If you saw it was a red route, why stop? Turn left just after Kings Cross and there's loads of dropping off space.
I agree that in this case the punishment hardly fits the crime when the traffic is quiet - one bus neatly blocks 2 lanes of traffic waiting at those traffic lights!
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Could you say the pasenger jumped out even though you told them not to?
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Hi Dulwich
There is a similar case over on the Pepipoo parking ticket forum at the moment and it looks like the later stage TFL paperwork is flawed and therefore non compliant.
the thread is here
tinyurl.com/y2vosu
The initial circumstances are the same, stopping on a red route, there is a missing initial ticket in that thread but once appealed it looks like TFL issue badly worded documents which could well be appealable.
Might be useful if you are up for a fight.
HTH
As always
Mark
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Happened last week; I had an evening with emotional passengers on board due to family health issue, was trying to stay calm and follow poor car parking and shopping centre signs in an unknown neighbourhood, and was determined not to speed despite serious provocation from hacked off others on a 30mph dual carriageway. The result was that my usual observation skills failed me and I didn't realise that I was driving in a restricted area for "Pedestrians and authorised vehicles only" until reading the restriction cancellation. Sure, I saw the "20" sign going in, but to my great embarassment with everything going on I didn't "read" the longhand text that accompanied it and all the usual excessive road furniture. Of course, neatly above the restriction cancellation sign was what looked very much like the small ANPR cameras that fit inside "goldfish bowls" like on part of the M6, clearly trained on the traffic lights where I was stopped.
I wonder if my letter will drop through the door in the next week?!
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Welcome to living under a Communist Regime.
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Welcome to living under a Communist Regime.
Thanks for the laugh, but erm, no. Not even remotely.
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>> Welcome to living under a Communist Regime. >> Thanks for the laugh, but erm, no. Not even remotely.
No, not even close having listened to my Czech wife's family, but here's the next step in the direction of a controlled state, at least:
"Up periscopes!" indeed: news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/6252499.stm
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Well, do you think you are the only one who would stop in the lane just to let someone out? What if every one did it just to let someone out. That is why the fine is there.....i.e. as a deterent. If no fine, maybe scores more people would do what you did.
Don't get me wrong, I am just playing devils advocate and looking beyond the "you" only part of the equation. In the past couple of weeks, wasn't there a town where the traffic wardens were on strike? I believe chaos was caused in the parking restriction areas because people could park with impunity. Same principle I think...i.e. if you know you can get away with it, you will do it. If there is a risk of a fine, 60% of you will not do it, but 40% may do it and suffer the consequences.
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Yes, technically the OP broke the rules, but IMO, the thing that grates about this sort of incident is that there are a great many wrongs in this country that are in far more pressing need of righting than the scandalous iniquity that is people stopping on a deserted red route for ten seconds to set down passengers.
However, faced with a need for easy (and lucrative) results, those in authority will always choose the option that involves picking the motorist's pocket. A further factor that makes this sort of thing even more oppressive is the extreme reluctance (if not outright refusal) to accept any extenuating circumstances, let alone apply any sort of "de minimis" rule. This forum is littered with examples of this sort of inflexibility reported by members.
Given that most traffic management schemes these days seem to have the aim (whether explicit or not) of increasing congestion to deter car use, they can hardly claim that this enforcement is for any reason other than to generate revenue and make life unpleasant for drivers.
I am genuinely interested to know how these enforcement cameras work. What happens if there's a queue of stopped traffic (e.g. in rush hour? How does it differentiate between that and (e.g.) illegally parked cars - is someone in a control centre watching the cameras and pressing a button to take a picture and issue a penalty notice?
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I've already paid by cheque - I just didn't want reminding in few weeks time when a credit card bill or debit card statement comes through. I've forgotten about already - I wish!
Going back to paulb's post - what if I had stopped in the middle of the road i.e. lane 2 or 3 and put my bonnet up and nosed around inside for a minute or two? Now that might cause some queues but if it saves £50 I might even do it next time.
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"Well, do you think you are the only one who would stop in the lane just to let someone out? What if every one did it just to let someone out. That is why the fine is there.....i.e. as a deterent. If no fine, maybe scores more people would do what you did."
Tack, this a motoring forum. You don't work for TfL do you ? Do you really have a car and use it in a town ?
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Bad luck, DE. Thanks for the warning - which road was it exactly? I usually stop on the East side of York Way, which is confoundedly inconvenient.
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Thanks MM. My mood has lightened a bit since the last post - I was planning to change a few thousand UK pounds to Euros today and for probably the first time in my life got it right. I waited until this afternoon and after the BoE announcement. A right result - by waiting I made rather more than the £50 penalty.
The offence was made on the West side of York Way by the side of the station. The red route bays on the east side were full and I had nowhere else to go. Next time I'll keep circling and circling until one is free and stuff the emissions. The camera shot was from behind, somewhere up high at the main junction.
I probably got caught because I didn't use my invisibility flashers - they seem to work for others !
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>>>>>>>>>"Tack, this a motoring forum. You don't work for TfL do you ? Do you really have a car and use it in a town ?"
Dulwich, as I stated in my post, I was acting as devils advocate. I was looking at it from the other side of the coin, not just yours. Yes I do have a car, I use it in town and in the country. I have had the occasional parking ticket. However, I have been caught fair and square, paid up and moved on. Yes it has been irritating, but the irritation is in being caught and having to pay up.
Everyone who drives a car knows that drivers are easy meat for this most surveilled populace in the world. Bus lane cameras, junction box cameras, traffic light cameras, speed cameras, school run cameras etc. It is easy to forget that and then get caught doing something innocuous but penalty carrying. It certainly brings you up short with shock that someone would actually think "Well, he only stopped for 10 seconds, but hell, I won't use my discretion....let's fine him"
I wasn't being unsympathetic, just looking at it from another point of view.
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Used to be, they asked you to move on if they were there and you seemed likely to get in the way.
Now it's all computerised and automatic. The efficiency! The profit!
It's true that for most of the week in business hours that bit of pavement is an inferno of buses with the two tight lanes outside it also swarming with motorised, you know, stuff, hurrying eastwards.
Even round the corner to the left you have to stay on your toes.
Hard luck DE. Might have been worth arguing mind you. I think the people operating these things are often just trying it on. If you tell them to go forth and multiply and you long for a chance to argue the case in front of a magistrate they might just go forth and multiply, after a bit of further bluster. But you are upping the ante. 50 quid might be cheap for peace of mind.
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Covenient to King's Cross is Drummond Street, which has lots of parking plus on the road that runs across the top of street. Added bonus is after you off-load your passenger, you can go to the wonderful Ambala (Indian) Sweetmeat shop (mmmmm) and the Diwani bel puri for a meal - take away is good but meal in is something else and you can eat for about £7.50....... think I need an excuse to go to London .....!
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If they were half as efficient catching muggers, London would be a much nicer place to live and work.
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Unfortunately muggers don't have registration plates, and if they did they would be false!
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Surprisingly, as I'm not a regular visitor to that neck of the woods, I found myself urgently called to the station next door. Not having time to skirt around the congestion zone that cost me £8 and then one hour parking at 40p per 6 minutes cost....... yes, four quid an hour.
£12 and breaking no rules at all almost makes the £50 penalty last Sunday seem a bargain.
Welcome to driving in London.
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Unfortunately muggers don't have registration plates, and if they did they would be false!
Ah, the nub of the issue! Even if a mugger/rapist/murderer (alleged) is caught on camera, there is still an onus on the authorities to prove that this person was doing what it appeared, and probably requires witnesses to support it. Eventually, after months of investigation, they are found guilty and let off with a caution - weel, we wouldnt want to infringe there Human Rights but putting them in a jail where they cant get drugs or enjoy conjugal rights or suffer a bit of overcrowding..................BUT, if you are a motorist with a nice shiny number plate, JOB DONE! Nice NIP on the doormat, pay up or else!
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