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Thanks for the explanation but I thought Skoda had won awards for their cars now and had a good reputation these days ? or am I missing something here?
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I fully expect my Dealer to be rubbish. In deed and thought. Based on experience. Therefore I am quite happy to take all they have to give in the way of advice and testdrives, and then get the car elsewhere.
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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Expectations.
Well ok, I buy a 40k BMW and get reasonable service, nice smile, car cleaned, cup of Kenco and a 2 hour wait. Mother buys a Skoda for less than a quarter of the price, has the car collected and delivered to her home for servicing, sits in her own lounge, drinking her own tea and doesn't feel ripped off. So which is the better service ?
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Now that's a good point. However so is the point above at the risk of sounding like sex in the city.
Do we just have a low expectation of car dealers, which they accept, and therefore will never even try to improve customer service?
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Mark is correct in what he writes, as is Pugugly in highlighting the impact of expectation.
There can however be a difference between receiving the customer service you expected to receive (or not receiving the customer service because you didn't pay for it) and receiving customer care that is plain courtesy or common sense.
A case in point is my experience of Squire Furneaux Volvo in High Wycombe; take my V70 there for service and the job itself will be done to perfection with the car also returned gleaming clean. Of course I will be relieved of a king's ransom in the process, but I expect to pay such a sum, and likewise expect to receive the top class result that I do.
Great customer service.
What I also get though, at all times even when only spending a few quid, is customer care. Someone using their brain and common sense to effect a good result. A case in point: www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?v=e&t=34...4
Great customer care.
Of course it could be argued that thanks to the fees they are able to charge they have invested in hiring good quality, service minded, staff, but I would hope that such behaviour came naturally to anyone in such an industry, not after force feeding or expensive training. If the latter - which plainly is not true - they would be in the wrong job.
Different business, but when I recruit support consultants for my employer in the ERP software industry it is for such natural service minded talent that I look, even if - within reason - I have to invest a little more in other areas to find the right candidate. Thankfully, company policy encourages staff to free-think within common sense boundaries and deliver that plain courtesy; my staff will never work in a call center whilst I'm in charge and equally never will they be menu-driven robots just waiting for the next tea break.
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Good post - if I may say.
From what I am led to believe and have been told however it is not about the staff as much as it is about the owners. From talking to sales people they / some can see the value of good customer service and the part technology plays but it?s a message that does not seem to be shared by those that own the dealerships. This is not a scientific survey I hasten to add.
An example of which is, and I have seen this in action, boardroom table 500 letters 500 envelopes 500 stamps and some poor person has to put all those together and send them to customers. Why when we are living in an age of communication?
Now starting to feel real Carrie Bradshaw like:
Are those at the top just too comfortable?
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I've been in the car business a long time and I have to say I disagree with the 'easy answer' of "expectations". I deal with quite a few franchise outfits - mainly buying spares.
The BMW dealer (part of a very very big chain) are absolutely dreadful and will never go out of their way to help source a part or resolve a query. Their attitude is that they have enough business, they don't need to exert themselves.
The Mercedes dealer used to be brilliant - very helpful and nothing was too much trouble. Then they were 'assimilated' and now they too are unhelpful. Recently I wanted to check that a part I'd bought of them last year (a subframe mount) definitely fitted the vehicle I was working on (a C-class). I gave them a call and quoted the part number. Even though they know I'm a regular customer the parts guy refused to check on the computer for me - they have been told not to help repairers in this way apparently! The VW dealer is almost as bad and I've been involved in a few arguments with them.
On the other hand the local Nissan, Toyota and Mitsi dealers are still helpful and friendly.
If you think good customer service involves a few potted plants, a 'free' cup of coffee and a YTS lad washing your car then you've low expectations. My expectation would be well-trained technicians who diagnose and fix faults first time. I can tell you from the 'inside' that 95% of dealers are hopeless at fault diagnosis. I had a laugh recently when a local main dealer had a fault with a CR Diesel. They were so lacking in ability that they wheeled it round to our local auto-electrician (this is an oldish chap who fixes alternators out the back of his lock-up with the aid of an AVOmeter!). Eventually it made its way to my mate (small independent with a good brain and some Autodiagnos kit) and he sorted it out....
Incidentally I would also disagree with notions that the new car market is particularly 'competitive' or that British people 'won't pay for good service'. Our car prices are still high by world standards and I think we have a right to expect good service at these prices, without having to pay over the odds to secure what should be part of the basic package when spending typically £10k+ on a product.
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It needn't cost much to make the customer feel looked after. I don't know why dealers seem to think that quality customer service should cost them the earth.
Helpful, knowledgable staff to answer queries or find the answer for you. Willingness to try to help you within their constraints. Politeness from the aftercare sales team rather than the sneering after sales manager I have found at a few dealerships. They both command the same salaries, it's just one is rather better at his job.
The Nissan Dealer in Plymouth, while unable to pick my van up from home 20 miles away, will lend me an identical model for up to 10 days foc whilst mine is being repaired. They will do what they feasibly can but I need to help myself as well. I can't complain about that.
H
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It needn't cost much to make the customer feel looked after. I don't know why dealers seem to think that quality customer service should cost them the earth. Helpful, knowledgable staff to answer queries or find the answer for you. Willingness to try to help you within their constraints. Politeness from the aftercare sales team rather than the sneering after sales manager I have found at a few dealerships. They both command the same salaries, it's just one is rather better at his job. The Nissan Dealer in Plymouth, while unable to pick my van up from home 20 miles away, will lend me an identical model for up to 10 days foc whilst mine is being repaired. They will do what they feasibly can but I need to help myself as well. I can't complain about that. H
You're all assuming that 'customer care' is about keeping the customer happy. Its not. Running a dealership is about maximising profit. There have been plenty of nice little dealerships with lots of happy customers that have gone bust or been bought out. Conversely a lot of the big faceless dealership with lousy service are very very profitable.
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Expectations. Well ok, I buy a 40k BMW and get reasonable service, nice smile, car cleaned, cup of Kenco and a 2 hour wait. Mother buys a Skoda for less than a quarter of the price, has the car collected and delivered to her home for servicing, sits in her own lounge, drinking her own tea and doesn't feel ripped off. So which is the better service ?
In this case it sounds like the Skoda dealer is better - period.
However meeting expectatiuons is fundemental in customer service. To extend the point further if both dealers offered the same reasonable service, the same nice smile, an equally well cleaned car, the same cup of Kenco and a similar two hour wait the Skoda dealer would (in general) be perceived to offer the better service because the customer's expectations of the Skoda dealer would be less.
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However meeting expectatiuons is fundemental in customer service. To extend the point further if both dealers offered the same reasonable service, the same nice smile, an equally well cleaned car, the same cup of Kenco and a similar two hour wait the Skoda dealer would (in general) be perceived to offer the better service because the customer's expectations of the Skoda dealer would be less.
Claptrap. Having sold cars to real cutomers myself I can tell you that its fussy old guys and middle aged women who have the highest expectations. They buy a little motor with their own 'scrimped and saved' and expect to be treated like royalty and car to run like a Rolls. I once sold a used Mazda to a middle aged lady who came back moaning and threatening TS and all sorts because the spare had a minor buckle on the rim. Used to get old blokes raising hell because the tape player was sticking on their s/hand Corolla. On the other had you could sell a Merc with a few faults and get top money for it and never see it again.
When it comes to new cars the average thrusting young exec getting his BMW 300-series cares little about cutomer service so long as he gets his hands on the motor. He's unlikely to be paying the bills anyway.
VW, BM get a complaints about CS because often its really rubbish service that they get. Good example (written about it before) - old bloke near me has his Polo serviced by VW agent. Tech forget to refit oil cap properly resulting is MIL light coming on and poor idling. I refit cap. Old bloke rings VW to get MIL light reset and they tell him its not their problem, reset is £70+VAT and he can bring it in a week's time! I got on the phone for him, 'explained' a few things and they did it for free the same day!
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The truth is somewhere in between Aprilla. I buy a 40k car and I feel I have a right to be dealt with humanely, reasonably and with a bit of understanding and that has been the reality at the BMW dealer I use for servicing, I got a good deal from the dealer I bought it from and take it to another dealer who I know is good in CS, they in turn get a huge wedge to service my car for the next xxk miles. BMW meet my expectations in this respect. Skoda dealer services my mother's Y reg Fabia, she is a realist but is genuinley surprised by the quality of customer care that she gets every time she goes to them so they exceed her expectations. Maybe if the BMW Dealer came to collect my car that would exceed my expectations.
By the way when I was there today, I saw their staff deal with a Jaguar owner (an old XJ40 with a dahboard impersontating a disco) who was in the middle of a long journey when the Jag started to misbehave, he obviously called on spec, the staff rolled out the red carpet for him, loads of cofee whilst they diagnosed a faulty sensor and the offer of a hired 3 series to continue his journey for £25.00 whilst they arranged to get a sensor in for him for his return the next day, guess they exceeded his expectation....
I remain optimistic by nature.
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"By the way when I was there today, I saw their staff deal with a Jaguar owner (an old XJ40 with a dahboard impersontating a disco) who was in the middle of a long journey when the Jag started to misbehave, he obviously called on spec, the staff rolled out the red carpet for him, loads of cofee whilst they diagnosed a faulty sensor and the offer of a hired 3 series to continue his journey for £25.00 whilst they arranged to get a sensor in for him for his return the next day, guess they exceeded his expectation...."
Yes, exactly - a welcome example of long-term thinking: there is s good chance that the owner of the elderly XJ will at least consider a BMW from them when the Jaguar expires, probably sooner rather than later.
Of course dealers are there to make a profit, but as with any other business short-term thinking (make a fast buck now and never mind the customer) will eventually lead to the business underachieving or even failing. Sure, you need a good product too, but since there are so many good cars out there now and very few really bad ones, the human element can make all the difference. As an example, a lot of Skodas are bought because the dealers are keener to sell; they then exceed expectations by giving good service, and guess what - the customer comes back in a few years for another Skoda.
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It is not claptrap Aprilia, customer service is all about managing expectations whatever the industry, i.e. reasonably well presented food brought to the table is taken for granted in most restaurants however many people would be impressed if they went into McDonalds and their food was brought to the table on a plate because it would not be expected.
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They somehow manage the concept of 'lifetime customer care' in Thailand (where salespeople do not have to be licensed credit brokers to sell extended warranties etc.) 'Tom', the saleswoman who sold us our car in March 2004, patiently phones when the insurance is due, when the annual tax is due, when an oil change service is due, etc. And if the car gets hit or needs new tyres or something like that, she sees to it too, and gets us a good price. Either she is on some kind of commission for this or she is on a salary calculated by her customer base. Makes a lot of sense because, even though we might be able to save 50,000 baht buying somewhere else next time, we won't out of loyalty to Tom. HJ
Sounds like a very good service though is largely revenue generation so perhaps Tom is more marketing than true customer service.
What this realy demonstrates though is that adding value to the relationship can both benefit the customer (and so engender loyalty) as well as generate revenue, just shows that good service can pay for itself.
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Deep sigh here. I work in "customer services" which I hate writing, as I have a degree in French and it makes me sound like an airhead. : ) However, it's top-end stuff so I believe I can add my tuppence halfpenny to the discussion.
Firstly, let me say that however much people write about employing people who can think for themselves and aren't call centre fodder, basically in real life it works like this: customer calls dealership, doesn't get answer he wants. Customer calls manufacturer, is told the same thing, complains that "customer service isn't what it used to be, and that chap I spoke to was arrogant".
Apparently, the definition of arrogant is "didn't cave in and give customer the moon on a stick".
It's a hiding to nowhere. Luckily I thrive on conflict or else I would have collapsed crying years back. People want to be made to feel good by someone making the right noises... I have a colleague who does this, but then receives letters of complaint when we can't match what she says she will do. I go for the "honest john" approach!!! Maybe not the best, but I DO have a customer base that knows they'll get the truth from me and not just a load of flannel. And, before anyone asks, yes I do care about customers, and yes, car dealers are a bunch of workshy halfwits for the most part.
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As the guy who opened this particular can of worms can I say thank you to all who have contributed so far, very interesting.
The reason for asking the question was as I have just bought a new car I got to chatting with the salesman and had an idea for an online white label marketing tool for dealers so they could build better relations with their customers from the word go.
It would send text and email alerts when the warranty ? Tax ? MOT and the like were due. Full colour newsletters surveys competitions and the like. I was thinking an online marketing and communication tool where most of what it did was automated but branded for the dealer. I thought it might work well for the independent sector as I guess they would realise the importance of staying in touch with their customers by offering a value-added service. Also as a customer I thought it would well for me also.
Fortunately I have a day job so this was / is just an idea at the moment. Trouble is that I am still confused, am I embarking on a solution that dealers don?t see the value or need for?
As Aprilia said
?You're all assuming that 'customer care' is about keeping the customer happy. Its not. Running a dealership is about maximising profit. There have been plenty of nice little dealerships with lots of happy customers that have gone bust or been bought out. Conversely a lot of the big faceless dealership with lousy service are very very profitable.?
Which is an interesting point if that is how most really feel.
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>>It would send text and email alerts when the warranty....
Ah, now that is a different point. From the dealer's point of view that would potentially present a revenue increase which may mean that they would be prepared to pay for it.
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Absolutely, and something dealers may be interested in.
We continually get customer saying "they were really nice until the car was delivered.. I feel like I am just getting in the way now". With the greatest of respect (!) that's what happens when you let salesmen deal with customers after the thrill of the chase has gone... any dealership worth it's salt has a VERY good aftersales manager who is NOT a salesman.
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That was exactly what happened to me as a customer, which is why I had the idea. However if you read this thread do you really think they would get the idea or as was suggested by Aprilia customer service is not required?
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However if you read this thread do you really think they would get the idea ....
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they would get the idea towards the end when your intended message gets somewhat clearer. at the start of the thread, it seems most people were led down the wrong path.
as for crm (customer relationship management) there are plenty of existing software packages, and many manufacturers & dealers are supposed to be using them.
in my own personal case, i always refuse to allow my personal data to be stored on their computers. however, my neighbour has a renault and a bmw and is apparently on their crm data systems. ( i know, because they have both managed to get his address wrong and so i get his leters and reminders for service due, etc. - he says he has asked them to correct the entries but both dealers so far have not deleted the erroneous data. )
anyway, the point is the sosftware and systems are already there. it is a matter of how diligent the dealer staff are in applying it. a google search brings up the following example for hyundai deployed in 2002:
"CUSTOMER SERVICE
? Users can now immediately call up all relevant
information about a customer whenever he or she rings
or writes in. This applies to internal staff and external
agency users because the system is entirely Web-based
? The new system records information about who the
customer spoke to last, his or her vehicle, mailing history,
any previous customer service cases and data protection
preferences
? All calls are now logged
.....
.....
Hyundai has even discovered new uses for the system that it
had not anticipated when it was first deployed. For example,
Hyundai technical experts at RAC, can now access the
CRM system to view and update often complex technical
information about customer service cases. In the past, this
required a great deal of time consuming and costly to-ing
and fro-ing by phone, email and fax. ..."
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I thought the message was pretty clear from the start and either way it?s been very interesting hearing the views of others on this subject. From the small amount of research I have done most CRM packages are controlled by the manufacturers ? somewhere I would also not like my information kept. They are also expensive. As I mentioned I was thinking more for the independent sector ? maybe small to medium size and priced accordingly. Hence the question about the perception of customer service from a dealers point of view. Interesting that you say 'supposed to be using? suggesting that they don?t, any idea why?
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IMHO and experience, dealers and manufacturers often have different CRM packages, Dealers tend to use Kerridge.
Can I ask why you wouldn't like a manufacturer to hold your info? I often hear the reverse "Don't mind you having the info, but don't want pesky salesmen bothering me".
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Well I might be wrong but knowing the way that large organisations share and sell information these days I would have a problem giving it to a manufacturer. My thinking is that if I can?t trust the ?local? dealer with a reputation to loose who has just relieved me of many thousands of pounds then why did I give him the money in the first place.
Also the ?pesky salesman? term this is someone I have just given a lot of money to if he wants to make me a valued customer and give me discounts on stuff in the future then who am I to stop him as it would be in my interest. I am beginning to wonder if the problem here is my perception of customers. Maybe I am one of the few that thinks this would be a good service to offer me, the customer. ;)
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I thought the message was pretty clear from the start
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there you go. read the replies to your first post and see at what point someone twigged that you were seeking comments from dealers interested in putting in software for customer after-care.
illustrates how difficult it is to relate to customers.
p.s. the reason i said "supposed to" is explained by: "you can take a horse to water but can't .... "
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"you can take a horse to water but can't .... " :-) How very true
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Customers: with data protection the way it is now, manufacturers and dealers have to be VERY careful about sharing info. We have a separate data protection sheet for use at events, and we ask people to sign it at any opportunity: that way they CAN'T say we've used their info without permission. And as for the States, Italy and Germany..... believe me, you DO NOT want to do it there. Thay'll sue at the drop of a hat, indeed they would sue the hat manufacturer when the hat dropped off.
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What you might like to do is call Data Protection in this country and just ask them what is required to register. You would assume that if you hold personal information on people on line that you would have to register with data protection. Not so as I discovered, and I have asked the question more than once. Even though as an administrator of a server you technically would have access you are not a data controller therefore it does not apply to you ? mad but true.
The other thing (way off topic) that occurs to me in quite moments is amazon. UK service USA servers and they ship from Jersey (not part of the UK or the EU ? so where is my data stored and if it?s not in the UK I assume that it?s not covered by UK or EU law ? scary. But enough I am getting paranoid and they are watching me now I can tell :-)
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You're probably right, but information is only useful when you use it. As a manufacturer, we use the info for invitations, launch events and the like, which you CAN'T do without consent.
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Sorry, i sounded a bit pompous in my post! Didn't mean to! : )
It's interesting, as someone immersed in CRM, to hear people's views on it.
It's made me think, always a good thing!
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No problem :-)
It's interesting, as someone immersed in CRM, to hear people's views on it.
Interesting - so does it have a place in this discussion small to medium size dealers do you think and do they see it as a tool, threat or just waste of time?
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Sorry - just read your previous post again. Got to learn to slow down ;)
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Depends on the dealer, in my experience. When it comes from the manufacturer, there's a definite resistance, as they tend to have their own systems; salespeople in partic hate change of any kind..... in their defence they DO tend to have excellent in-house systems. But there is a place for OEM systems, I think... especially at the luxury end of the market.
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That?s interesting I would have thought just the opposite. Top end ? money no object I will take ten ? and if they have it down the road make that twenty and I will pay double ;)
Lower end -How much and what can it do for me at that kind of money
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