I may have missed this as a topic, I did do a search and found an FAQ but it didn't cover this -
Do you buy a car with SatNav built in, or do you buy TomTom et al and stick it on the windscreen?
Most car makers want £1500 - £2000 for built in SatNav where as TomTom etc are £300-500.
So come trade in time will you see anything like you £2000 back? Will SatNav just make it a bit easier to sell the car on? Or are you better off with TomTom etc and spend the money on leather, or a week in Cyprus or something else?
Thanks for the views!
TimBo
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Will you get your 2k back for your built in sat nav?
Well it depends on the car, but basically NO. Well would you pay that much more for your second hand car when you can get a £299 tom tom?
And frankly TomTom makes most built in sat navs look archaeic.
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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>>And frankly TomTom makes most built in sat navs look archaeic.
Ooo no. I'll admit the built in isn't worth a £1,000 more than TomTom, but it most certainly is better.
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Will you get your 2k back for your built in sat nav? Well it depends on the car, but basically NO. Well would you pay that much more for your second hand car when you can get a £299 tom tom? And frankly TomTom makes most built in sat navs look archaeic. ------------------------------ TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
Factory fit (generally speaking) are much much much much much much much much much much much better then tomtom!
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MoneyMart
Current car: 55-reg Audi A4 2.5 V6TDi Quattro flappy-paddle
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I used to think so, and I use both, and you are talking out of your botty.
All the acceleromters and gyros, and speed pulse, and reverse switch are all a waste of time for the basic premise of getting from A to B
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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I used to think so, and I use both, and you are talking out of your botty. All the acceleromters and gyros, and speed pulse, and reverse switch are all a waste of time for the basic premise of getting from A to B ------------------------------ TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
No botty talking here mate.
I still use both - I use the Audi built in one in my car, and a tomtom in the wife's motor.
1 Accuracy is far better in the Audi
2 Clarity of visuals far better in the Audi
3 Quality of audio far far far far better in the Audi
4 Routing far better in the Audi
5 Calculation time far better in the Audi
6 "goodies" far better in the Audi
7 Cost far better in the tomtom
Sure, both perform the (quote) "basic premise of getting from A to B", but that's like saying a Fiesta and an Audi both get you from A to B.... well, yes they do, but that doesn't mean one isn't better than the other does it!
(botty microphone now handed back to TVM where it's more at home!)
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MoneyMart
Current car: 55-reg Audi A4 2.5 V6TDi Quattro flappy-paddle
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Used it in a golf4 against latest VW MDF2 built in sat nav
1 Accuracy is far better in the Audi
wrong
2 Clarity of visuals far better in the Audi
wrong Tomtom mounted up higher in line of site
3 Quality of audio far far far far better in the Audi
NO diffrence with an amplified mount
4 Routing far better in the Audi
wrong
5 Calculation time far better in the Audi
wrong - by a long way
6 "goodies" far better in the Audi
TMC Is the only goodie worth having However the accuracy of TMC announcments makes it worthless
7 Cost far better in the tomtom
agree
Botty mike passed firmly back to its place of birth.
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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Don't believe that there is much in the way of difference between the BMW set up and the Audi set up.
1.Agree with TVM
2.Possibly the head up display in the BMW is slightly more ergonomic (certainly not in the VFM stakes)
3.Audio again agree with TVM, and if the Tom Tom is slightly tinny compared to routing through the car speakers, the VFM case again.
4.Agree with TVM, TomTom offered some eccentric routing on one occasion compared to the BMW.
5. Agree with TVM
6. Goodies.......VFM again.
7. When you're talking about a piece of kit that can cost 20% of the OE, how can I not agree.
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Used it in a golf4 against latest VW MDF2 built in sat nav 1 Accuracy is far better in the Audi wrong 2 Clarity of visuals far better in the Audi wrong Tomtom mounted up higher in line of site 3 Quality of audio far far far far better in the Audi NO diffrence with an amplified mount 4 Routing far better in the Audi wrong 5 Calculation time far better in the Audi wrong - by a long way 6 "goodies" far better in the Audi TMC Is the only goodie worth having However the accuracy of TMC announcments makes it worthless 7 Cost far better in the tomtom agree Botty mike passed firmly back to its place of birth. ------------------------------ TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
Ho hum! If the botty mike was born with me, it went to university and graduated with honours with you :-)
1 I know of several locations with parallel roads where tomtom struggles to work out which one you are on, but Audi always gets it right, so original statement stands.
2. You obviously don't know the Audi system, otherwise you would know that the display is replicated in the DIS right in front of the driver, as well as on the full colour screen. Both screens are higher resolution than TomTom. Neither screens suffer reflection problems of tomtom.
3. Quality of Audi instructions come out of 12 Bose high definition speakers. Quality of tomtom comes out of a tiny in-built speaker. Enough said.
4. Quality of routing is a perceptive issue - i.e. different people prefer different routes. However if my wife and I both go from point A to point B, both leaving at the same time and driving seperately, but me following Audi satnav route and her Tomtom route, I arrive quicker, despite the fact that she drives faster than me. Always. Therefore my statement that Audi routing is better is founded from actual experience.
5. Again, the Audi calculated quicker than the TomTom. If I cared enough about your opinion, I could video a demonstration. But I don't, so I won't bother.
Anyway, this is boring (very), so enjoy your retort! I'll leave you to have the last go on botty mike!
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MoneyMart
Current car: 55-reg Audi A4 2.5 V6TDi Quattro flappy-paddle
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Sorry I think you've both missed an important point.
I've previous generation TomTom software on an IPAQ.
The great advantage over built in hardware is that I can set up the journey in the comfort of my home/hotel room/gite and can do "if we want to see wxyz how long will it take...when do we start" the night before. Also means that I can sanity check the route fairly easily. It does route on the shortest/quickest etc. but when that is from the Channel Tunnel straight through central Paris on a Friday evening sitting with a beer and an old fashioned map and adding a few waypoints to 'help' the choice of road is better then than in the morning when we are waiting to leave.
I get sufficently accurate positioning with the hardwired antenna on the floor under the rear footwell mats to be good enough normally. If something heavy or opaque (wine, toyboxes, adult feet) are going to be on top I put it on the back of the transmission tunnel. Still hard to see, and mounted vertically but still works well.
Simon
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I've got both (can't go anywhere without it!). I heard somewhere that built in sat nav earns an extra £300ish at trade in.
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Oh and I can get the full £1500 MDF VW sat nav as fitted new retrofitted in my touran for £500
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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If it's stuck on the screen,lowlife will nick it;take it off,they'll see the mark and break-in to find it.
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If it's stuck on the screen,lowlife will nick it;take it off,they'll see the mark and break-in to find it.
And if it's built into the dash, lowlife will still nick it and make a mess of your dash in the process.....
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MoneyMart
Current car: 55-reg Audi A4 2.5 V6TDi Quattro flappy-paddle
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Buy a PDA based system and then go on holiday with the change. My Mondeo has the £1750 option, Touch Screen system. It was replaced with a new box at 18 months old and the replacement is now acting up.
Besides it is far too expensive to upgrade as well, £235 for the DVD and it is nowhere near as versatile as a PDA based system. You can upgrade them in so many different ways at little or no expense. How about a monthly upgrade of all the speed camera locations in the UK? Free via email subscription. Or if it floats your boat, your favourite soap/tv/singer providing the voice to guide you on your way? You cannot do that with a fixed O/E manufacturer system.
I am left with the dilemma over whether I should get rid of this before it fails again. If it goes outside the warranty period it will cost £1850 and I will have to replace it as it controls the climate and the CD/radio as well as the sat-nav.
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Another option is there are now cd player stereos with built in satnav that you can get, these can then be transfered when you change cars. Also doesnt look any different to a normal removable facia stereo, got one for xmas and seems to be really accurate not had any problems so far.
--
Temporarily not a student, where did the time go???
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Hadn't considered the built in unit a) failing or b) updating the maps c) no traffic camera POI- good points
£1800 for SatNav in the new Audi I am looking at just makes me cringe
TimBo
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Just wait.
Remember what used to be options?
Radios
Radios with cassettes
Radios with CD players
Heated rear windows
Wing mirrors
Aircon
Metallic paint
Alloy Wheels
etc, etc.
All are now standard on most non-base models. Satnav will go the same way. At the moment, they can charge whatever people will pay (that's caitalism working at its best!). In a coupl eof years, they won't be able to fleece you.
V
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MAtter of choice. Most recent cars I have had the BMW sat-nav on as an option. Bought SWMBO a TomTom 7 for Christmas which I test drove (obviously), I struggle to find why I paid what I paid for the option in my latest car when these are so cheap, for goodness sake saw one in Tesco the other day for £330.00 (TomTom7). I would have to be persuaded to spec one into a car again. TomTom gets you there. Same as any Sat Nav I do my stratigic planning in advanced (when going somewhere new) and leave Sat Nav to focus in on a particular location. BMW SatNav does it well, TomTom does it just as well. The only thing with the BMW kit it does insist you stay in the outside lane on all motorways ;-).
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The only thing with the BMW kit it does insist you stay in the outside lane on all motorways ;-).
Surely it also tells you to move closer to the carr in front, and to put your xenon headlamps onto full beam while doing so? ;)
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No that's me. How do you expect a SatNav to do that ? - really.
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If the satnav is also your mobile then it will be in your pocket when you leave the car. Throw a trilby over the GPS aerial on the back shelf and lowlife won't be any the wiser.
I use a Nokia 6600 with TomTom on it and have been pleased at the way the relatively small screen has piloted me to some obscure addresses and back again. Downloads from www.pocketgps.co.uk have given me locations for e.g. B&Q stores, fuel stations and speed cameras. No need for satnav built in or on a PDA I'd say. I got my setup working with secondhand phone and GPS aerial off Ebay and an official TOmTom pack for under £300 in total.
Hawkeye
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Stranger in a strange land
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That's one thing I find quite eccentric in TomTom, where it thinks petrol stations are...
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And speed cameras have legs, they move around by about 100 yards month to month.....
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TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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I'm with Hawkeye on this one.
Tom Tom mobile on my Nokia 6630. Tom Tom GPS receiver in the sunglasses holder behind the rear view mirror (Golf MK V) I clip the phone in to the centre console, so there's no evidence of sat nav when you leave the car. I can upload speed camera databases. It's served me well, and all for less than £200.
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The tom tom systme is far superior. I run 4 vehicles and find the ability to swap the systme betwwen these and also hire vehicles esential as oposed to a factry fit option that is permantly stuck in one vehicle and expensive if it goes wrong. By comparision the tom tom is throwaway money and a quarter of the cost of factry fitted.
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I have it built into the dashboard, it is basically a GM sanctioned VDO Daytom MS3000. It is 8 years old now, and works, a treat. I thought I'd try the TomTom on a phone as described above to see how it compares. I expect the audio will be appaulling compared to 6" 2 way speaker behind dash!
After you recommending the Nokia 6630, I just ordered one off ebay and the Tom Tom 5 software. Now I assume I need some bluetooth GPS bridge or maybe a wired one? There are several, quite expensive at £50ish, anyone recomment a particular make? I also see some cradles with a small speaker built in, are these much good?
If I don't like it, Mem Sahib can use it in her Corsa, as she keeps asking me to get her a sat nav.
Thanks for any advice regarding the mobile phone GPS related matters.
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In response to Ishok Leyland's question, you can get non brand name bluetooth GPS receivers for around £50. I personaly went for, and can recommend a 'genuine' TomTom bluetooth GPS receiver which are available for around £85. Just type "tomtom bluetooth gps receiver" in to ebay to see the choices.
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If you are asking this question it probably means you haven't got money to burn.
I thought of getting Sat Nav for my Volvo but the in car kit, although very nice is very expensive.
I bought a Tom Tom 700, a proper mounting bracket (Brodit) and an external antenna. The external antenna, makes quite a difference and positioning is far more accurate. The mounting bracket, keeps the windscreen clear (avoid reflections), I can still view the TomTom and reduces refletions, and it is easy to remove and install when I leave the car. Even better, if you change your car like I do every three years, or have a second car the system is transferrable.
I'm sure the in car systems are better, but I wasn't willing to pay nearly 5 times more!!!! They certainly aren't 5 times better!!!
WipeOut
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I have an iPAQ 2210 with TomTom and the brilliant SysOnChip card antenna that simply pushes in to the CF slot. Amazingly sensitive and with a max 100% rating by PocketGPS, it will (according to voice instructions which I used for the test) even work in the glovebox with the lid closed! Surprised that I was granted permission, I have used it on a Ryanair flight to Skavsta, Sweden, to track progress too!
I have a Brodit clip for use in my Volvo V70, a home fabricated bracket for use on the mountain bike, and also slip it in to the transparent map pocket on my motorbike tank bag.
So, for me, I'm very glad I didn't spend two grand on Volvo's fancy pop-up system. I have all this convenience plus a PDA that means I sometimes leave the laptop at home as well.
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Just realised; on the bike I plug the unit in to the Autocom intercom so still get spoken instructions with total clarity.
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My comments-Obvious conclusion without any doubt-Tom Tom wins hands down
1 Accuracy is far better in the Audi
-I cant comment about the Audi's system but I have had to use my hand held Axim+Tom Tom on more than several occasions to rescue the driver when his inbuilt car navigation system couldnt identify the given address properly.
And this was in Toyota Avensis,Honda Accords and Nissan Xtrails.
All these cars are 55 Regs and therefore would be having the latest maps and software updates.
I do agree the maps on the Tom Tom arent perfect but Im prepared to accept very occasional errors.
However the ETA on the Tom Tom is faultless down to the minute,more accurate than the inbuilt systems
2 Clarity of visuals far better in the Audi
I have used Garmins IQue and Mapopolis and including Nissan's supposedly "famed" Birdview system,I think that the on screen map view , no other competitor can come even close to the Tom Tom.
3 Quality of audio far far far far better in the Audi
Tom Tom has an option for a voice install that is louder than the normal.
Unless you are moderately deaf , I see no advantage out of having the instructions coming through the car speakers!
4 Routing far better in the Audi
again cant comment on the Audi,but Tom Toms routing is far better than the Japanese cars mentioned above.
5 Calculation time far better in the Audi-ETA is far better in the Tom Tom.
6 "goodies" far better in the Audi
Dont know what these "goodies" are, presumably they are related to real time traffic conditions and guidance.
In case you are prepared to splurge out £450 you can get a Sony GPs with lifetime on screen traffic data free!
7 Cost far better in the tomtom
Without doubt, and if you rent a car in say Europe/USA you just take your Tom Tom with you(with the required maps) and use it.
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Well, I have had my Nokia 6630 with Tom Tom 5, and GPS bluetooth box for a couple of days to compare with the Philips/Carin/VDO monochrome unit which is 8 years old and in my dashboard. Even though it is 8 years old new software makes it almost identical to the bottom of the range VDO systems, especially what it says and where is identical, the alogarythms are the same, and map software the same, the voice and phrases are the same.
TOTOM
Pros - Portable/transferable, much better add-ons such as pocketgps speed cameras, much more customisable, faster re-routing, many more features and options.
Cons - Can't use with car radio on quiet and tinny/grating, voice not pleasant, sends me on strange routes especially when you go wrong or ignore it, very poor accuracy of map data, it even thinks my own house is a quarter of a mile down the road if I enter my road and house number! If I enter my postcode, it gives another road 300 yards at the back whose postcode is different. I think TomTom uses Teleatlas mapping which I have found similarly useless on the car's built-in system. Spoken instructions were usually 15 yards later than the VDO which was too late in estates etc..., unable to choose to prefer main roads/avoid main roads etc..., possibly too complicated for an old lady?
Old VDO In Car
Pros - Less likely to be stolen, less clutter, much clearer audio - can be heard over loud audio playing, seems to give more useful instructions, has better set of phrases and places to say them to make sure you are in the righ lane, prepared and also not bombarded with instructions of little use.
Cons - Sell the car and lose it, harder to enter details, less features, slow to calculate or regain bearings after being indoors.
Verdict - It's impossible to say one is better than the other, a combination would be perfect.
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