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You say in one of your posts that the shims are easy to get out, i had a go today pressing the shoulder of the cam follower down & still couldn't get the shim out. any tips please?
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Inlet valves should be adjusted, though that won't cause the slow cranking.
Put a voltmeter (multimeter) between engine and neg. battery terminal; then starter and pos. battery terminal, to see which is giving you the greater potential difference.
Edited by mfarrow on 19/07/2008 at 20:27
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The cause of the slow cranking needs to be found and dealt with.
>>Put a voltmeter (multimeter) between engine and neg. battery terminal; then starter and pos. battery terminal, to see which is giving you the greater potential difference.
To add to Mike's excellent suggestions for finding the fault - these voltage drop measurements need to be done while actually cranking, and, for clarification, the measurement should be done between the large terminal on the starter and the battery positive.
The inlets closing is exactly why the valve clearances need adjusting - you need to fit thinner shims. The closed inlet valves will be causing a loss of compression which will be making starting more difficult than it should be.
When you've fixed both the electrical problem causing the slow cranking AND the valve clearances, it will be a different car!
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need to be done while actually cranking
Well spotted I forgot that bit!
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Getting different views on the valve clearances.
Put a voltmeter across the engine & neg on battery. Which setting on meter. OHMS?
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>>Getting different views on the valve clearances.
In what way? Yes, the tight inlet clearances won't cause the slow cranking, but, they will be making the engine more difficult to start than it needs to be. They need doing.
>>Put a voltmeter across the engine & neg on battery. Which setting on meter. OHMS?
Volts! What these tests are doing is finding how much voltage is lost in poor connections while the circuit is under load. I'll give you some more detail.
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There are 2 tests, you need to do both of them;
1
Put the positive lead of the voltmeter onto the body of the starter.
Put the negative lead onto the negative battery post itself (note, use the battery post itself, not the terminal.
Set the voltmeter on a voltage range, and switch the meter on.
Crank the engine, while reading the meter, then, tell us the reading.
2
Put the positive lead of the voltmeter the Positive battery post itself (note, use the battery post itself, not the terminal.
Put the negative lead onto the male thread of the main positive terminal of the starter motor.
Set the voltmeter on a voltage range, and switch the meter on.
Crank the engine, while reading the meter, then, tell us the reading.
You'll find that until you crank the engine, the voltmeter reads zero. If the part of the circuit you're testing is OK, you'll probalby read something leass than 0.5 volts being dropped during cranking. But, do the tests, and tell us the results.
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Knowing the position of the starter on these engines [really awkwardly located down the back of the engine for those lucky enough not to have worked on them!], you'll probably need 3 people. One near the battery, who can read the meter, one under the car connecting to the starter motor, and one who can turn the key to crank the engine over.
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I've just realised, the way I wrote out the steps for test 2 is amiguous (I didn't specify which of the large terminals on the starter solenoid to test from). Here's a better attempt.
2
Put the positive lead of the voltmeter the Positive battery post itself (note, use the battery post itself, not the terminal.
Put the negative lead onto the male thread of the positive terminal of the starter motor - the one on the starter solenoid which is closer to the body of the starter motor.
Set the voltmeter on a voltage range, and switch the meter on.
Crank the engine, while reading the meter, then, tell us the reading.
For test 1, you'll find that until you crank the engine, the voltmeter reads zero. For test 2, you'll find the meter initially reads battery voltage, but drops when you begin cranking.
If the part of the circuit you're testing is OK, you'll probalby read something leass than 0.5 volts being dropped during cranking. But, do the tests, and tell us the results.
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Number cruncher,
got someone coming round to be the 3rd person around 12 so will let you know soon after that.
thanks for your patience
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the reading from starter body/battery negative was 0.47
the reading from thread on solenoid/battery was 0.20
engine was warmish
battery voltage was 13.11
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all of those figures are reasonable no problem there, realy needs a cold test as well, next thing would be to test it with a set of jumpleads on from another vehicle and see if it cranks any faster (from cold)
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I agree with topbloke, those voltage drops across the wiring look OK.
>>battery voltage was 13.11
Was that during cranking? (I doubt it!, it sounds too high - you're looking for greater than about 10 volts during cranking, I would expect 10.5 to 11 volts.)
As the voltage drop tests have ruled out the wiring between the battery and starter (and the contact in the starter solenoid), there are only 3 possibilities for slow cranking. Poor battery, poor starter, or excessive drag/friction in the engine itself.
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agree with NC thats why next test should be jumpstart/boost start, if still the same suspect starter, if better then battery, if no different then engine, has this engine got hot/overheated to you knowledge ! try dropping/dis-engageing clutch when cranking
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sorry i didn't say when the battery was measured. the 13.11v was the battery's voltage before we did anything. Its a new battery (saturday) & the correct one for the car. the starter was replaced about 8 months ago for a new one. that didn't make any difference to the turn over speed.
using jump leads doesn't give a noticeable difference.
I don't know if its ever got too hot as was like this when i bought it.
i will do the tests again when cold but won't be able to until next weekend.
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Did you manage to get to the bottom of this problem..
My 1.5td doesn't turn slowly but I do have to turn the glow plugs on twice to get it to fire first time..
Really interested to know the outcome of this fault as these are tricky to cure..
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>>My 1.5td doesn't turn slowly but I do have to turn the glow plugs on twice to get it to fire first time..
Check your valve clearances! If they haven't been done for a while, you'll find the inlets have no clearance, and you are losing compression - hence poor starting.
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Not sure how much help this'll be,But had the same fault on a different car years ago.exact same symptoms.As with you,followed procedure outlined by NC,vehicle had new bat and starter,Even went to the point of fitting seperate new earth leads to engine and box to no result.gave up and retuned car.several months later it returned with a sliping clutch.renewed the clutch,and to my amazment found the cranking speed to now be normal.Not sugesting you have the same problem.who would believe a clutch could cut cranking speed in half.I dont count that one.accidental discovery.owner did'nt care,just happy with improved starting,Never did find out what fault the origonal clutch had.And to be honest,I never would have suspected or looked there.Hope you find the fault in yours.
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caine,
Was there a bad electrical connection between the starter motor flange and the bellhousing?
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