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The garage cleaned the spark plugs and then did what they called a manual decoke which they explained as revving the engine for a while. They took it out for a test drive and said it was now ok. (done on warranty)
Also they said these engines need to be run with higher revs than normal.
Isn't Shell V-power supposed to prevent coke build-up & clean coke out of an engine ?
What worries me is if it suddenly happens anytime or in any situation unpredictably. When the problem occurs it feels like the brakes come on & off rapidly several times for about 1 second then it runs ok but can then occur again a few hundred revs later during the same acceleration phase, e.g. it hesitates at 1750 rpm and then again 2250 rpm in 4th gear. Image what a nightmare that would be if overtaking something.
To drive around the problem I find that having the revs over 2250 rpm when accelerating firmly there is no hesitation, also using a lighter throttle pressure there is no hesitation at any revs.
I've lost confidence in the car, I mean what's the point of a car when you have to think what it may or may not do every time you press the accelerator ?
I never had this problem when driving a Fiesta with a 1.0 EcoBoost engine and I drive the 2008 on the same roads and in a similar manner. Something is wrong with the Peugeot 2008 130.
Help, what to do ?
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Help, what to do ?
3 things.
Alert Peugeot to the problems. If you decide to reject the car getting your issues recorded ASAP is important.
Go to a different dealer. The dealer you have visited clearly have no idea what to do. Modern engines do not need "higher revs than normal", the man is an idiot. If its sooting up in under 1000 miles there may be a serious issue. There are no wholesale stories of this problem affect the many cars fitted with this engine so it is probably a one off.
But consider this. In about 2004 Shell introduced their first supa dupa petrol that promised better MPG and a cleaner engine. Had a Puma 1.7 at the time and the local garage had a pump so decided to try it for a few weeks. Fill up one said the mpg was better but not enough to cover extra cost of fuel, could not tell any difference in the way it ran. Fill up 2 was exactly the same. Part way through fill up 3 it started to run like a bag of nails. Took out the plugs and they were black so cleaned them and filled tank with regular petrol, normal service resumed and for the next 2 years never missed a beat on regular petrol.
A few weeks later met up with some petrol head mates and conversation turned to supa dupa Shell petrol. One mate with a 2 litre Vectra had tried the petrol and his problems had been exactly the same as mine with the same simple cure.
We bought from different garages in different towns so we could not blame the retailer. Conclusion was our engines, which were both specified by the makers as only requiring 95 RON could not cope with the extra RON or the additives.
Never bought supa dupa petrol of any brand since.
So I suggest you try some normal petrol first.
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Engines produced over 50 years ago did not need decoking at 1000 miles even back when design, fuel, oil, and carburetor fueling and primitive ignition systems were still in the stone age.
You cannot decoke an engine merely by revving it. Its a head strip off and lots of detailesd scraping and manual cleaning with tools and chemicals.
The ops problem sounds like either a fuelling problem, e.g.. a bad injector or sensor/wiring or something more drastic possibly sticking valves.
Either way it requires a professional diagnostic to be carried out by a competent dealer, which clearly is not the case here.
Complain directly to Peugot and remember you can reject the car if they cant fix it after 3 attempts iirc.
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That hesitation around 1800rpm is very common on older Peugeots, its usually a sign the EGR valve is playing up.
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It's an EU requirement that the engine must run on 95RON but some will run better on higher octane.However tell the garage to do the decoke-as a warranty item and then get Peugeot to pay!
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There was also Formula Shell petrol which came out around 1987. This was accompanied by a massive publicity drive with TV adverts.
They claimed more mpg, better performance, cleaner running etc. It sold well for around a month and then lots of engines started to get damaged, if I remember correctly specifically vauxhall engines.
It was soon withdrawn and vanished without a comment.
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Its like reliving a normal day 50 years ago and your dad's 60,000 mile Hillman Minx is starting to pink.
No son i've been using Redex and twice been down to the main road and put 5 star in, still rattling...well dad no option for it but the head'll have to come off, still got some grinding paste from when uncle Harry's Corsair needed a decoke...righto lad this weekend we'll get stuck in i'll get a decoke gasket set from Waters on the way home from work.
Latest Pug needs a decoke @ 1000 miles because its hasn't been revved to hell and back, never heard such a load of tommy rot for years.
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I had a friend who worked for Shell. One of the things she used to do was help on the Formula Shell trials. They would borrow a car for the weekend with a full tank of whatever fuel was being tested and had to do enough miles to (nearly) empty the tank. Then the engineers would check it out. Guess what cars were used for the tests? Vauxhall Astras! I remember my Kent engined Fiesta pinked like crazy on Formula Shell, no doubt due to the "spark aider" which presumably had the effect of advancing the ignition.
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Then the engineers would check it out. Guess what cars were used for the tests? Vauxhall Astras! I remember my Kent engined Fiesta pinked like crazy on Formula Shell, no doubt due to the "spark aider" which presumably had the effect of advancing the ignition.
Unless my memory fails me, wasn't it Vauxhall engines that were one of the victims of Formula Shell back in the day?
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The garage cleaned the spark plugs and then did what they called a manual decoke which they explained as revving the engine for a while.
What mockery is this?
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I suspect the garage meant the EGR needed cleaning.
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Thanks for all your replies.
I spoke with the Peugeot service manager today and they explained things further. When they initially reproduced the problem they described it as a "massive hesitation". There was no fault code logged, so they checked numerous things such as fuel flow, it has the latest firmware (it does), and more. They checked the Peugeot faults database and no issue like this has been logged with Peugeot and it is a new issue to the service manager.
They decided to perform a similar procedure to what they do with some diesel engines to setup or reset the engine learning. They revved the 2008 1.2 130 petrol engine for 1 min @4000 rpm and then 4 mins @6000 rpm, they let it cool down overnight and then took it for a long test drive from a cold startup the next day, they could not reproduce the initial issue and have decided the issue is cleared, at least for now. However, should the issue return they will initiate to the next Peugeot procedure which entails driving the car to reproduce the issue whilst collecting live data and then they will send the data direct to Peugeot for them to investigate. They understood my concerns about the issue and assured me they will definately sort the issue should it reoccur.
How does this sound to you ?
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They revved the 2008 1.2 130 petrol engine for 1 min @4000 rpm and then 4 mins @6000 rpm
I don't like the sound of that.
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They decided to perform a similar procedure to what they do with some diesel engines to setup or reset the engine learning. They revved the 2008 1.2 130 petrol engine for 1 min @4000 rpm and then 4 mins @6000 rpm,
Sounds to me like they made it up as they went along.
Revving an engine to 6000 rpm for 4 minutes with no load is not a good idea.
I would be worried.
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Revving an engine to 6000 rpm for 4 minutes with no load is not a good idea.
I would be worried.
Me too. As far as I remember, every owners' manual I've ever read states that you should NOT do this as it can/will lead to premature wear of the engine components. 6000 RPM FFS!
Sounds like they thought it might be a good idea to do a diesel DPF regen on a new petrol engine! Plug it in to a diagnostic machine, computer says Duh, no fault code found, so let's make it up as we go along.
Consumer Rights Act - this is their one chance of putting the fault right, If it happens again, start proceedings to reject the car.
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Like alot of maindealers, all the gear and no idea. Live data and fuel trim anyone?
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Suggest you speak to the Service Manager and have this "repair" fully listed in your bill and ensure you keep it as evidence. Ask for confirmation that what was done is acceptable to Peugeot. I would get onto the Peugeot owners forums and see what they say.
The whole thing is very strange.
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I would be very reluctant to let them rev it to 4000 and 6000....that could cause some damage.
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Sounds like they thought it might be a good idea to do a diesel DPF regen on a new petrol engine!
I witnessed a forced regen on our Kia Ceed. The wife thought it felt a bit lethargic, felt fine to me but I booked it in to get the fault codes read on the off chance something showed up. The only code was for an uncompleted regen which we knew about, was expecting it to complete within the next couple of days, but the garage said they would do a forced regen while I waited. Plugged car into laptop, and set it running. Very strange to hear the revs varying between idle and about 2000 rpm with no on sat in the car for about 20 minutes, once it was complete they unplugged it and sent me on my way.
As I said the revs used were only upto 2000, well under what they use for a diesel MOT smoke test and we all know what can happen when that goes wrong.
OP. Were there a load of horses tied up outside the dealers because they sound like a load of cowboys.
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Thanks again for your replies.
I collected the car today and gave it a long drive, no sign of the original issue and I tried multiple times to reproduce it. The garage did an engine oil & filter change after they revved & tested it, the engine sounds smooth and refined as I drove it. They had given the car a wash and it was spotless when I collected it.
They did say the spark plugs were actually quite clean when they checked them so I’m somewhat confussed as to why they thought the engine needed a manual decoke otherwise surely the plugs would be dirty. Does revving a direct injection engine clean the muck off the inlet valves when using fuel such as Shell V-power ?
Also the revving was to do with the engine management system learning stuff, what does that translate to ?
I sure hope the issue doesn't return, it felt nice driving the car without the issue being present. I have little or no confidence in the car at the moment, that will take some time of zero faults for that to happen.
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I would be very reluctant to let them rev it to 4000 and 6000....that could cause some damage.
How would that cause any damage? Why could raising the engine speed to 4 - 6000 in neutral with no load cause any damage as opposed to using 4-600 on load in gear in an overtaking manoevre for example?
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Provided the fluid levels are all ok and is at normal operating temperature, the engine can be revved at any speed below the redline under no load almost indefinitely without damage, just keep an eye on the temperature guage.
However I fail to see how this has anything to do with ecu learning. More like an attempt to unclog egr, turbo, exhaust injectors/fuel system or flush the oil galleries.
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I have the same Engine, 65 Plate 308 SW. 6 Speed Manual.
I have not had any problems, 5000 miles since January, mostly Super Market,Asda petrol.
Yes you can get caught out, occasionally pulling out of junctions (to high a gear) if the revs are low you are going no where fast.
Keep the revs up and the Turbo spinning all is good.
Probably one of the best engines i have had the pleasure of using.
Fuel economy, around town mid/low 30,s . Motorway is excellent , cruising at 70/80 on trips to London 54.
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I would be very reluctant to let them rev it to 4000 and 6000....that could cause some damage.
How would that cause any damage? Why could raising the engine speed to 4 - 6000 in neutral with no load cause any damage as opposed to using 4-6000 on load in gear in an overtaking manoevre for example?
6000 RPM for four minutes? What in hell's trousers kind of overtaking do you do?
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I would be very reluctant to let them rev it to 4000 and 6000....that could cause some damage.
How would that cause any damage? Why could raising the engine speed to 4 - 6000 in neutral with no load cause any damage as opposed to using 4-6000 on load in gear in an overtaking manoevre for example?
6000 RPM for four minutes? What in hell's trousers kind of overtaking do you do?
Whenever I can and whatever I am driving and anywhere I can! - (just making progress officer!).
Seriously - it's a common misconception that "revs harms engines".
Agreed, revving an engine from cold with cold oil is a bad idea-
But- in a professional engine testing career years ago I have never known "revs" harm any engine, petrol or diesel, as long as the oil is hot and the coolant is flowing.
What does harm any engine is chugging them about at low revs and in a high gear in the mistaken belief that you are being "kind" to your engine - often done in the pursuit of better fuel consumption.
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Looks like the Peugeot garage was onto something.
Please take a look at the article below, in particular
the section "Drive the Spiders Out from Time To Time", rev...
and the section about Shell V-Power Nitro+
http://www.vif.cz/files/files/Novinky/SMX_VIF_EN.pdf
What do you reckon ?
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Yes, but there shouldn't be any spiders after only 1,000 miles!
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