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If you use pre-wash before you soap a car, it makes no difference whatsoever as it washes the salt and major grime off before you soap the car down.
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Provided you let it soak in the rain for a few hours first (and wash it whilst still wet), that will dissolve all the grime - far better than any hosepipe...
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A question for stunorthants about winter washing:
Because we use studded tyres, the car gets covered with a mixture of tar, granite, and small particles of metal from the studs. The only method that seems to work is using a product called avfettning, which is 80% white spirit. 15% kerosene, and 5% surfactant. You spray it on and let it sit for a few minutes to melt the tar, then wash off with hot water otherwise the tar/avfettning mixture just sets again. The you have to pick of the metal bits and polish out the rust stain.
Any problem you can see with this method?
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Pre-wash is good idea yes as it lifts a large portion of the dirt from the paint so that when you do soap it down, you are moving as little dirt across the paint as possible. It also removes a fair degree of brake dust from wheels and also flies from the front end in the summer, all this reduces the need to scrub at a cars paint. Those fly remover pads make me cringe.
Dave N - I use white spirit as bought in the shops to remove tar, the only proviso is that I polish the paint afterwards as it removes all wax. Seems like alot of work but in the end, if it looks good and you see no lasting damage through your technique, usually means its working.
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stunorthants: Can you clarify? Is a prewash a good idea or not?
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I too, just Jetwash Hose the car down as it just gets filthy again as soon as i drive it for a couple of days, i just want to get rid of the salt/grit of the car
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Still waiting for my outside tap and hosepipe to thaw out. Been frozen since before Christmas.
Car now a ghostly shade of its former self.
Even resorted to using "driving gloves" some days - ah the memories came flooding back, even thought about using hand signals, but far too cold.
Was contemplating wearing a flat cap as well but there are limits.
Heated seats are really useful in this weather but ones hands stay cold, perhaps a heated steering wheel glove?
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I think some cars have heated steering wheels (maybe top-end Mercs?).
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I think some cars have heated steering wheels (maybe top-end Mercs?).
That really IS looking after your driver!
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Still waiting for my outside tap and hosepipe to thaw out. Been frozen since before Christmas.
It sounds sad but I took my hosereel in for a night to thaw it out, it was solid. Outside tap was ok though!
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I am usually quite fastidious about keeping my car clean but apart from the windows there seems little point in cleaning the car until the roads have been cleaned by a few days of heavy rain. If I cleaned the car this weekend it would be covered in salt the moment it took to the roads on Monday- why waste the time and effort.
Dry salt on the car won't do any significant damage, will it?
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Don't really understand this discussion.......what does 'washing a car' mean ?
Ted
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Don't really understand this discussion.......what does 'washing a car' mean ? Ted
Pedantic. Semantics. These words come to mind.
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Pedantic. Semantics. These words come to mind.
Aren't they owned by Zymol now?
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I havent washed mine since mid December and its in a really disgusting state now. I normally wash it every couple of weeks but its been so dirty this year that its almost pointless. I seem to have also not had a weekend spare to do it and dont use car washes as you spend all summer getting the swirls out!!
I will do it this weekend though as I dont kid when I say its gone from blue to black from the windows down. The salt/mud/grime combination can't be doing the bodywork much good!
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Hate to say it, but I'm also having problems with mine.
The whole front end is covered in insects of various sizes, the local birds are using it as a public lavatory, and the Cape Starlings are beating the snot out of themselves in the side mirrors at 5am every morning, waking the household, and excreting excitedly down the doors, and all over the windows.
Still, was out in the shorts and flipflops today, giving it a wash down...
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>Still, was out in the shorts and flipflops today, giving it a wash down...
Yeah, I think I'll do the same tomorrow.
It should be a balmy 21 o here in Basingstoke tomorrow morning. It'll be too hot (35 o ) by midday.
Kevin...
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So the football is all cancelled because there is a danger of the players getting heatstroke?
-9C in Pompey? Trying to explain to the locals exactly how cold that is...
"Now, go and stand in that blast freezer for an hour..."
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Fifth gear did a car wash test this week. The motorised wash actually ended up doing the least damage as both the jet wash used a brush to cover the car in grit and the hand wash managed to use a blade to dry the car, also covered in grit!
You also have to be careful with jet washes as the high pressure water can damage the paint. I am surprised no one does a hose add on with a car wash container that would soap the car gently rather than trying to blast the paint off....
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>>You also have to be careful with jet washes as the high pressure water can damage the paint<<
Only if your a complete tool. In ten years using pressure washers everyday, ive not yet damaged paint. All this junk about blasting paint off is just the result of people applying minimum common sense to a very simple task.
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Y'know Stu, anyone might think you had strong views on this......
;-)
PS Know anything about spreadsheets ?
Edited by Humph Backbridge on 09/01/2009 at 20:36
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Tee hee, yes I do, but as ever, people blame the tools when its really the person using them at fault.
I see so many members of the public using pressure washers, holding the nozzle inches from the paint, no method and with some sort of blind faith that using a brute of a machine will make their car clean.
I use the cheapest Karcher going but with the correct chemicals and technique which does a job good enough Im happy to charge for and people certainly pay for quite willingly! Pressure is only just enough to make your hand a bit sore even at the nozzle.
Spreadsheets - Ive got one across my bed, does that count?
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I see so many members of the public using pressure washers holding the nozzle inches from the paint no method and with some sort of blind faith that using a brute of a machine will make their car clean.
Agree with this poiunt.
It took some convincing to the first timers, valeting my vehicles, that they could stand there all day, pressure washer blasting at a film of dirt, for it to still be there afterwards, yet by letting the chemical do the job, you'd be better off just wiping the surface, with a cloth, anyway!!
VB
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I used a pressure washer on my newly acquired 10 year old nissan micra colette when I was at uni (feels like years ago!) and ended up with a nice red uneven stripe across the door!
It seems that the door at least had been badly resprayed at some point!
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I am surprised no one does a hose add on with a car wash container that would soap the car gently rather than trying to blast the paint off....
They do, its called a Gilmour and you can get them from cleanyourcar.co.uk I use mine with ValetPro pH neutral snow foam. Its a pre wash, then I hose down and then use normal shampoo (Megs HyperWash). I use a lambswool mitt to help reduce scratches.
Its a shame the feature on 5th gear did'nt include the best way to clean your car, the damage inflicked by the swirl-a-matic wash shocking.
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Why don't people just use a simple hose fed auto brush. There is a copious flow of water between delicated split hair bristles thus flushing away any surface debris. No high pressure damage to door seals or window seals just a constant flow of clean water and far less hassle to set up.
I would not dream of cleaning my car with my Karcher as I have seen what it can do to my fence, plastic garden furniture and painted rough cast masonry on my house.
As far as I'm concerned these pressure washers should only be used on driveways and patios etc. Perhaps fold here having been watching the Ideal World shopping channel too much!
However just before Xmas, I did treat myself to a Karcher T-racer 200 from Halfords. This is a hooded accessory containing a spinning jetted head and makes cleaning the drive/patio a doddle as there is practically no spray back to get yourself soaked as it floats across the surface like a hovercraft.
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oldgit,
have you used the T200 on a patio yet? Does it clean as well as the high pressure cone?
It takes me 8hrs to clean the damn patio each Spring and I'm absolutely soaked at the end of it.
Kevin...
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"It takes me 8hrs to clean the damn patio each Spring"
What! Are you using a toothbrush?
It takes me about 30 minutes to watch my wife doing it once a week with a high pressure hose and a yard brush.
Actually I was very tempted by an upright patio cleaner from Lidl over the Summer, it had spinning brushes and everything but it just didn't look heavy enough to get the job done.
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>What! Are you using a toothbrush?
I have tried it but it needed over 500 tubes of Colgate. It cost me an absolute fortune!
>It takes me about 30 minutes to watch my wife doing it once a week..
;-)
>with a high pressure hose and a yard brush.
Max? Is that you?
Kevin...
PS. Daimler prices are dropping. I'm beginning to think that I can make-do without the fancy rear seat option.
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Yeah a couple more super 8s on this week, all a bit elderly for you though but one at 4,400 - and with individual rear seats - very tempting. I'm looking to change in May so it'll be interesting to see how things go.
If you don't want the fancy rear seats you can check out the XJRs - a bit sort of settling for second best though isn't it?
Edited by Big Bad Dave on 10/01/2009 at 00:29
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oldgit have you used the T200 on a patio yet? Does it clean as well as the high pressure cone?
SNIPQUOTE!!!! (putting this in bold and LARGE txt in the hope you finally get the message!!!
It's marvellous. Words cannot express my pleasure! Maybe the pressure is not so concentrated in one place, obviously, but the head floats over the surface and you can just go backwards and forwards so easily.
My patio is particulary difficult, as the stone is a very porous 'synthetic' blend and a pale sandy colour and so is always/was difficult to clean.
The main benefit, also, is that I don't have to put so much protective outerwear - just ear defenders and wellies.
It's the best £38 I have spent in that store.
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 10/01/2009 at 15:06
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I bought a T200 copy from ALDI a couple of years ago, very good results on block paving, no detergent required. I do mine each spring. Dont move it too fast over the surface or you will get a spiral swirl effect!
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>>Why don't people just use a simple hose fed auto brush. There is a copious flow of water<<
Because using a hosepipe uses alot more water. Pressure washers are very efficient with water use if used correctly and if you care even a little about water conservation, they make sense.
This stuff about high pressure damage - think of it like this in terms of being struck in the face - while a pressure washer has the ability to pack a hard, damaging punch, if you use human judgement and tact, you can brush over the surface without causing damage.
This is in essence why giving any old fool a pressure washer can cause problems - use one everyday and you instinctively know how to get the best from them but this is the same as a great many power tools - I could do untold damage with a welding torch for instance but with training you learn how to use them.
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SNIPQUOTE - sigh!!Because using a hosepipe uses alot more water. Pressure washers are very efficient with water
Well, I am on a meter anyway and so pay for what I use and I am able to turn off the water when I need to. I am only cleaning my car as a private citizen not as a valeting business, where very little water seems to be used!!!
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 10/01/2009 at 15:06
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Why don't people just use a simple hose fed auto brush.
Because it trashes your paint work, the grit gets trapped between the hard bristles and creates swirls.
I would not dream of cleaning my car with my Karcher as I have seen what it can do to my fence plastic garden furniture and painted rough cast masonry on my house. As far as I'm concerned these pressure washers should only be used on driveways and patios etc. Perhaps fold here having been watching the Ideal World shopping channel too much!
No, nothing to do with shopping channel. Used sensibly a PW can do a much better job of cleaning, but used badly, just like using a brush, can cause a great deal of damage. Valeters and detailers make a living out of correcting damage done by brushs, car washes and dirty sponges.
However just before Xmas I did treat myself to a Karcher T-racer 200 from Halfords. This is a hooded accessory containing a spinning jetted head and makes cleaning the drive/patio
Good stuff! Bin the spinning thing and get a foaming lance, fill it with some good snow foam like Bilt Hamer or ValetPro stuff, mix with warm water and coat the car with a good layer of foam. Leave it to dwell and watch the dirt fall off. Rinse, then do a normally wash with a good quality lambswool mitt, any dirt left gets absorbed into the thick pile of the mitt. Always use good quality shampoo to help lube the wash.
Bin the chamois, get a drying towl, again thick soft pile and if you want, get something like Meguires Last Touch and mist it on whilst your drying to remove water spots.
Hope thats of help.
James
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As far as I'm concerned these pressure washers should only be used on driveways and patios etc.
The only person I've seen cleaning a slabbed drive with a pressure washer ended up with all the slabs rocking about because it had disturbed the soil/sand underneath. He had to have the drive relaid.
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You only get grit in a chammy or on a blade if you a) drop it in grit or dont clean it before you use it or b) dont use pre-wash and/or dont rinse the car properly before you dry it off.
I dont personally favour thoe blades though - great for clearing the windscreen in the mornings but not much cop for drying a car quickly and comprehensivly.
I use a Vileda synthetic chamois which I suspend in a bucket of water and I clean it with my Karcher before I dry off every car. Keeping it in a bucket of water and giving it a thorough clean before use stops grit getting ingrained in it.
5th gear are no less sensationalist than TG in making a complete hash of the tasks they set in order to get dramatic conclusions. Its a grit invasion!!!
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If I was ever to wash my car, I wouldn't use a pressure washer...to much hassle to get out and put away. Not washed the Suzi since July. It got very mucky on trip to Cumbria in rain on M6 but after coming home and standing for a couple of days in more rain it didn't look too bad....and still doesn't ! Easiest way was to take £1.20 out of your pocket and give it to the IMO man. Sad day when they finished.
Ted
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Just imagine spending a lot of effort and water washing a (white) 53 seater coach on its return from a run using country lanes in winter.
Stand back pleased with one's effort only to see it return later that day having used the same country lanes, sides and back just as mucky as before you started.
Welcome to the life of a coach driver (who is employed by an operator who does not employ a little man to wash coaches, other than the little man who drives them).
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I use a Foam Lance with my Bosch pressure washer to coat the car in a thick foam, after a few minutes I blast the thick dirt off and then wash using the two bucket method. Seems to do the job from what I can see, I'll probably give it a blast tomorrow as the alloys are looking rotten at the moment, plus I don't want to encourage the rot that I suspect is lurking in the front wings!
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