I?m wondering here how with all the marketing / design power of large car companies they can still manage get some details badly wrong.
To start, my recently acquired Golf Mk6 has overstyled heater controls where neither the graphics or the set position of the three knobs is easy to see. How this design got passed for production I?ll never know. ( Current Astra is similar )
The rest of the car, controls etc. is very good
Edited by mustangman on 06/06/2009 at 11:44
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You've hit it in one... "overstyled"... that's the problem, the designers get hold of it and all chances of practicality and easy of use are thrown out of the window in the name of "style"... It drives me up the wall, and is why I end up with the less good looking but much more practical cars like the Fabia estate and Roomster....
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Ive always found the slider controls for heater/fan by far the most intuitive to use without looking as you can physically feel where the controls are without looking - buttons mean you HAVE to look at a screen and rotary knobs are somewhere inbetween.
Truth is, they dont care so much about the drivers needs, but more about showroom appeal.
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"Truth is, they don't care so much about the drivers' needs, but more about showroom appeal."
You're probably quite right, Stu - but if drivers' needs are different from showroom appeal, then a lot of buyers are stupid.
Edited by Avant on 06/06/2009 at 12:26
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I think you will find buyers arent stupid at all, but they prioritise whats important to them and take a compromise on that which they dont like.
Most people wont not buy a car on account of the heater controls for instance, infact many wont give it much thought until a week after they take delivery and realise what they find less than ideal, having only looked at the bigger picture when buying.
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Stu,
You're in and out of a lot more cars than me.
Are there many new ones with slider heater controls?
I thought the three rotary knobs - temp, fan, distribution - were almost universal.
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Of course the real answer is that you should never buy a car from a dealer unless they allow you an extended test drive, when you can find out what you can and can't live with.
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The manufacturers spend more time & money dsigning & marketing the style, brand & image of the vehicle together with the "lifestyle" that they believe the customer will aspire to for one simple reason - it sells more cars than practicality will!
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I?m wondering here how with all the marketing / design power of large car companies
>> To start my recently acquired Golf Mk6 has overstyled heater controls where neither the graphics or the set position of the three knobs is easy to see. How this design........
Yes, I agree with you 100%. As you may have seen here, I have one of these cars on order but had noticed, in the showroom the stupidity of the design of the three heater controls. Strangely, also, they have a very light action and so cannot see whether they mechanically connected to any linkage etc.
My current MK5 Golf is the very model of sensible -ness. Each knob has a raised centre, running radially, whose position you can sense without having to look downwards at the control knob in question.
I hope that I can adapt to these over stylistic fancy looking bottle caps but I felt that I could not reject the whole car because of this design faux pas. However I do find that I am always fiddling with the positon of my heater controls to optimise the interior comfort of the car.
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Extensive test drives would have saved me an arm and a leg over the years!
No car ... I repeat - No Car, can have worse thought out or designed heater/climate controls than my 05 Almera - they totally defy logic! A machine (I Robot) could and would have done better, in fact it seems (to me) as if someone has gone out of their way to make them as difficult to use as possible - Rubik's cube is a doddle in comparison :)
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No problems with the Mondeo's climate control, just press the end of the indicator stalk to activate voice control, say "temperature" and the nice lady asks "temperature please" then say "23" or whatever temperature you want in degrees C. ;0)
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The Hilux has sensible no nonsense controls, the heater especially, 3 dials nice and simple well labelled and a push button on/off aircon...that does us fine and is easily fixed if something goes wrong.
The only gripe we have is the Satnav which we didn't want but came as standard, it works superbly once you program it, the second and last time we used the thing it only took us 20 minutes to program.
The handbook for the satnav alone is thicker than the handbook for the rest of the vehicle!
Toyota have just released a minor facelift version which i had a quick nose around, and lo and behold on the Invincible we have now gained climate control...won't be replacing the existing one then, it's a truck for goodness sake.
KISS.
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KISS is my favourite word
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I have never understood why the speedometer is not on the centre of the steering wheel, as it can be obscured by modern wide spoked wheels some of the time.
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I have never understood why the speedometer is not on the centre of the steering wheel as it can be obscured by modern wide spoked wheels some of the time.
Probably because you can't make a padded speedometer! don't know if you've noticed but most steering wheels these days have impact-absorbent bits in the boss to save you knocking your teeth out on 'em.
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most steering wheels these days
Heh heh Harleyman. You're nearly as old-fashioned as I am. Padded steering wheels were years ago.
What they have now is a graceless, bloated boss, often incorporating a horn button and the controls for a swimming pool and private sauna among other refinements, that cunningly conceals an explosive pneumatic boxing glove to stun you and flatten your stogie against your face if you stop abruptly. Serve you right too.
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I have never understood why the speedometer is not on the centre of the steering wheel as it can be obscured by modern wide spoked wheels some of the time.
Because it would look silly? Be confusing too trying to check your speed with the wheel turned. Right in front of the driver is fine.
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I have never understood why the speedometer is not on the centre of the steering wheel as it can be obscured by modern wide spoked wheels some of the time.
I find that my rev counter is often obscured by the upper left 'spoke' of the steering wheel when driving on roads with a very slight right hand bend. As I tend to use this as much as the speedometer, I find it a little irritating
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No problems with the Mondeo's climate control just press the end of the indicator stalk to activate voice control say "temperature" and the nice lady asks "temperature please" then say "23" or whatever temperature you want in degrees C. ;0)
Now THAT is cool! :-)
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say "temperature" and the nice lady asks "temperature please" then say "23" or whatever >> temperature you want in degrees C. ;0)
I can't help thinking that the thought required to do all that is more distracting then simply turning a knob. :)
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>> say "temperature" and the nice lady asks "temperature please" then say "23" or whatever temperature you want in degrees C. ;0)
Thats OK as long as it understands your accent...... who remembers Clarkson trying to make an S Class understand him?
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I don't know about Clarkson having difficulty, but I remember seeing Ozzy Osbourne trying to make a new BMW 7 series understand his profanities.
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Extensive test drives would have saved me an arm and a leg over the years ..
I wouldn't go that far, but an hour or so instead of 20 mins. might have saved me a grand, after I bought a 206 Garros a few years ago. Swopped it for a 306 after 2 months and 3K miles, because the seats became too uncomfortable after about an hour's driving. I suspect most dealers prefer punters to make their minds up sooner than that.
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To start my recently acquired Golf Mk6 has overstyled heater controls where neither the graphics or the set position of the three knobs is easy to see.
I've not seen a Golf 6 with three knobs for the heater controls, only 2 knobs (one on either side) for temperature control and some buttons in between. Was your heater version an option?
My pet hate in interior design is speedometers which are mounted in the middle of the dashboard instead of where they belong, in front of the driver.
I'm sure this saves the car manufacturers loads of money in having universal dashboard mouldings and wiring for LHD and RHD versions. For me, the resulting ugly mass of grey plastic in front of the steering wheel and the awkwardness of having to redirect my eyes to find an instrument that has so skillfully been moved out of the driver's field of view is a definite reason not to buy the car.
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Wonder what the nice lady in the Mondeo would reply when I mutter my chosen expletive at the sight of yet another motorway traffic jam ?
"You'll be be lucky mate !" Perhaps ?
;-)
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>> I've not seen a Golf 6 with three knobs for the heater controls only 2
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Eh? Three rotary (or semi-rotary knobs) in a row is usual, surely. On the Golfs ,with 'climatic' aircon etc. the left hand knob is for temperature control, the middle knob selects variable fan speeds and the right hand knob controls the distribution of the blown air.
Pretty standard layout I would have thought unless you have cars with those silly controls marked +/- for adjusting speeds or separate push buttons for selecting a range of distribution i.e face/floor and face/windscreen and windscreen only etc. etc.
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Interior ergonomics. Volvo always seem to get it right.
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My Avensis has only one rotary control - all the rest are push button / rocker type switches. But with climate control, you just set it once and leave it!
Only time I ever bypass the autoclimate control is in winter when trying to demist the windscreen. Rest of the time, temperature is set to 21c.
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Cavalier MK3 had the best heater controls I remember - three sliders - drag them over to the extreme right and the blew hot air on the screen - where you needed them first thing in the morning. Roomie's were sensible as well. MK5 Golf were fussy. Honda has big rotaries which are almost good/
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Cavalier MK3 had the best heater controls I remember
Sierra's were good as well. Two vertical sliders running up the side of the instrument binnacle - one for temp (up = hotter, down = cooler) and one for direction (Up = screen middle = face, down = feet). Conventional rotary knob for the blower. Very logical and easy to use. Most of the Sierra's controls could be operated without taking your eyes off the road. I reckon that dashboard (although creaky and plasticky by modern standards) was a fantastic piece of design, with a lovely "wraparound" feel. Still looks ok for a > 25 year old design too
www.freewebs.com/automotivated/DCP01567.JPG
I did like Vauxhall's trick of putting the heated rear window switch on the blower knob though (pull out). I remember that from my mk2 Cav SRI, and it always struck me as being both logical, and a good use of dash space.
Cheers
DP
Edited by DP on 08/06/2009 at 12:33
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I did like Vauxhall's trick of putting the heated rear window switch on the blower knob though (pull out).
Same here. My Mk1 Astra did that as well. I think Vauxhall carried on using this design up until the Mk3 Astra (Astra-F)
I don't understand the logic of putting the heated mirrors on the same circuit as the heated rear window though. On my Mk2 Cavalier the heated mirrors were on a separate switch, as was my 1991 Mk3. But my 1993 Mk3 Cavalier was incorperated with the heated rear screen - a trait that Vauxhall have followed on with since.
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Dear Bagpuss,
Your pet hate... "My pet hate in interior design is speedometers which are mounted in the middle of the dashboard instead of where they belong, in front of the driver."
...is not just related to new cars, my FIAT Idea (now a discontinued model) has the speedometer left of centre as it has to share space with the tachometer, fuel & temp gauges.
In the past, the Morris Minor from the '60s had the speedo in the center and in the 70s the Bond Bug also did. No doubt others will be along to add to the list but the 3 cars I mentioned are from personal experience.
I don't have a problem with it once I got used to it. Most of the time my eyes are on the road, my speed is mostly (but not exclusively) is judged by what gear I'm in, engine noise, prevailing road conditions and more years experience than I care to state :¬(
John R
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