includes the tensioner) a water pump is another £100 but I believe its not strictly needed on these engines due to its location.

I suggest you ring round but looking at those figures our Skoda may be going to a Seat garage unless Skoda prices are similar. It would not be going to Audi or VW.

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - elekie&a/c doctor

These late model Vag engines need a specific electronic tool that enables the belt tension to be set up correctly through the diagnostic equipment. It's not cheap, over £1k. If you decide to have the job done outside the Vag network, you will need to find a good indy that has this kit.

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - pd

I really don't understand why any manufacturer thinks designing an engine in this day and age with a cambelt which lasts 5 years or 30k is remotely acceptable.

The rest of the industry has gone the other way with intervals which pretty much last the life of the car.

What's VAG's problem?

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - halmereincarnated
The car’s done 30,000 miles. I think the recommended change interval is 75,000 miles or five years whichever comes sooner.

Edited by halmereincarnated on 30/01/2022 at 20:35

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - John F

We recommend the cam belt is first checked at 60,000 miles, and every 20,000 miles thereafter. If there is no damage at these points the cambelt will not need changing. If the belt is not changed, regardless of condition, it must be replaced at 120,000 miles or when the vehicle is 5 years old, whichever comes first.

Five years is a ridiculously short interval. I can think of no scientific reason for this. It's the same sharp practice advice as 'change the oil after 365 days whatever the mileage'. Modern aramid drive belts, especially those which do very little work, hardly deteriorate at all with use and age. Even old belts from the last century last well - the ancient fan/alternator belt in my TR7 still does its job after 42 years.

Are VW in cahoots with all their distributors in recommending expensive unnecessary work, or is this just in the UK? As said, Ford advise a precautionary change at ten years/100,000 miles for equipment designed to last the life of the car. Our Focus belts and pulleys are still going strong at 21yrs and 162,000 miles.

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - Xileno

If people didn't buy them and gave this specific reason, the message would soon get back to the manufacturers.

Short belt intervals are not such an issue aside from the inconvenience if the belt change is quick and easy. Years ago we had an old Escort (one of the first FWD models) and I think the interval was 36000 but it was really easy to do.

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - brum

As Thunderbird rightly points out, the official VAG factory servicing recommendation for EA211 series engines is an inspection regime commencing at 5yrs or 60,000 miles. This recommendation is followed by everyone in Europe except the UK dealer networks. I suspect UK VW financial services may be behind this gouging scheme, maybe on the flimsy grounds of liability and historical reasons e.g. the poor design and application of the PD engine cambelt drive.

Problem is finding a franchised dealer who is willing to do the inspection and record it on the service record. Its not a difficult or time consuming operation, and is clearly defined step by step in the workshop manual, should take no more than 30 minutes.

EA211 has clever cambelt sproket geometry that significantly reduction tension variations as valves open and close, and the belts are generously dimensioned and use the latest wear resistant materials and construction.

I follow this subject closely on forums as I have a 1.4Tsi CZEA engine. After having personally suffered twice with the poor design of timing chain drive in previous EA111 engines

In the 10 or so years that EA211 has been out, I have not read of any EA211 cambelt failure due to not changing at the UK recommended dealer interval.

The only associated problem I am aware of, affects mainly early 1.0tsi and 1.2tsi EA211 engines up to around 2015 . They were fitted with variable input camshaft timing pulleys with bolts prone to coming undone, leaking oil, contaminating the belt and eventually the (rear side) loose bolts in question caught on the head, seizing the drive and snapping the belt. This was happening at low mileages, and well before 5 years. Subject of a service campaign, which some dealers don't bother carrying out, and cars outside the dealer network don't ever get done. Its a disgusting situation that VAG service campaigns are kept secret from the consumer, and they are never classed as recalls. In fact many dealers are under instruction not to divulge or even admit these campaigns exist.

Edited by brum on 30/01/2022 at 13:16

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - thunderbird

In the big scheme of things a cam belt change is a tiny cost over the lifetime of a car. If it needs changing every 5 years and the car lasts 14 years 364 days that is only 2 changes. At todays cost for a 1.0 TSi that is about £1200.

Over those same 14 years, 164 days doing about 8,000 miles a year it will want insuring 14 times @ about £300 a year, total £4200, it will want VED 14 times @ £155, total £2170, it will want 14 services and 11 MOT’s, total must be in the region of £3,500 at an Indy. Over those 120,000 miles its going to need 3 new stes of tyres (if you can get 30,000 out of a set) @ £300 a set, total £900. And then there is petrol, at 50mpg and £6.50 a gallon you are going to spend £15,600. That little lot comes to almost £26,500.

And you lot resent paying another £1,200 to ensure you don’t wreck the engine.

But to keep it in perspective, if I keep our Fabia to its 10th birthday (unlikely) it will actually only need one cam belt change.

What I cannot understand is why do people not research before buying. I had the e-mail from Skoda before I signed thus I knew what it was going to cost, if I had been unhappy I would have gone elsewhere. No surprises for me. Before we bought the Fabia we were considering a Rio, that was until we saw the eye watering service costs. It might have had a cam chain but the cost over 5 years (our intended ownership period) was way higher even if you bought the supposedly good value service plan.

The only associated problem I am aware of, affects mainly early 1.0tsi and 1.2tsi EA211 engines up to around 2015

I thought the 1.0 TSi was introduced when the Polo/Fabia/Ibiza were updated in about 2016. Before that those cars used the 1.2 TSi. The Golf, Leon etc got the 1.0 TSi in place of the 1.2 TSi slightly later I think.

Since the mid 80's I have only had to replace the cam belt on 2 cars and they were carried out at the specified time. The first was on a Golf TDi after 6 years/75,000 miles and a Focus after 100,000 miles (just over 9 years). Both belts looked fine but the dam tensioner pulley on the Focus had loads of play in the bearing and knowing my luck would have failed soon after 100,000 miles and written off the engine, money well spent.

I have only known 3 cams belts break and 2 of those were on cars owned by the same chap. First was on a late 70's Audi 80 and the second on a Cortina 1.6, no damage done to either engine. The third was on a 1.4 Mk 3 Escort that belonged to friends of my parents, it let go at 30,000 miles and wrecked the top end of the engine.

Do your research.

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - halmereincarnated
Yeah I did my research and just wanted some advice on the best way to get the job done thanks.
Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - John F

I have only known 3 cams belts break .......First was on a late 70's Audi 80 and the second on a Cortina 1.6, no damage done to either engine. The third was on a 1.4 Mk 3 Escort that belonged to friends of my parents, it let go at 30,000 miles and wrecked the top end of the engine.

Do your research.

Research on last century cars is irrelevant. If you confine the research to cars made since 2000 there are very few examples of belt failure, unless there is rare failure of equipment it drives, e.g. cam sprocket bolts working loose and causing the sprocket to jam, causing the belt to snap. Modern aramid belts are now so strong and durable that they are even used to drive powerful motorbikes instead of chains.

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - SLO76
You’re technically right John, it’s very rare for a modern belt to fail on its own, it’s usually a tensioner or a pulley or perhaps the ancillary belt being thrown into its path via failure of its tensioner. That’s why we change tensioners and the water pump as a matter of course with most cars to avoid said failure killing the engine. You could risk it and through regularly lifting the bonnet to look and listen for signs of impending failures but 99% of drivers don’t want to do this nor are the able to spot the signs. But for the overwhelming bulk of owners spending £400-£500 every 5-10yrs is a small price to pay to safeguard against engine destruction.

You are however wrong to suggest that timing belt failure is uncommon since 2000. It’s still a very regular killer of older and neglected cars, particularly with Renault and PSA engines plus Vauxhall VVT petrols. The D5 Volvo I’ve just offloaded is known for belt failure via ancillary belt tensioner failing and throwing the aux belt which can if you’re unfortunate get caught in the timing belt, throwing it and destroying your very expensive to replace motor. Right on a technicality, it’s almost always a tensioner rather than the belt but to suggest timing belts don’t need replaced on or close to schedule is simply wrong. I’ve seen plenty of ruined cars over the years caused by owners either not knowing about changing it or who simply refuse to pay for it.
Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - edlithgow

The only associated problem I am aware of, affects mainly early 1.0tsi and 1.2tsi EA211 engines up to around 2015 . They were fitted with variable input camshaft timing pulleys with bolts prone to coming undone, leaking oil, contaminating the belt and eventually the (rear side) loose bolts in question caught on the head, seizing the drive and snapping the belt. This was happening at low mileages, and well before 5 years. Subject of a service campaign, which some dealers don't bother getting done

A job for some Loctite?

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - SLO76
I tend to err on the side of caution typically but even I wouldn’t be changing a timing belt at 30,000 miles. I accept it’s on its 5yr interval based on age but with such a low mileage I’d leave it well alone. These aren’t prone to chewing through belts and tensioners. Leave it another couple of years and 20,000 miles if you even plan on keeping the car that long.

If you absolutely must do the job then forget the laughable £700 main dealer quote and find a decent local VAG specialist who’ll do it much cheaper or ask your local VW, Seat or Skoda dealer to quote. They’ll be well versed on doing this job on this engine as it’s widely shared between the brands, they’ll also have any required tools. Last time I had it done it cost £500 at my VW dealer on our 1.2 TDi Polo and that included the water pump and a 5yr guarantee.

Edited by SLO76 on 30/01/2022 at 21:11

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - brum

Last time I had it done it cost £500 at my VW dealer on our 1.2 TDi Polo and that included the water pump and a 5yr guarantee.

5 yr guarantee? I very much doubt it. The standard VAG maintenance/repair warranty is 2 year parts/labour with unlimited mileage if genuine parts are used. However if you will probably find this does not include consequential loss. Ok if its a duff water pump, useless if the cambelt or tensioner goes.

Dealers are also able to exclude warranty on certain repairs, provided they inform you before hand.

Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - SLO76
“ 5 yr guarantee? I very much doubt it.”

Doubt it all you want, that won’t change the facts. VW were at the time (I’ve no idea if they still are) offering a 5yr warranty on timing belts and related parts should one they’ve fitted fail. The cost difference between our local main dealer and the nearest specialist was marginal and this warranty plus the fact the dealer were using VW parts made it a no brainer.
Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - halmereincarnated
I’m pretty sure my lad’s 1.0 litre Civic will cost him in the region of £1,400 if he has the cam belt changed at six years old at a Honda dealer.
Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - SLO76
I’m pretty sure my lad’s 1.0 litre Civic will cost him in the region of £1,400 if he has the cam belt changed at six years old at a Honda dealer.

One belt design which will be tested to the limit as no sane person or selling dealer would ever fork out such an amount. It’ll be interesting to see how many if any of these survive into their dotage.
Audi A1 Sportback 1.0 tfsi - 5 year cam belt change at 30,000 miles - thunderbird

and a 5yr guarantee

As I said above the work is still covered by a 5 year warranty parts and labour. But the T & C's clearly state the car has to be maintained to the manufacturers schedule during that period and proof must be provided in the event of a claim.

But for the overwhelming bulk of owners spending £400-£500 every 5-10yrs is a small price to pay to safeguard against engine destruction.

Exactly what I said above.

it’s almost always a tensioner rather than the belt

As I wrote above that was our experience with the Mk1 Focus 1.8 after 100,000 miles. If we had worked on JohnF principles the tensioner would probably have failed soon after and totalled the engine. Ours was making no noises so we did not suspect we had impending doom coming along soon.