Whose illegal privileges do you most envy retgwte, Londoners' or travellers'?
Londoners do stop for people crossing the road on zebra crossings, but only if the people crossing the road seem likely to intersect with their own paths. Otherwise they just get on with it, instead of stopping like bon enfant wallies whenever a pedestrian even looks as if he or she might be thinking of crossing the road, even if the pedestrian couldn't get in front of the car by sprinting as hard as possible.
People in the rest of the country - and it must be admitted some low-grade new arrivals in the metropolis - stop unnecessarily and dangerously in the way described just to show how law-abiding they are, the despicable snivelling provincial carphounds. If I were plod I would run them in for driving without due care and attention.
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Absolutely, you shouldn't have to stop unless they have one foot on the crossing. Nothing more irksome than a gormless pedestrian who uses a zebra crossing as a place to loiter whilst waiting for his girlfriend to come out of a shoe shop.
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They can have all five feet on the crossing, it's only reasonable to stop if you think you are going to run them over or if your temporary presence would cause them to slow their pace for a moment. This last is very unfair, it being so much easier to walk than to drive a car, but it's the law so one has to abide by it more or less.
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I'm only guessing, but there are so many foreign drivers on the roads these days and so many Brits have emigrated to the Spanish sunshine - could it be that foreign driving practices are becoming the norm, and that "our" law abiding nature and courtesy has all been shipped abroad lock, stock and barrel?
In the 18 years I've been living and driving in Spain, I've seen following distances increase, adherence to speed limit signs improve, drinking and driving and accident statistics decrease and overall better roads, better habits and better drivers.
(Not all down to me, of course :-)
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Anybody think that the driving in this country was perfect before (after you Charles, No after you Claude).
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"seems London driving is getting more and more like Milan where lights and road rules are very optional"
Of course, the first thing they teach you in law school is the story of the hapless King Rex. If you introduce laws which society doesn't agree with they will disregard them and the whole legal system.
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nd so many Brits have emigrated to the Spanish sunshine - could it be that foreign driving practices are becoming the norm, and that "our" law abiding nature and courtesy has all been shipped abroad lock, stock and barrel?
Same for France S! The French now routinely stop at zebras, dont tailgate as much, and have respect for speed limits. Not like the good old days, when a (french) zebra was regarded as a parking space, despite the strange paint markings on the road.
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stop if you think you are going to run them over or if your temporary presence would cause them to slow their pace for a moment.
I don't think one should alarm pedestrians by racing a couple of inches in front of their feet by the way. There's a polite distance that is worth observing.
But there is no need whatsoever to go to moronic look-what-a-good-and-thoroughly-stupid-little-pink-fluffy-dice-I-am extremes.
Cough! Choke!
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That's what London driving is like. You try waiting for a pedestrian to finish crossing the other side of the road on a zebra - like wot the law sez - and you'll be pipped and overtaken.
Outside Town, people will wait until the pedestrain has finished crossing.
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- and you'll be pipped and overtaken.
and serve you damn well right for hanging about with your mouth open when there's no longer any need to.
I don't think the law does say you have to do that. Anyway it shouldn't. It says you should give priority to pedestrians on zebra crossings. It doesn't say you have to sit there worshipping their bums until they vanish over the horizon.
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A few months ago (central London), I berated (cos it made me cross) a driver for honking a chap halfway across a zebra- he wasn't far from hitting the pedestrian. He swore at me, and claimed that the chap should have been looking where he was going. When I pointed out that the guy was on a zebra crossing, (nearly halfway) and the driver legally has to give way, he swore again and drove off. Worst part, he was a black cab driver!
Rules are different in London- everyone is so obsessed with making progress that no-one else matters, but I did feel this was a bit much!
:-(
A.
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One drawback (for pedestrians) of the, favoured it seems, just-in-time approach to pedestrians crossing rights - moving off too quickly can indicate to cyclists/bikers behind the road is clear - when in fact, the pedestrian may just have cleared the front-car bumper. I've seen several incidents of this with 2-wheelers when they filter - and this was many years ago when I was a bike courier in the Smoke - it must be even worse now (given what I've read here). So, Woodsman, spare that tree.
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I don't think the law does say you have to do that.
I think it does. I think you'll find that its illegal to move off before the pedestrian has reached the other pavement (or central refuge if its a two part zebra).
And I think you'll find its illegal to overtake the front car in a queue at a zebra (a fair few bikers have been nicked for this one - its legal to filter past all but the lead car).
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illegal to move off before the pedestrian has reached the other pavement (or central refuge if its a two part zebra).
But some drivers stop even when someone thirty yards away on the other side of the road has put a foot on the stripes. No sane policeman would dream of pulling you for technical infringements of this rule, prevalent in London and other places where there is a certain amount going on although obviously not in pudding land. If you frighten the peds or make them run, you are in the wrong. Otherwise, not.
And I think you'll find its illegal to overtake the front car in a queue at a zebra
Only a halfwit would do that, unless the car was stuck there, and then only with extreme caution.
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"And I think you'll find its illegal to overtake the front car in a queue
at a zebra
Only a halfwit would do that, unless the car was stuck there, and then only with extreme caution"
We obviously breed halfwits here: I was half way across a zebra when a car crossed over the solid white centre libne, passed the car waiting and nearly ran me down. He then accelrated away at what must have been 45mph+.
It was a 30mph limit of course.
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at what must have been 45mph+. It was a 30mph limit of course.
Bit of a mimser, then? Glad you escaped intact madf. It's a jungle out there.... :o}
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I did a nipper run with my wife just now, the old jalopy running with unusual sweetness on today's wet air. As we trickled round a corner and across a thronged zebra just off Queensway I told her of this discussion and the apparent legal requirement to wait for the ped to reach the other pavement or central reservation before moving off.
Surely not, she said. They just have to be past you, don't they?
I can state emphatically that she is a much more hesitant, careful and anxious driver than I am, and would never dream of menacing a pedestrian in any way even by accident.
Meanwhile I had managed to insert a corner of the car between two hurrying pedestrians and slip through their constant busy procession. I pointed out to her that London pedestrians understand the need for this as well as drivers do, and simply adjust their pace and direction to go round the car. Only silly out-of-towners or ideologues ever get shirty about it. It's very rare for that to happen.
Just something you learn by osmosis over the years. Actually I find being a pedestrian in the provinces almost as irrritating as being a driver there. The rhythms are all wrong and too bucolic by half.
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Meanwhile I had managed to insert a corner of the car between two hurrying pedestrians and slip through their constant busy procession....
...Just something you learn by osmosis over the years. Actually I find being a pedestrian in the provinces almost as irrritating as being a driver there. The rhythms are all wrong and too bucolic by half.
Yes, it must be tiresome for you city types when you visit us country bumpkins - all that consideration & courtesy by car drivers to pedestrians - even, by Jove! - letting them take their time to cross the road! It's probably because we country dwellers have so much idle time on our hands & can afford to smile limply at any inconvenience - unlike the thrusting go-getting city folk.
Paradoxically, although city dwellers seem to think they have a fast pace of life, they actually tend to have more time to get things done - be it going to work (ample public transport, jobs), buying stuff (many more & closer shopping areas) , or socialising (more & closer venues, higher density of people,handy tube trains etc). In fact I'd say it's generally more difficult to succeed & prosper in the remoter country areas: not so many opportunities, many costs/prices higher, much less economic activity to tap into etc., etc.
If you tried to live in the country, you might understand that 'bucolic' exists only in the Sunday supplement fairy tales the city dwellers read & buy into. No, really it's just an excuse that city dwellers use to justify a rather couldn't-care-less-me-first attitude.
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Oh dear woodbines, I'm afraid my ribbing about pudding land and bucolic got to you... sorry, only teasing.
I thought, too, that I had made it clear that it is possible to cope with the volumes of metropolitan traffic, motorised and pedestrian, with good humour and brisk courtesy, as the great majority do. Volumes are what all this is about, not selfishness or perceived self-image. Stow-on-the-Wold rhythms in much of London would provoke immediate honking gridlock.
I have been a part-time country dweller for much of my life and am well aware that for activity, close timing, rapid despatch, general importance and indeed moral depravity the country is the equal of town in every way.
Er... :o}
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Oh dear woodbines, I'm afraid my ribbing about pudding land and bucolic got to you... sorry, only teasing.
Me too Lud! Being a country dweller, my high horse needs a canter every now & then.
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