Hi guys
I wonder what your thoughts are about this.
I bought a 2003, 53 plate Skoda Octavia vRS from a main dealer in July 2007. A condition of the sale was that the car was serviced according to manufacturers guidelines prior to collection. In addition to this as an "approved used car" it is subject to 1 years extended manufacturers warranty / RAC breakdown cover. Prior to signing for the car I enquired when the cambelt change was due and was told be the service department that it was due to be inspected at 60K miles, and at 20K intervals thereafter, before finally being changed at 120K miles. They backed this up by showing me the offical Skoda service schedule, which stated as much. I therefore ordered the car and collected it in mid July.
It came to my attention a few weeks later that VAG was advising all cambelts be changed at 4 years, regardless of mileage. I therefore Emailed Skoda UK customer services for clarification. They confirmed that since 16 May 2006 all cambelts on the 1.8 petrol engine (AUQ) across the VAG group were due to be changed at 180K KM (approx 118K miles) or 4 years, whichever occured sooner.
Armed with this information I visited my local Skoda dealership this morning. They again assured me that the belt change was not due and insisted that they were unaware of the need to change the belt at 4 years, despite my Email from Skoda UK. Furthermore they assured me that if the belt was to fail within the extended warranty period, it, and all the subsequent damage resultant would be fully covered.
This dealer appears to have an excellent reputation locally and I personally know several people who have bought cars from, and had them maintained by them for many years. I must admit though that I'm somewhat concerned by the apparent discrepancy in advice given by Skoda and a franchised dealer. I therefore decided to ring round a few dealers and was told the following:
dealer 1 - belt change at 120K miles, no time proviso (cost £450)
dealer 2 - belt change at 4 years or 120K miles (cost £320)
dealer 3 - belt change at 60K miles, no time priviso (cost £350)
dealer 4 - belt change at 4 years or 120K miles regardless of mileage (cost £250)
dealer 5 - didn't return my call !!
As you can see only 2 follow the manufacturers recommendation of changing the belt at 4 years or 180K KM, 1 other seems to have invented their own recomdendation (60K miles) and the other agrees with my local dealer (120K miles, no time proviso).
The problem as I see it is that the belt should have been changed when the car was serviced prior to my collecting it. My dealer says no, whereas Skoda UK say yes. I have therefore sent another Email to Skoda customer services this afternoon asking them to confirm my extended warranty is valid, despite the cambelt not being replaced at 4 years. If they say it is invalid I suppose I'll be off to speak to my local dealership again, as the warranty is presumably underwritten by the maufacturer, not the issuing dealership. The local dealership did however tell me today that this was their final position on the matter.
Sorry for the long post, but I wanted to include as much detail as possible. Any thoughts / advice on how to proceed??
many thanks.
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Await your email from Skoda UK - if they confirm the belt should've already been changed and your warranty is invalid because it hasn't been, then tackle your original dealer.
However, your car wasn't actually 4 years old when you bought it - it's on a 53 plate so technically still isn't 4y/o. If that's their way of thinking too, it's your responsibility under the warranty to ensure that, when the car is 4 years old you take appropriate action and get the belt changed.
I'd take my business outside the main dealer network anyway - take it to an independent VW specialist who will use genuine VAG parts and hopefully charge less than any of your 5 dealers, whilst doing exactly the same job (the guy probably would've worked for one of your 5 dealers at some point!)
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Thanks for your reply
The car is 4 years old on 01/09/2007. I purchased it on 13 July 2007. I specifically enquired when the cambelt change was due prior to purchase as I would have used an imminent belt change as a bargaining tool. My dealer assured me it was not due, and with no reason to doubt them I accepted it. I guess I'll know better next time !!
I've checked with 2 specialists (JBS & Jabbasport) who have come in at £370 (inc VAT and water pump) and £245 (inc VAT, no water pump) respectively.
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Not sure about VAG petrols, but the advice with the diesels is always to get the water pump changed with the belt, so I'd be paying the extra. Does seem a bit steep, but I'm not sure what the job involves on that engine.
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It strikes me that the supplying dealer was technically correct in stating that a cambelt change wasn't due, but was perhaps being less cautious (over-cautious?) that the typical backroomer would be.
I would second Greg's advice to change the water pump too. As I've reported here before, the water pump impeller on Gromit Snr's 1.6 Octavia failed at 34,000 miles/4 years old resulting in a ?1000 repair bill.
This is a known problem on the 1.4, 1.6 and (I believe) 1.8 petrols, and is common enough that our local dealer had the parts in stock to do the rebuild the same day the failure happened.
HTH,
Gromit
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A result of sorts.
I had a chat with a nice fellow from Skoda UK this morning. He again confirmed the cambelt change was due at 4 years and that my extended warranty would be invalidated if the belt was not changed. He also expressed concern that a franshised dealer was giving advice to customers which was contrary to the guidance issued by VAG back in May 2006. He offered to speak to the dealership on my behalf, but I instead decided to have a chat with the service manager and tell him my concerns (my previous visits to the dealership all resulted in conversations with the sales manager). The upshot of all this was an offer to change the cambelt at approximately 25% of the usual cost price.
I have decided to accept their offer and hope this is the end of the matter.
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Seems like a result - of a sort.
Incidentally, I have a November 1999 VW Bora. The cambelt is supposed to be changed at 60k, but about two years ago VW released the information that it should now be done at 40k.
At present the Bora has done 62.5k on what is I presume, based on the service history, the original cambelt - for various reasons, mainly due to my other half's health problems and critical hospital appointments all over the NW, replacement keeps being put off.
Yet the car is still running like clockwork, the cambelt appears to be OK and it's still sporting its original battery and exhaust...:-)
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What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
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Good luck but surely cambelts run perfecty until the moment of failure ;-).....................I speak as one who changes the Asra cambelt every 4 years (as recommended) but wonder if, at 3k per annum, I am being over-cauttous even if this is exactly in line with Vauxhall recommendations
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Incidentally I have a November 1999 VW Bora. The cambelt is supposed to be changed at 60k but about two years ago VW released the information that it should now be done at 40k.
Yet the car is still running like clockwork the cambelt appears to be OK andit's still sporting its original battery and exhaust...:-) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The nice chap from Skoda customer services told me that the new time proviso on cambelts applies to all models across the VAG range fitted with a cambelt, which AFAIK is all of them !
The problem with cambelts though is the consequences of sudden failure, whereas I guess we all change exhausts and batteries AFTER they fail.
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Also with belts it isnt always the belt thats the problem.
As well as the water pump mentioned there is the tensioner and various pulleys. There have been spates of problems with tensioners.
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I'll be buying the cambelt, tensioner and water pump belt from GSF - last time I looked it was done as a kit for about £76 (OEM products) - I do know a reliable independent to do the work; the problem is that the car is tied up so much on urgent journeys...:-(
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What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
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I just had my daughter's SEAT Ibiza 1.2 (the VAG 3cyl *cam-chain* engine) serviced at 3yrs / 30K the other day.
I chatted to the Service Manager and he said SEAT make no specific recommendations on changing cambelts, other than that they're checked periodically. However he said he recommended changinging them at 4yrs or 50K miles, and that we should have ours changed next year! He told me it would cost about £350.
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The 4 cambelt change appears to be a VAG UK thing and VW dealers are sprouting leaflets extolling the benefits of a 4 year change. However, a german friend checked with VW gmbH and they appear to be running to what the service book says (milage) rather than age.
Who knows :-(
Joe
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The 60k replacement applies to all VAG based products - I've had the same advice for a Leon Cupra, an Octavia VRS and 4x4, and Audi A3 1.8T and I know of someone who just did his on a Golf GTi at 55 to be safe.
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I was in a VW dealership yesterday and asked when the calmbelt was due to be done on my passat diesal 130 bhp. 60000miles or 4 years which ever is first.
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The 60k replacement applies to all VAG based products -
So that means 3 of the 4 dealers who advised the OP told him the wrong thing?
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It appears so !!
I did mention this fact to Skoda customer services for good measure.
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Not necessarily the wrong thing, but the thing that saves them having to tell you that breaks at 60k and slightly over are alarmingly common on those engines, especially the 20VT it seems - I'm looking at Leon Cupras currently, and even though Seat books show 120k the dealers will still recommend a full belt, tensioner and waterpump change at 60k, with checks at every successive 30k. Alfa did the same thing with the twinsparks, halving the interval to 36k.
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i would be interested in this belt checking
what exactly will they be looking for?
i changed a punto belt yesterday and the only checking i thought worth doing was pulling on the water pump for play
maybe they are looking for arrows that point to cracks that have been put there by the car fairies?
ive had a few belts go in my time and i can assure everyone there was no warning just no go-go just a very unpleasant stoppo
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i would be interested in this belt checking
Excellent point BB - unless they have some special issue X-ray specs, you can't do a complete check on a cam belt, because there's always the possibility of internal damage or delamination.
I admit that there are some problems which can be detected by belt inspections, but, the fact that there are serious problems which cannot be detected means that inspections can't really be relied upon. In fact, once you have the covers off, you may as well carry on and put a new belt on.
Number_Cruncher
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In fact once you have the covers off you may as well carry on and put a new belt on.
I imagine that's what happens - take covers off, "examine" belt, then call customer with much sucking through teeth and say "while we've got the covers off we might as well replace the belt - only £xxx"
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Sorry to dredge this old post up again but this morning I received a flyer from my local Skoda dealer informing me that due to a change in guidelines from VAG they were now recommending cambelt changes at 4 years or 40K miles.
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Are you going back there then ?
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Sorry, I should have updated my original post first. I eventually had the belt/tensioner done at my local dealer, at a cost roughly 25% of their usual retail charge for the job (£100). I eventually got sick of arguing with them and decided to get the job done when they offered me the deal.
I shouldn't think I will still own the car when it is due for it's next service, but can't imagine I'd be using them again.
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Thanks for your response re the final outcome.
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