Thanks, Steve and Tom,
I take your point Steve, about taking a copy of insurance details around with me, it's a good one, but what happens if the other driver can't provide details? Should I still give mine?
Tom, thanks for the checklist - I'd still be very wary of giving my address, even if it IS common policy. Maybe name and phone number is ok, but if going through insurers then why would the other party, rather than their insurers, need to contact me?
HF
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HF,
To add to what's already been suggested, if in the unfortunate instance you were to have an accident, NEVER admit liability, even if it was blatently your fault. A lot of insurance companies suggest this now.
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Yeah, I know not to do that, DD, but thanks. In the heat of the moment it's probably easy to rush out apologising, if it's your fault, but I know that's unwise!
HF
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My mate with the Mondeo actually apologised to the van driver who hit him for braking so sharply! What was he meant to do? Not break sharply and plough into the back of the queue?
Unfortunately an apology like this only a bit better than admitting liability, he shouldn't have done it. Fortunately *touch wood* it doesn't look like they're going to try and wriggle out of it as it was clearly all the van driver's fault.
HF - I can see why you may not want to give your address. But, be careful of anyone who offers you their phone number only, I know someone who naively accepted this after an accident, it was of course a wrong number and he ended up paying for his non-fault accident himself. At the very least get their reg no. Be careful 'cos not everyone's as honest as you! :)
Hope you're well, take care out there.
Blue
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Hi Blue,
long time no speak, again, and good to see you!
Thanks for your advice, I can see that in a dodgy situaion then I'm only likely to get a dodgy phone number anyway!
This is exactly why I was asking the original question! Of course I would try and get the reg number if I could, but apart from that, it seems there is no comeback if the person you're dealing with is, erm, not an honest person! (refrained from expletives).
Thanks for replying Blue, take care, take it easy, and keep safe. And hope to speak to you again soon.
HF
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I had a guy in a Merc try to push in to the queue I was in a couple of weeks ago, and landed up scraping his door against my wing. We pulled over to the side of the road, when I got out to inspect the damage his passenger squared up to me whilst yelling all sorts of abuse about not letting them in. As I had a customer on board at the time I got back in my car, locked the doors and phoned the police. After 10 minutes or so the Merc driver (now on his own, don't know where his mate went) tapped on my window, offering a piece of paper with his name, registration number and phone number on it. I scribbled my name and registration number on a company business card, gave it to him, and carried on with my job, getting my office to ring the police and tell them not to bother coming as it had been sorted out.
My car had only a scratch across the top of the wheelarch and a scuff on the bumper, I've polished one out and touched the other in. From the quick look I had it seemed he had a fairly large dent in his O/S/R door. A couple of days after the incident my cab controller phoned me to say he'd had some guy ring the office asking for me, wouldn't say what it was about, so he wasn't given any more information. What concerns me now is that I'm going to get a letter from my insurers saying that this guy is trying to claim off me for the dent in his car, we can only wait and see....
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D, hi,
this is exactly the sort of problem that I was talking about. (although if I had a passenger square up to me I have no idea what I'd do!) You give your details, who knows what kind of false claims the other party might make?
Did you follow up on tracing him with his name, reg no etc?
HF
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I recently found to my surprise just how much information you can get from the BT online directory enquiries system with very little to go on. Just a name and town will give you addresses and phone numbers, so giving either will allow the other person to get both. It appears to even list ex-directory numbers as my details were there, despite me asking for them to be kept off these databases. On checking the help files it appears you have to ask individually to be kept off the online system, the 192 system and the phone book.
As for whether you should provide details, I think you are best going on gut feeling. I can see no trouble giving insurance company and policy no - after all, you have to notify your insurer before they will pay out any claim.
I think that giving your name and address is more to help their insurer than anything, but as I found out with my recent incident the insurers can seemingly find out all this from just a registration number.
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O.K. H.F. eyes down for here we go and as a reminder to the rest…..
Firstly duties in case of accidents one has to consider:
If owing to the presence of a mechanically propelled vehicle (MPV) on a road an accident occurs where:
Personal injury is caused to a person other than the driver of that MPV (could be passenger in your car)
Or
Damage is caused to:
A vehicle other than that MPV or trailer drawn, or
To an animal other than an animal in or on the MPV (horse, cattle, ass, mule, sheep, pig, goat or dog), or
Any property constructed on, fixed to, growing in or otherwise forming part of land on which the road in question is situated or land adjacent to such land. (Road signs, hedges etc)
YOU MUST STOP
and if required to do so by any person having reasonable grounds, give:
Your name and address (note no requirement to give phone number), and
The name and address of the owner of the vehicle and the Registration Number.
If there is no one to give these details to then YOU MUST REPORT to the Police as soon as practicable and within 24 hours of the occurrence.
Failure to one or both of these is an offence.
Now where INJURY is involved to any other person then in addition to the supplying the above details then at the scene should produce a certificate of Insurance to the Police or any person having reasonable grounds for requiring it.
If there is no one available to show the Certificate to then YOU MUST REPORT to the police as above and show the Certificate.
Fail to do so is an offence.
So as a recap, if you are involved in an RTA with only injury to yourself and your car is damaged but no damage to the other vehicle, animal, or fixture then you need do nothing.
Taking this further it was argued many years ago at Training School that if you knock down and kill a Pedestrian and you STOP. You get out of the car and leave with the body your name and address, owners detail and vehicle VRM together with your valid certificate of insurance and then drive off, you have complied with law.
Road Traffic Act 1988 Section 170
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DVD,
Thanks for that.
I DO understand about stopping, it still worries me about the address though. You say about persons having 'reasonable grounds' for me giving them this information. What would be considered as reasonable grounds?
HF
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HF
Its not defined but basically the other party involved or any person who has suffered damage i.e. the owner of a hedge that has been damaged etc.
DVD.
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Another to try is www.192.com - I shocked my mum by typing in her name (my dad is the one listed in the Phone Book) and town and it showing her address and an aerial photo of the house! 192.com have access to the electoral roll.
I'm not sure what will happen to opting out now that 192 is being replaced by loads of competing 118xxx numbers.
James
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Steve and James - thanks for your replies, I find this disturbing too - I'm ex-directory and had mistakenly imagined that this kept me safe!
Big Brother is definitely all around us!!
HF
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A colleague was shunted by someone. After he submitted the claim the shunter (?) steamed round to his house and threatened him. The police were called and carted the shunter off.
What worries me is that the sort of people who have nearly driven into me in the past are not the sort of people I would want to give my address to.
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Exactly my point, Leif, and it's a little disturbing to know that by law we are required to give them this info.
HF
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A bus driver nearly drove into my can some months ago, then got out of his bus, approached my car, and threatened to visit my home and beat me up. (I later discovered the worrying detail that the bus depot was 50 yeards from my house.) Now if his bus had hit my car I would not have even got out of my vehicle. In fact I would have driven off crime or no crime and then reported the accident to the police. Surely the law allows for self perservation?
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Surely the law allows forself perservation?
I don't think it does, Leif, as it stands. Would be nice to se some new laws here that favoured the victim more than the perpetrator! I mean this in a total motoring-related stance, of course!
HF
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The best thing to do is what I do and carry one of those disposable cameras in the car, If you do get in an accident you can quickly snap the other car to gets its reg number and its also handy so you can send pictures to the insurers showing the position of the cars at the time of the crash. And a photo of the driver to prove who was driving at the time of the crash and I dont think the passengers will be keen to act phil mitchell if you have a nice colour photo of them for police use if needed. Actually looking on the internet at these gadget places you can get digital cameras that fit on a key ring and cost about £30,so it might be wise to invest in one of them.
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Tis a good idea, mod, I will think on it if I ever have £30 to spare.
HF
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Boy am I glad I went ex-directory. Just done a search using 192.com giving the minimum of information. Frightening, came up with a complete address and exact location map. Would have come up with my phone number too if I hadn't been ex-directory.
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I agree it's frightening - I can't access the information myself, but someone sent me a copy of the same thing, complete address and street map, which they obtained by giving just 2 words of information.
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The information found on 192.com is only an electronic version of the electoral register that you can publicly view down the Library. Its the same as on-line shopping really. You don't need to get out of the chair to get what you require.
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"..digital cameras that fit on a key ring and cost about £30"
Fun gadgets, but not very good cameras. Resolution may not be enough to get a good likeness or readable number plate - get a disposable film camera (with flash) and replace every 12 months to keep film fresh. Try not to store in car on really hot days (or just keep it in your bag).
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I have one of those key ring digitals. They store images using battery power and the battery runs down all the time, so for long term storage and emeragency use, I would say get a conventional film camera. In reality, digital image quality is of less importance than the effect of the very poor lenses they come with giving serious vignetting. 35mm film will always have better quality than a cheapo digital. You can pick up a reusable film camera for the same as, or even less then a disposable. I saw one for £2.99 recently in Superdrug, I think it was.
In a recent rear-end shunt, I was apolgetic to the guy who had run into me because he was very aggressively angry and I wished to mollify him if I possibly could. I tried to keep it to 'I am sorry that this has happened' rather than 'I am sorry, it is all my fault'. Interestingly, I had his insurance company ring me up continually (leaving messages on my answer machine) asking for the same information (my registration, insurance details, etc), but as I had supplied them once, I asked my insurance company to deal with them after that and declined to speak to his lot any further myself. That's what I pay my insurance for. I wondered whether they were ostensibly enquiring for details, but in reality wanting to speak to me and browbeat me a bit? In case you are wondering, damage to my car - absolutely nil, damage to his nice shiney Alpha - cracked and knackered front body coloured bumper. Ouch!
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FFX - You have had the car checked in a bodyshop haven't you? At first I thought my car was OK, but been a bit paranoid I had it checked, and the guy pointed out the fact that when you crawled underneat the car, the back panel had been bent by the impact, and my boot floor was lifted, but there was still no visible damage when standing outside the car...
Blue
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