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Just because you were charged 0.5 hr labour doesn't mean they spent a full 30 minutes on the car.
They will have a minimum labour time which needs to include some highly complex & technical expertise, learned at great expence - namely smiling & saying hello, depressing the wiper stalk, visually verifying that the wipers are not moving & recording your name & adress in order to produce an invoice on headed notepaper.
Welcome to the world of premium franchised dealership!
People everywhere tend to generalise & this forum is no different but it would be wrong to say that Audi dealers are worse than other franchises or that franchised dealers are worse than fast-fit or that fast-fit are worse than Greasy Joe under-the-arches.
What I can say (with some experience) is that in my opinion Audi are currently the best in terms of extracting customers' hard-earned from their wallets. Why they do it is obvious - because they can. Why do customers let them? I don't know but as long as they do, Audi dealerships will continue to charge high labour rates @ very high man-hours for the job in hand.
As to the job in question, as I have said before, all dealerships use the medical GP system of diagnosis - try the obvious fix & if it doesn't work then try the next most likely one then .....etc.
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It is not in the AA's best interests to scam you
It Is in the dealerships interests (so they think)!
If you can afford a premium car, they expect you to pay premium dealership rates
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I think GP's start at the other end of the spectrum. They are not getting income from the patient, so try the analgesic first! Dealers however may be tempted to start with something more expensive than aspirin. A lot more expensive in the case of Audi franchises - business expense accounts.....
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Having run MB's for many years now there is an important person or place you should find if you own a perceived premium make.
That is the elusive specialist indy who's been exclusively fettling your particular make of car for more years than he can remember.
My own MB indy has saved me thousands over the years, off the top of my head i would say £5k+ saved in the 9 years i have owned my present ageing beast alone. He does not fit new parts willy nilly till he finds the fault, he is old school who repairs if he can and finds the most economical fix..and services the car properly to boot.
No carpets at my indy, no 'free' expensive coffee, no managers, no receptionists good viewing though they may be, no glass showrooms and i don't get me car washed for 'free' either.....and i'm not paying for any of it...:-)
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No carpets at my indy, no 'free' expensive coffee, no managers, no receptionists good viewing though they may be, no glass showrooms and i don't get me car washed for 'free' either.....and i'm not paying for any of it...:-)
So true!
'Garages' that smell of shampoo and arabica coffee are not garages but sales boutiques.
I accompanied a friend to a dealership once. Everything you said was there-riggt down to the pretty receptionist. Depressing experience. Visits to the scrap yard are always more interesting-and informative.
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OP I'd be in that dealership tomorrow refusing to leave until I'd seen the dealer principle and a full refund had been given. This was a simple fault to diagnose and rectify and they should have done so.
Your situation is not much different to the scammer plumbers set up by Watchdog. They set up a simple fault, dodgy plumber arrives and before you know it your boiler will kill you and its a £3k job to replace it.
A call to trading standards would also be on my list.
It reminds me of when I had an A2 and I was at service reception. Someone called who also had one and it needed a new headlamp bulb. Quoted price was £95, bulb was £5 of that plus VAT! Audi said you had to remove the bonnet and bumper, knowing the A2 had a service flap, removing the bumper could be made to seen to be a difficult job as most owners never bothered and some reviews made it out that the bonnet couldn't be opened easily.
The bonnet can be removed in 5 seconds and to change the bulb the headlamp unit can then be removed in less than 5 minutes ready for a bulb change. 15 mins work max.
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That is the elusive specialist indy who's been exclusively fettling your particular make of car for more years than he can remember.
My own MB indy has saved me thousands over the years, off the top of my head i would say £5k+ saved in the 9 years i have owned my present ageing beast alone. He does not fit new parts willy nilly till he finds the fault, he is old school who repairs if he can and finds the most economical fix..and services the car properly to boot.
No carpets at my indy, no 'free' expensive coffee, no managers, no receptionists good viewing though they may be, no glass showrooms and i don't get me car washed for 'free' either.....and i'm not paying for any of it...:-)
I think that advice applies to any brand/model - with the possible execption of Ford/Vauxhall because every good indy will see plenty of those.
I don't drive a premium brand, quite the opposite, but finding a good indy specialist is just as important because even budget brand franchised dealers have an extortionate hourly rate.
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Having run MB's for many years now there is an important person or place you should find if you own a perceived premium make.
That is the elusive specialist indy who's been exclusively fettling your particular make of car for more years than he can remember.
Or an indy who knows mainstream cars well enough.
I used to go to a Ford dealer as he was friendly, and I was not ripped off. He went out of business, no doubt he was too honest. Then I went to another in the same chain, and I was well and truly stuffed. Items I thought were required for the MOT was only advisory, but it took a real shouting match on my part to get hold of the list of MOT items, to find that out. Sadly I only found out after having the work done. The salesman was very evasive. And when I went to the newly fixed car and pulled out, I heard a crunch. They had parked it alongside a low barrier made from 3" metal tubing. Invisible on approach to the car, and from inside, but next to the side. So there was a dent in several panels. And later on when I used the wind screen wipers I found they now made a loud banging noise as the driver side one hit the side of the screen. They had changed the blades, and done something wrong.
While the car was taken in I had a lift from one of the young mechanics to pick up my paper licence. He told me no-one was going there for servicing. They all had an MOT done, but the work was done at independents. Clearly they were short of business.
That experience cost me a lot of money, and made me discover independents. The only problem with independents is that they can be very very busy, so it can take a while to get something booked in. But you have the knowledge that the profit goes to the owner, who probably gets his hands dirty, and a small group of workers, rather than to pay the mortgage on a chrome and steel aircraft hanger, and fatten the pay checks of the managing director and associates.
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I do agree with all of the above but I have had excellent service from small, family owned, one make, dealerships. They know what they are doing and the workshop manager has a slightly oily overall and the time to discuss one's requirements face to face. I written up 2 of these in HJ's list of recommended garages. One is in Stamford Lincs and the other in Cottesmore Rutland; almost franchise indies!
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I think GP's start at the other end of the spectrum. They are not getting income from the patient, so try the analgesic first! Dealers however may be tempted to start with something more expensive than aspirin. A lot more expensive in the case of Audi franchises - business expense accounts.....
Doctors do have an oath, "first do no harm". Which in laymans terms is "if ain't broke, don't dick with it". However, even doctors have become more prone to making type II errors (faulty diagnoses leading to wasteful, expensive and possibly dangerous treatments and interventions). Always carefully weigh up the risks of type I and type II errors. Because of alarmist stories in the media, most people have become pre-occupied with the first (i.e the risk that an issue is missed, but the latter risk is widely ignored.
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Doctors do have an oath, "first do no harm".....
I think if dealers were told they had an average of 10 minutes per car, service costs would come down, but there would be a lot more broken down cars and crashes. Oddly enough, I know more than a few people who died prematurely or almost did, due to misdiagnosis. One person lost some hearing and touch sensation due to a doctor refusing to examine him despite requests, until someone else spotted a large tumour, and he received treatment far later than ideal, and he very nearly died.
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VAG technicians are on a bonus scheme for finding 'extra' work.
It's the only way the lads can make ends meet.
Edited by Hamsafar on 21/04/2012 at 01:12
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well, all I can say that Is that I've had excellent service from my local Audi dealer. They do what I ask at a pre- agreed fixed price and they have never tried to stitch me up. I've had a similar level of honest service from my local Mini dealer. Both have flash showrooms but have competed well on price with local independents, being only about 10% more expensive.
Both give reduced labour rates on cars over 3 years old.
Not all main dealers are out to get you.
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. Not all main dealers are out to get you.
Can't speak for VAG dealerships, but my local Mazda dealership are friendly, honest and competitive on price
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I agree that there are some very good small franchised dealers, even VAG ones! I realise this is tantamount to heresy on this site but not all main dealers are rubbish and, equally, not all indies are great.
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Not heresy at all, Pat - people must report what they find. As a general rule (and all such have exceptions) family-owned businesses hold customer service to be more of a priority than do large chains - who will get the fleet business on price whatever they do.
This is one of the reasons why Skoda score much higher in customer surveys than VW or Audi, many of whose cars are mechanically identical.
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''Not heresy at all, Pat - people must report what they find. As a general rule (and all such have exceptions) family-owned businesses hold customer service to be more of a priority than do large chains - who will get the fleet business on price whatever they do.''
Couldn't agree more Avant, my own experience with Northamptons family owned Toyota dealer (Sims) would back this up, servicing incl free courtesy car so reasonably priced as not to even consider using an indy.
Not only fairly priced but competent and don't look for unecessary work, plus when a fault common to my engine slightly showed its head out of warranty, they simply negotiated with Toyota head office (credit there too for real customer care, learn German makers) for the job (£1750 in parts alone) to fall under goodwill...none of the arguing and dodging certain other makers put forward for reasons not to.
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I myself visited my local Audi dealership with dia consequenses.I took my 2007 A3 in because of a juddery startup. I explained that Vosa had informed me that there is a fault on some of the injectors fitted to my year of production, & that Audi were performing free diagnosis as a goodwill gesture (later was made compulsory by vosa as a recall).I told them of my fault & booked my car in.3 hrs later I got a call saying my car is ready for collection. I arrived at the dealership & was presented with a bill for £107.50. I was very annoyed when they told me, no pay, no car! They laughed & said, nothing's free ere mate! So I gave them a copy of the email I had from Vosa telling them what's what. you know what the manager said?! We don't answer to Vosa ere! So I paid cos I needed my car & thought I'd get it refunded. They then gave me a printout of the diagnosis & it read, no faults found, no communication with EGR valve.Conclusion, new EGR valve needed. Huh! I had another Audi mechanic look at the diagnosis (he was on hols when my car went in) he laughed his head off. He asked who had done the diagnostic, I asked why? He said, of course there's no comms with the EGR valve. it's vacuum operated & not electronic. He said they could diagnose your grandmother & still get not fault on the EGR valve. There's nothing wrong with it at all he said! Still it cost me £107.50 to get a free diagnose wrongly diagnosed!!!!. I still have no refund as Vosa retracted their comments in the email to me. A spineless load of good for nothings! Thats both Audi & Vosa!
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