Hmmm - this is interesting! TY, BTW, Mark, for changing title.
Paul - the mechanic definitely referred to 'bushes', not specifically 'mounting bushes', but he definitely did not say 'brushes'.
The alternator IS moving about a bit, is that maybe why the belt loosened up quite a bit over the last couple of weeks? Hadn't noticed battery going flat but now that you mention it, it is turning over a little more than usual before starting up. What you say about the mounting bolts (I think) makes a lot of sense, however it IS rather hard to get at. Volvoman tried tightening the bolt fr me a couple of weeks ago, but due to a big pipe in the way could not get sufficient access. If it IS this, though, it's promising, because there must surely be a way round this inaccessibility problem?
If it's BRUSHES - well I don't know, but I'm glad it's not a big job and I take what you say about the cost of getting the alternator removed etc. Had to get a new one for my old Renault earlier this year, cost about 100 altogether if I recall correctly. But would prefer not to get new one for this car if I can help it at the moment.
Thank you for all you've said, it's very helpful and quite a relief too!
HF
PS bit disturbing if the mechanic's trying it on, had been under the impression that this one was ok, but of course when you don't know what you're talking about I guess they can say anything!
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HF, Not sure about the 1.7 diesel engine, but all the earlier VX alternators were mounted on bushes. If worn, adjustment can be a bit awkward, but as your man says, not impossible. Replacing the bushes will sort out the problem - for a while. If the belt doesn't squeal, and the tension feels OK, don't worry.
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Methinks the mechanic is trying it on. There are no "mounting bushes" on an alternator.
Yes there are. They're on the pivot arm underneath that bolts the alternator to the engine block. Big thick rubber mount, shaped like a top hat, with a metal dowel running through the centre. One on each side IIRC. The metal dowel eventually chafes its way through the rubber and makes metal to metal contact with the pivot bolt.
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I'd agree there. I wouldn't have said it was a "big" job though, a little fiddly maybe but no more. Certainly not a reason not to buy the car...!
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Also going with steve p above, if the battery is charging and the belt isn't squealing then it's not urgent. Your mechanic should be able to tighten the other bolt or bolts holding the alternator on sufficiently to compensate for the play in the worn bush!
Of course, if at some point before you get round to having it fixed, the alternator were to give out anyway, a replacement alternator would come with hopefully better bushes! You don't always *have* to buy a reconditioned or even new alternator though, any reputable (!) scrapyard, sorry vehicle dismantlers, will let you return one if when fitted it's found not to work.
If it's not squealing HF, don't worry.
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Thanks for that, DD, my flabber is suitably gasted.
Sorry for misleading you, HF, I've not come across such bushes in 39 years of fiddling about with motors.
From what you say, the 'big job' will be getting at the blighter, maybe having to remove other components. The bushes will be cheap.
I'll get me coat...................
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Yep, GM alternators are rubber-mounted and can appear loose; this is a good reason to make sure the earth cable is is good condition!
MG-Rover Questions? forums.mg-rover.org/
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Thanks, Steve, Dynamic, Dave TD, Dr Dave and Paul, you've all given me lots to think about. Will write all this down and get a few things checked out, no squealing at the moment though so I guess not anything to worry about yet (although as I said, the belt HAD loosened up a bit).
May I please ask for a little more info on the earth cable? Is this a cable on the alternator, and what happens if it isn't in good condition?
Thanks all,
HF
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May I please ask for a little more info on the earth cable? Is this a cable on the alternator, and what happens if it isn't in good condition?
The first sign that the earth cable isn't connected is that the battery light on the dashboard won't light up when you switch on the ignition before start up.
I had this happen on my Astra. Thinking it was just the bulb blown I didn't take much notice. That was until the next evening when I turned on the headlights and noticed how dim they were, and then the engine started misfiring due to the lights starving the engine of what little power the battery had left in it. If the earth cable is detached, then the alternator won't charge the battery - as I found out when I got stranded on the side of the road. A quick bodge with some wire found in the toolbox and a bump start soon got the car going again to complete my journey and get me home for a more permanent repair.
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Thanks Dynamic, Battery light does light up so this is not part of the problem.
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Picked up on this a bit late, but here is my two pennyworth !
Can't say for sure if the diesel instalation is same as the petrol, but on the petrol engined cars this is indeed quite a job. The problem is that the inner adjuster arm bushes and bolt are located into the end of the cylinder head behind the inner cambelt cover and camshaft pulley / sprocket. So, to get to the pivot bolt you have to remover the auxiliary drive belts, the outer cambelt cover, the cambelt itself, the camshaft pulley / sprocket (which means taking the camshaft top cover off to lock the camshaft), and finally the inner cambelt cover. As you are now only a stones throw away from replacing the cambelt it is worth doing at the same time. All this just to get to two small bushes - crazy design. Re-assembly is the reverse, as they say.
On completeion, of course, the diesel pump timing must be reset. As I said at start, can't say for sure if the diesel situation is the same as petrol, but wouldn't be surprised.
Regards, Adam
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Adam - that makes sense to me because when I tried to tighten the nuts on the mounting bracket it was quite a tight squeeze and I couldn't get any real leverage. To be fair to our 'indy', perhaps having briefly inpsected the alternator he concluded that tightening the nuts was not the answer and to solve the problem he would have to do what you describe - quite a bit of labour by the sound of
it ! I've known the guy for a while now and he could have ripped me off if he'd wanted to but he hasn't yet so I think he's OK.
We managed to retighten the belt again although it hadn't become all that loose anyway and there's no sign of squealing or flickering dashboard warning lights so far as I know. I suppose it's just a bit disconcerting seeing the alternator 'wobbling' although its not excessive. I think that might have contributed to the excessive 'side to side' wear we found on the drive belt which snapped.
It's crazy really 'cos it looks as though it should be a 10 minute job to fix and that's what makes it so annoying.
Anyway if the conclusion is that it's not 'terminal' or dangerous I'm sure HF will live with it.
Thanks for all the feedback guys anyway.
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At one time virtually all alternators had one bush in the mounting system;this was to allow the alternator which was mainly aluminium to expand at a different rate to the block was usually cast iron.Lucas ACR etc??
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On the Ford Duratorque diesel the alternator is bolted directly onto the block with no visible means of adjustment. There is a poly V belt with 'stretch belt' printed on it. I haven't had to change one yet but it looks as though the alternator might have to come off to replace the belt. Or would it stretch enough for removal / replacement ? Anyone know ?
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No,it won't stretch.The adjuster is on the front of the engine somewhere dependent on whether you have PAS,AC and anything else driven by it.
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jc.
The belt drives nothing else, no jockey wheels etc. Just a 'stretch belt' from pulley to pulley.
Steve.
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On a Ford there is at least the water pump and an idler/adjuster if nothing else!!
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If you don't believe me read the Haynes manual.
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jc.
Maybe a bit of confusion about the engine type. I'm asking about belt fitting to the Duratorque engine as fitted to the new Transit. I know for certain that the drive belt runs from a fixed alternator with no adjustment (unless shims are fitted between the alternator and block) and the crankshaft pulley.
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Adam.........
It is now clear that all computer virus authors were engine designers in earlier lives............................
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Oh dear- this has now gone way above my head in terms of technical language etc.
For now I'll have to adopt my ususal 'leave it and hope for the best' policy. From what you say, Adam, I think my best bet is to wait till the cambelt needs changing and get this done at the same time.
Thanks for your help.
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The alternator on my bike runs off a gear on the crank, why do cars have these external gubbins? It's as though they make them to be awkward, or the designers are sponsored by belt manufacturers. Surely they could bolt an alternator on the end of the crank at the design stage, so no squeeling belt and no squeeky bearings.
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Hi Doug,
regarding the placement of the alternator, there is a packaging issue involved. Having it on the end of the crank increases the overall length of the engine which can cause space problems in the engine bay.
Also, alternators do not like water and are preferably mounted in a higher position than the engine crank to reduce the possibility of immersion and its exposure to water splash and road spray.
Of course, it is not just the alternator that runs off a belt but also the aircon compressor and PAS pump.
The increasing use of Poly-V belts in modern engines has virtually eliminated all the problems with the old single V ones.
CMark
PS I do know of one engine that was designed to have all ancillaries run by skew gear off the crank (amongst other radical design departures) but it never saw the light of day (due to other issues) - AFRICAR.
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