Twice in the last month I have been in lane 1 when someone on the hard hard shoulder doing about 20 mph indicates and then moves to lane 1. Isn't this illegal (as well as very dangerous)?
I find that rapidly decelerating from 70 mph to 30 mph puts me at risk of a rear end shunt by an exhaust sniffer.
Seems the more I drive the more I take into account the stupid things others might do.
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If you ever get pulled the coppers tell you to get up a decent speed before re-joining the carriageway. They really should get up to a similar speed as traffic already in Lane 1 before joining. However it seems that in this country, because you use indicators yo automatically have right of way.
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"Seems the more I drive the more I take into account the stupid things others might do".
That's called experience!
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I remember nearly suffereing a heart attack... at age 16. Mum pulled onto the M6, southbound, night time, coming back from the Lakes. Fast flowing stretch. She was doing no more than about 30 and didn't even accelerate hard. She scares me.
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Not as much as she scared me...
Regards
John R
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Better still we only stopped to read the map... and she tells me off for speeding! Heh.
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Our local motorway system is a farce.
There is one particular on ramp which is a left hand turn, onto a ramp, which rthen turns through 180 degrees into the RIGHT hand lane of the motorway... just at the end of a 6 km stretch where everybody habitually does 140km/h.
Lovely.
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Apparent the 'law' in the UK is that traffic joining the motorway has right of way over traffic already on the motorway!
The number of times I have seen cars, coaches and especially hgv's just pull onto the motorway despite me not being able to pull into lane 2 because there is already another vehicle alongside, is frightening.
It is the way irresponsible people drive on joining the motorway which I think tends to encourage others to stay in lane 2 especiallywhen coming up to junctions.
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Watcher,
Just realised I do exactly what you describe - on a clear motorway I pull into lane 2 when approaching a joining slip road to give the traffic thereon (real word?probably not) a chance to merge with the motorway & not me. But don't confuse this with lane hogging - I don't drive out regardless and pull back in when appropriate.
I always give anything on the hard shoulder a wide berth in case they either pull out or someone stumbles into lane 1 and over my bonnet.
It's another one of those things that the driving test doesn't cover but becomes a defensive habit after a while.
Lee.
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Just realised I do exactly what you describe - on a clear motorway I pull into lane 2 when approaching a joining slip road to give the traffic thereon a chance to merge.. ....don't confuse this with lane hogging
One of a whole host of reasons for being "unnecessarily" in lane two:
The traffic in lane one travelling at the same speed as you, despite not indicating, is about to use it as a deceleration lane for the upcoming off ramp.
There is no traffic in lane one because it has all pulled off on the off ramp.......which 99% of the time means you are about to merge with traffic pulling on at the upcoming on ramp.
The inside lane has disintegrated due to the motorway being long past its use by date, but it's still not received any maintenance.
And off the motorway:
The inside lane is like a roller-coaster due to the roots of the trees lining it.
A kid is more likely to throw themselves under your wheels from behind one of the trees, than from behind a blade of grass on the central reservation.
You are giving cyclists using the road, rather than the no expense spared cyclepath, sufficient room to fall over without providing you with a new bonnet mascot.
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>> Just realised I do exactly what you describe - on a clear >> motorway I pull into lane 2 when approaching a joining >> slip road to give the traffic thereon a chance to merge.. >> ....don't confuse this with lane hogging One of a whole host of reasons for being "unnecessarily" in lane two:
Sorry Bogush but NO!
Lee is quite right and it is absolutely the considerate and safe thing to do, on a relatively empty motorway, to move to lane 2 to allow joiners to pull out safely.
This isn't unnecessary.
It takes about a few hundred yards.
If the motorway's quiet enough, you don't even need to pull out until you KNOW there is an approaching joiner.
What is unnecessary is sitting in lane 1 arrogantly blocking it, making joiners stop. The most dangerous possible think to do is to attempt to join a m/way after an arrogant lane 1 hogger has made you stop on the hard shoulder. It's happened to me! (Not for a long while, I'm glad to say). And it happens all the more to cautious, less experienced, drivers in less powerful cars who can't easily judge whether there is enough gap in the lane 1 traffic to get in.
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Sorry Bogush but NO! Lee is quite right and it is absolutely the considerate and safe thing to do,
Errrrrmmmmmmmmmmmmm
I was agreeing with him.
This isn't unnecessary.
I said "unnecessary", not unnecessary.
So it's true: nobody ever reads any any of my posts!:-(
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>> Sorry Bogush but NO! >> >> Lee is quite right and it is absolutely the considerate and >> safe thing to do, Errrrrmmmmmmmmmmmmm I was agreeing with him. >> This isn't unnecessary. I said "unnecessary", not unnecessary. So it's true: nobody ever reads any any of my posts!:-(
I'm not sorry this time ... They do read your posts (when they are making some sort of point) but if you are going to say black is white ...
How in the world can repeating Lee's point and saying "One of a whole host of reasons for being "unnecessarily" in lane two: ..."
NO IT ISN'T one of a whole host of reasons for unnecessarily being in lane two.
It's not even a reason for "unnecessarily" being in lane two - whatever the quotation marks are meant to mean.
It's a PERFECTLY GOOD reason for being in lane two.
All the other reasons you list are genuinely unnecessary (as well as "unnecessary" with its unnecessary quotation marks (!)), and there is no connection between them and Lee's proposal.
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I'm not sorry this time ... They do read your posts (when they are making some sort of point) but if you are going to say black is white ... How in the world can repeating Lee's point and saying "One of a whole host of reasons for being "unnecessarily" in lane two: ..."
The quotation marks imply that you can't take the word literally and out of context.
The word was used because many (most) people (here) think that if you are in lane 2 and lane 1 is empty you are in it unnecessarily.
I used the word, but put it in quotes, because I disagree.
Which implies that I agree with Lee.
If you bothered to read the rest of the post you would see that it contained a list of examples that reinforced this point.
Comprende?
Having (re?)read my post you now say:
NO IT ISN'T one of a whole host of reasons for unnecessarily being in lane two. It's not even a reason for "unnecessarily" being in lane two - whatever the quotation marks are meant to mean.
I've just explained, though I would have thought it would have been self evident.
It's a PERFECTLY GOOD reason for being in lane two. All the other reasons you list are genuinely unnecessary (as well as "unnecessary" with its unnecessary quotation marks (!))
Right, let me see if I understand you here:
You are saying that it is genuinely unnecessary to stay in lane two if you are in it on the approach to a junction (between the off and on slips).
So you are saying that if you are in lane two at that point you should pull into lane one, as you disagree with me.
Then, as you agree with Lee, you should pull back out again.
Not much of a problem on a genuinely empty motorway, except for all the additional wear and tear on your car and the road from all the changes in loading, and the minor potential for an accident from that, or a deterioration in the road surface.
Of course if you missed that bike while you were weaving in and out like someone on a dodgem ride.......
and there is no connection between them and Lee's proposal.
So there's no connection between that and Lee's proposal.
I can do no more than bow to your greater grasp of logic.
As for the rest of my "unneccesary" proposals, lets just clarify a few points.
If you were driving along on an otherwise empty single carriageway and were about to pass a wobbling cycle, would you:
a) keep tight to your kerb?
b) keep central to your lane?
c) keep right over to the centre line?
d) straddle the centre line?
e) move over to the (empty) opposing lane as you pass?
And if you were on a single carriageway in a residential area lined with houses, parked cars or trees on your left, but nothing on your right, and the opposing lane was empty, what would your answers be?
So, as usual, I'm wrong.
Well, if you say so.
Different safety rules obviously apply to dual carriageways:
Despite the fact that you know there's not going to be a car coming the other way in the other lane and there's nothing coming up behind, you should stay in the left hand lane, tight up to the trees, cyclists and kids.
You know it makes sense!
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I had similar experience to MarkyMarkD recently - large HGV blocking my passage onto M40 and seemed to deliberately prevent me from joining by closing in on vehicle ahead of him. I had to move forward onto hard shoulder. I gave him - to my utter shame - a rude handsignal and a horn blast (that'll teach him) and he stopped his wagon to sort it out with me (fisticuffs I presumed) and then got out came to my window (M'way was stopped anyway) to tell me that I should read the Highway Code.
Nice coming from a man who leaves his cab unattended on the M'way to rant and rave at me through car window in front of my children!
I took his works phone number from the cab door and he didnt like that. I haven't told them about it though, not my style.
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I think that one of the biggest pieces of driver education that needs to take place (and I'm not criticising you Tony), is that people joining a motorway from a slip road don't seem to appreciate that it necessary to ADJUST their speed to ensure it is safe to join - sometimes this means that it will be necessary to slow down slightly as you approcah the entry point to enable a safe and clean merge. The vast majority of people assume they must go accelerate in order to merge in. As in your case Tony, this took you to a point where there was no safe entry gap. Slowing would have enabled you to slide in behind the lorry.
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There are NO plans to amend or rescind Rule 233 of HC.
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A similar thing happened to me this morning joining the M62 at J23 going West. The car in front was doing about 45 and slowed to join, by the time I got onot the motorway I had to go down to about 35 whilst I waited for an HGV to go past. This is just as frustrating.
Bill
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Why be mean. On a motorway you can see the vehicles attempting to join well in advance. This should allow plenty of time to either move into lane 2 or allow sufficient space in front in lane 1 so the cars can join the motorway smoothly. I drive a relatively slow van but often find helpful HGV will deliberately move over to lane 2 to let me on if they can.
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That's the point though! If you are in a van or another hgv they will let you in. If in a family saloon, no such luck. Well, most of the time.
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That's the point though! If you are in a van or another hgv they will let you in. If in a family saloon, no such luck. Well, most of the time.
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Interesting point, watcher. I find that I get treated far better, by van and lorry drivers, when driving my wife's old diesel AX than my own rather more salubrious Laguna. I think there is certainly some inverted snobbery going on.
Near where I live (off the motorway topic now) there's a quarry entrance with its own left-turn lane. The lorries ALWAYS stay in the main road until the last minute - not because they can't get round the corner (because they can) but to let their lorry mates coming the other way turn right in front of them. Very annyoing as a car driver - because I'd let the lorry turning right go anyway and the first lorry hogging two lanes isn't making any difference other than slowing me down even further.
Spose they are so used to car drivers treating them badly that they don't expect any fair treatment.
I also find lorry drivers very appreciative (in the old AX) when I do let them pull out in front of me etc. etc.) Most drivers are human at the end of the day and a little courtesy goes a long way.
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A view from one our Arabian cousins on the joining of free(motorways) as well as other indispensable driving hints:
www.gulf-daily-news.com/arc_Articles.asp?Article=3...3
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Growller,
I don't know how you find the time to get these things up but "doohhh" comes to mind.
Bill :-)
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A large number of those guys seem to have emigrated to London.
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So that's where I was going wrong. Not giving a light horn on the slip road. An excellent link. Leif.
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