Hi all,
I'm usually a reader rather than writer of post (namely as I dont have much to add, most the time!).
My lovely 306 dturbo (97) got shunted in yesterday, it was a hit and run affair. As you can imagine, police havent a clue, the car's value being peanuts, having TPFT (which I really, really dont want to ever claim from), left me with looking at new cars.
This year ill be doing only an average 12k miles, however 85%+ will be motorway journeys without a doubt. Prefer a diesel due to power delivery, but I'm realistic and having spent enough time on these forums, the only diesel I'll touch is a VAG PD unit.
Whilst I absolutely adore the dynamics on my 306 when thrown around, I rarely do so these days, so a mk4 Golf in terms of handling would be fine. I would like to stick to the small hatchback range, not too keen on a Mondeo as I rarely haul that much with me, unless there's something really compelling to do so.
I want to spend around £4k on my next car, and have 2 yrs no claims with 0 accidents in my past, but I'm under 25. So far, quotes for the Golf in PD115 form have come out at £600~ for the year, which I think is reasonable though I've only tried confused + comparethemarket. Focus on a 2litre petrol comes the same price, Xsara a little less.
Shortlist so far :
Citreon Xsara hatchback, petrol (1.6+), possibly the HDI if i'm feeling risky
Golf mk4 diesel (PD 90 - 115 or maybe 130) or petrol (1.6 - 1.8)
Ford Focus, petrol (1.6 - 2.0)
Any more suggestions for a small hatchback, to fit the above criteria?
I really do not care about image of a car, what matters to me is decent ride quality, reasonable MPG on motorway trips, a bit of refinement (those XUD's certainly needed drowning out!!!), reliable, and when it does have issues, reasonable cost of repair.
What is the opinion on the PD's reliability? I'm reading that apart from the odd MAF sensor and the occasional unit that likes to go belly up, they're pretty reliable?
What is the general consensus on the first generation HDI units that the Xsara would use, in terms of reliability? Having spoke to my local garages lately, they're mentioning getting a lot of PSA diesels in, but being a garage, ofcourse they're going to run into problem common rails... however, I really dont fancy spending £1k+ to get an injector seen to.
Thanks in advance for advice!
|
|
Sorry to add nothing (!), but you could do a lot worse than the Focus Mk1...
|
|
My thoughts precisely... loads to choose from, too.
|
Focus mk1 is the only thing that gets close dynamically to the 306. A fine car, and very durable. I put 100,000 miles on one in 3 years and outside of servicing and tyres it needed a couple of bulbs and an auxiliary belt tensioner. Still felt taut and fresh when it went back as well.
Cheers
DP
--
04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
|
|
Certainly is from the hours I've spent driving a focus myself. Will try a few others to give myself a bit of perspective, but I dont think I can shake off the great dynamics of the 306 that easily...
|
|
|
|
Hi Smokescreen,
Have done 20,000 miles in a Xsara HDi 110 since November, and had no problems. Is a 53 reg, now done 46,000 miles and I love the car. The electrics are all working with no problem, and is an SX with auto lights, wipers and electric windows all round. Car still feels solid and is a very comfortable commuter.
Got taken up to pick it up in a 53 reg Golf TDi. Had a scare on the way home as the diagnostic indicator came up on the Golf on the way home- and was slightly down on power, and had a few squeaks and rattles.
I paid £4100 from Auction using Joe Dowd, including all fees. The car really gives me a feel good factor.
Because of the miles I do I normally change cars often (buy cheap, then sell on before lose money) but prices for the Xsara are still above what I paid, and I am very disinclined to sell the car. If the car does go, it would be replaced by another Xsara, but probably an estate.
And if you read my posts from my pre Citroen days, I was extremely anti French having had an appalling experience with a ZX in the 90s.
As for refinement, it's not perfect, but would say is no worse than any others in its class.
And due to prejudice can pick them up cheaply.
|
Hi PW,
Thanks for that. The prejudice works totally in my favour, so I'm not complaining! The refinement in the HDI 110 Xsara is fine for me, spent a good few hours in one. Anyone know the HDI's cambelt change interval?
|
|
|
|
Ooh! I've had all of those on your list.
I'd steer clear of the Xsara. I had a T plate 1.8 Exclusive. It was exceedingly comfortable, fairly quick, but the car never really felt alive. The handling was a bit wallowy. I must say that it was superbly reliable though.
Next up was the Golf GT TDi 130. Great car, vicious acceleration. Solidly put together, not overly economical although that was more to do with how I drove it!! Comfortable, quick and well screwed together.
However, I would really recommed the Focus. I had an 03 plate Focus Zetec 2.0 3 door. It was an absolute pleasure to drive, acceleration good, sure footed on the road, good looking [esp in 3 door form]. Supremely reliable, and I'd have another one tomorrow.
Go for the focus - you will not regret it.
|
I should clarify my comment - I would only steer clear of the Xsara beacause the Focus was so good. The xsara was an excellent car, did everything I asked of it and no electrical gremlins what so ever.
Comparing the Xsara and the Focus, the Focus wins hands down every time.
|
|
|
Don't know wether Citroen have beefed up the suspension for the diesels, but would not say mine feels wallowy. Yes, the bulk of my mileage is motorway, but took it for a short break down to Bude in July and car has always felt surefooted to me.
Would guess the heavier added weight from the diesel engine does help as it is a comparatively light car, and in comparison my ZX was quite wobbly on the road.
Additionally, the metal itself seems to be a vast improvement as someone sneezing anywhere near the vicinity of my ZX would seem to dent it, whereas the Xsara is relatively unmarked.
Oh, and economy is good, although the computer seems slightly pessimistic. Travelling at 75-80 normally gives me 47- 50+ mpg, and doing my own calculations has not given below 43, 44 for 'spitired' driving.
Is only car have ever owned where keep finding extra features by accident (like follow me home lights).
|
|
If the Xsara is based on the 306 floorplan, then it would be pretty sure footed even with the heavy diesel engine in the front. I have to admit, I do think to myself that I can live without the 306's dynamics and smooth ride but I'm not so sure. Think ill try an Xsara HDI and a Focus 2.0 Ghia this weekend and see what I could live with. Though to be honest, i'm already edging towards a petrol focus just to avoid potential HDI nightmares!
|
|
Keep yours eyes open for a tidy and cared-for Xsara with the old TD engine then
|
|
I dont know if it was just my engine, but the noise levels at 3k RPMs on my 306 dturbo (which is the older TD) can be a real headache without music or something drowning it out! Think ill pass this time, despite it being indestructable.
|
|
|
|
Smokescreen -
Sorry to be contentious - but what are these "potential HDi nightmares"? As I recall, there has been a lot of discussion on here about the possibility of mis-fuelling causing not immediate but postponed problems. I know common-rail diesels have a number of expensive components, but I don't have the impression that the HDi is unreliable at all. I have personally bought, for various members of the family, over a period of some five years, four second-hand Peugeot 306 HDi, which between them have now knocked up a big mileage, with very few problems indeed, and NONE of them engine problems.
To anyone out there who HAS had engine problems with the HDi 2 litre unit (which I seem to remember turns up in a wide variety of manufacturers' models) - let's hear from you!
If I had to change my car tomorrow I'd probably go for another 306 HDi.
|
Well as mentioned, spoke to a few mechanics on the matter, as well as been observant on the matter. Its not just Peugeot who have these issues. What it comes down to, is that I rather not put myself in a position and pay £1k+ for a repair on a common rail diesel repair when that money could be spent elsewhere like travelling, and I only do 12k a year so the fuel savings per tank wont really counter it either.
I have to admit, the PSA HDI first gen's dont seem as vulnerable as the Ford+PSA units so far, I'm just managing the risk a little. Yes i'll miss that torque if I choose petrol without a doubt. If only I could come across such a statistical set with a large sample :-p
One garage I spoke to said that for their 'warranty' they'd put in writing that premature injector failures would be covered. Naturally if that was the case, I'd want them to define 1) what is regarded as premature and 2) who is actually supplying this so called warranty... wonder if they'll define point 1, nevermind actually cough up in such event!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
You could add the Skoda Fabia or Octavia 1.9 TDI to your list - Fabia is a bit smaller than the Golf, Octavia a bit larger. You might get a newer one for your money than you would a Golf.
The 105 bhp engine is quite lively enough for the Fabia, and many people are quite satisfied with it in the Octavia. The Fabia vRS has 130 bhp but I don't think they've been around long enough to go for £4,000.
|
Fabia vRS has 130 bhp but I don't think they've been around long enough to go for £4 000.
Even the early ones are still fetching £8k+
One of the most astonishing (in a good way) cars I've driven for years. The way it chucks itself down the road from pretty much tickover just makes you laugh.
Cheers
DP
--
04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
|
|
|
|
The Skoda Octavia's not a bad idea at all, along with the Fabia, however from where I live, there's not many around the £4k mark and I dont really want to spend much more especially with plenty of Focuses to choose from.
|
|
|
|
Just an update, using insuresupermarket.com , insurance for a 1.8LX focus 2001-02 is £390 tpft, only a few £ more than what I paid for my 306 dturbo for the year. Mind you, the 1.8 is a group 6 car, so I was expecting something low.
Will check out some cars this weekend, including a HDI Xsara and report back.
|
|
|
