Well Hello Hector G.......
I have a brand new model I want to put on the market and I want sales, sales, sales. (It's not very good but don't tell anybody.)
I am therefore inviting you to a slap up weekend to test drive the model when your every whim will be taken care of accommodation 6 star, fine wines, Gordon Blue cuisine - you name it, it is yours. FREE FREE FREE FREE FREE.
You drive the car and so that you can continue this style of enjoyment from other manufacturers are you going to write up a bad report?????????
Now I bet HJ is going to say cynical moi......
DVD
|
Well I for one would use the word cynical with regard to your comments in the case of genuine motoring journalists/correspondents.
The reviews to obviously avoid/ignore are those written by (mostly) non-journalists for use in the Motors classified advertising section of their weekly or free sheet publications.
Mind you it's easy to tell from the fawning, everything is wonderful style of such reviews/tests just exactly what reliance can be placed on their findings.
Genuine motoring correspondents are well used to being "wined and dined" as you put it, but it won't affect their overall view of a particular new vehicle; a classic example was the launch in Greece of the then new shape Ford Escort.
Almost to a man/woman the writers berated it, resulting in Ford having to spend some £1bn to put matters right; a spinoff was that Ford, learning from the experience, also ensured that the new Mondeo in 1993 was as good as it possibly could be from the start.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
|
|
|
Unless you get to be a TV pundit with your own show, notwithstanding personal opinions Jeremy Clarkson does even up the
balance somewhat.
|
|
|
|
Who writes this stuff!!
hmmm
Hopefully people with more experience than the general public(me)with good knowledge of cars.If we do not agree with their opinions doesnt mean to say they are wrong does it.Funny how they say something we dont think is right(including me)and then we call them a waste of time.Everybody has their opinion we just hope that the so called experts know more than we do or else every review is a waste of time?I have driven a 2year old polo and thought it was a good little car!!!
|
|
surely the best "testers" (apart fm HJ, of course) are BRs - unbiased, realistic and purely subjective with no manufacturer's PR operation or publication's Advtg dept leaning, however subtlely. BRs report to this site, honestly. Only ever take a journalist's "test drive" report as at best a guide. You want to know about a new car? Then test it yourself, soon as your local dealer gets one.
|
>>journalist's "test drive" report as at best a guide.>>
Another cynical observation that is not worthy, as I've also pointed out in another posting above, in the case of genuine motoring journalists/correspondents.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
|
The guy who used to live next door was the photographer for Car magazine and he lived the life of reilly. He would disappear for a week and then pop up red eyed and sun tanned and I'd say 'where have you been' and he'd say 'oh Ford launched the new whatever in Tunisia'. His tales of the car companies wining and dinging of him and his colleagues were amazing. What a life!
Anyway he gave it all up for reasons I won't go in to in case he reads/posts here, he is a car nut, and moved to Dublin.
Hi to him if he reads this. You never did fix that damn MG did you?
|
"Seems to me that a lot of the reviews on the Golf GTI are a bit biased becuase people want to love the car, like they did the old Mark 1."
I passed one parked in the village this afternoon which had a set of worry beads hanging from the rear view mirror. Different from PFDs. I remember the bus drivers in Athens having them, and touching holy pictures as they went for a dodgy overtake.
|
|
|
|
surely the best "testers" (apart fm HJ, of course) are BRs - unbiased, realistic and purely subjective with no manufacturer's PR operation or publication's Advtg dept leaning, however subtlely. BRs report to this site, honestly. Only ever take a journalist's "test drive" report as at best a guide. You want to know about a new car? Then test it yourself, soon as your local dealer gets one.
El Hacko,
The above is a wind-up' isn't it?
The great majority of owners 'defend' their choice of car. That's why owner's satisfaction surveys are a joke.
C
|
|
oh heaven forbid ...no wind-up, Cardew - my point is that if you want to find out what a car's like, drive it yourself, don't rely on someone else's opinion. I'm a journo and enjoy reading published "road tests" - but these reports are all stories in the final analysis. Would you buy a holiday because someone wrote that it was great?
|
oh heaven forbid ...no wind-up, Cardew - my point is that if you want to find out what a car's like, drive it yourself, don't rely on someone else's opinion. I'm a journo and enjoy reading published "road tests" - but these reports are all stories in the final analysis. Would you buy a holiday because someone wrote that it was great?
We are all aware that motoring hacks have to tread a fine line between writing frank appraisals on a car and upsetting the manufacturer. IIRC HJ wrote that he was cold shouldered by a manufacturer because of some criticism he made. For a long while Citroen would not advertise in Car magazine for the same reasons.
That said we get to know the style of certain journalists and can read between the lines of their reports and a picture emerges on a car you may be interested in buying.
Not so with owners. For a start most of us do not drive enough cars to make meaningful comparisons. However, most importantly there is an inbuilt reluctance to slag off your own car. There is a marked lack of objectivity - witness the last JD Power and Top Gear owner surveys where even the bottom cars scored an overall 7 out of 10. All Skoda owners seem to congratulate themselves on buying a car that is so much more reliable than a VW! Alfas have no reliability problems. Diesels are in every way preferable to petrol versions - soooo much torque. They have owned French cars since the 2CV was introduced and never had a problem.
So if it comes to a choice between motoring hacks and even the august members of the BR, I will take the former.
|
Why is it that seat,skoda drivers are always happier than vw drivers in surveys?
made by VAG!!
mazda made by ford(ultra reliable)
my last 2 fords have had suspension problems!!!
When all said if i like a car i buy it not because its more reliable than something else(jap cars are so mundane)but because all cars are of a decent quility nowdays(my brands better than your brand)!!!!!
|
If you read/can get hold of a copy of today's Daily Mail (Feb 26), turn to the contents on Page 95.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
|
Stuart,
Read that - a scathing report on the Chrysler Crossfire - summed up as "plasticky, appallingly designed .. all mouth and no trousers."
If Chrysler ran full page adverts in the Daily Mail I wonder if it would have been toned down.
He conceded that the car goes, handles and stops well and, as it is made in Germany, "it goes like stink and the basic engineering is probably top-rate"(it is essentially a Merc SLK). However then goes on to slag off American cars in general and particularly Chrysler.
He conceded that at American prices(£16k) it is a bargain and at £20k "the price it should be in UK" he would recommend it
Whilst there can be good and bad value, to my mind a bad car is a bad car regardless of price.
I thought it a rather strange report.
C
|
>>I thought it a rather strange report.>>
But the point I attempted to make - that genuine motoring journalists do deliver criticism when it is necesssary - I believe has been shown to be valid.
Car manufacturers' advertising should have no impact on road tests - any editor worth his/her mettle will stand up for his/her journalists through thick and thin providing their reports are fair and constructive.
For most people a car, after their property, is the most expensive purchase they are likely to make; road tests should reflect whether or not it will be a sound acquisition taking into account various parameters.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
|
Car manufacturers' advertising should have no impact on road tests - any editor worth his/her mettle will stand up for his/her journalists through thick and thin providing their reports are fair and constructive.
Stuart,
Agreed they shouldn't have an impact - but IMO they do and it would be naive to think otherwise. Perhaps HJ will enlighten us on his past experieces.
As for "any editor worth his/her mettle". Well again IMO few of them are. They will sell their souls, and frequently do; newspaper owners call the shots.
I agree that report(it was not a road test) was scathing but IMO it was atypical.
C
|
As someone who was an MJ for 15 years I speak from experience - I have also had the solid support of various editors after advertisers, usually major franchised dealerships, occasionally took exception to some road tests' findings.
Threats of withdrawing advertising were sometimes carried out, but within a short period had been reinstated - the subsequent downfall in sales at such dealerships quickly focussed their minds on their predicament.
Obviously classified advertising departments don't like such situations, but editorial integrity is, or very much should be, paramount.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
|
He conceded that at American prices(£16k) it is a bargain and at £20k "the price it should be in UK" he would recommend it Whilst there can be good and bad value, to my mind a bad car is a bad car regardless of price. I thought it a rather strange report.
He's not actually saying the car is that bad but if your looking at spending the sort of money you would need to to buy a crossfire there are better alternatives.
Its the same story with the VW Phaeton - not a bad car, in fact it's meant to be quite good but for the £40k+ it costs you'd be better off looking at a Beemer or Merc
|
Age - mine - certainly allows reviews to be put in context. I am amused that newer always means better, so for example, watch the Mondeo start to lose stars in W*** C*** and comments such as 'looking its age' emerge. The new Passat will of course be better than anything produced more than two years ago, for no reason other than....newer hi-tech gadgets!! Give me a break.
And, while in rant mode, what does build quality actually mean - does anyone test door closing fit after 5 years of life? No, thought not. What is refinement - quietness?
There is no single person responsible, even within one publication it seems, for ensuring comparability with car ratings - I've read that the X-type's noisy at speed and quiet on motorways!
The Signum - see my other post on this - gets fewer stars than the Vectra because it will have fewer buyers "because Brits don't like exec hatchbacks" apparently. So, what's that to do with stars rating?
|
Have to agree that reviews certainly need to be taken with a very stron pinch of salt.
After reading many reviews on small hatchbacks I made a short-list of toyota yaris, Seat Ibiza, VW polo, Ford Fiesta. The reviews for the seat were very good as were the polo ones. Needless to say I thought they were both dreadful - IMHO the Polo interior looks like something from 1960 whilst nearly all the reviews said the SEAT was the "drivers car" , in my experience it certainly wasn't - steering was completely numb, ride poor & acceleration ashthmatic. In the end I choose the Fiesta - which was slated in a lot of reviews. (Yaris was just too small)
Guess what it does prove is that everyone has differing priorities/preferences & it's essential you test-drive as many different models as you can before buying - can't believe that people buy cars without a decent test-drive & without trying some alternatives ??
|
|
|
|
|
|
