Merseyside was a pretty safe place to drive not having to look for vans
You could just look at the speedo from time to time, and then you'd not have to worry about vans on bridges ...
|
I had a feeling you'd be along.
>>You could just look at the speedo from time to time, and then you'd not have to worry about vans on bridges <<
Assuming of course I'm unknowlingly speeding.
--
Adam
|
i applaud anyone who priorities driving safely about undue concentration on adehrance to arbitary speed limit
as for people manning vans on bridges no doubt they will say they were only following orders when the revolution comes
|
sorry should say
i applaud anyone who prioritises driving safely above undue concentration on adherence to arbitrary speed limit
|
|
Assuming of course I'm unknowlingly speeding.
I hope you'll be as honest when the NIP arrives ...
|
I'm sure you want an argument NW - really I am!
Firstly, whether or not I'm right or wrong is not really the issue here to be honest. Much as I value your opinion on these matters, albeit skewed, I don't really need any morals.
>>I hope you'll be as honest when the NIP arrives ...<<
Of course. I hope you're not suggesting that I would pervert the course of justice should, some would argue the inevitable happen?
Personally, I accept the risk, keep my eyes peeled and take my chances. I've had a few lucky escapes with traps which I take as a warning to be even more observant rather than abide by the limits everywhere.
Before you go labelling me as an immature youth who speeds recklessly, I am young and you won't find any shortage of people stepping up to call me immature ;-)
I'll say what I always do. I don't speed past schools, shops - anything like that. I do speed on the motorway and other quick roads but as to whether you find that acceptable or not (you probably don't), I don't really care.
Don't get me wrong - I value everyone's opinion on here and you come across as a generally nice and funny person, who, if there was a backroom meet, would be on my top 10 list of people to talk to. I just think our views differ so catastrophically that it sometimes appears that I'm being rude when I'm replying to you which purely is not the case. I just disagree with you more times than anyone else!!! But what the hell. It's great honing the debating skills...really it is!
;-)
--
Adam
|
You don't have to be young to enjoy going fast, Adam. You have to be safe both for yourself and others so that you can enjoy going fast when you are older. I am er in my mid 50s ish and still enjoy it. In my area on the roads I use most there are no speed cameras(yet!). Like you, I don't speed in built up areas, etc., and I believe, as do many others, that 99% attention to what is going on outside the vehicle and will need reaction, with 1% attention to the dials etc. is better than 80% attention and 20% with an eye on the dials. There will always be different points of view on this, as with the rest of life. It would be absolutely devastating to be responsible for causing serious injury or death to another road user of any sort and that is always the primary principle I apply.
|
Thanks MJM.
It's hard to explain myself without coming across as a "let's burn all speed cameras" type of person. That really isn't my intention - I suppose my quarrel is with the limits themselves but that's another issue.
I like to think of myself as an "aware" driver. I'm one who believes that the quicker you go on the motorway, the more alert you are for potential hazards but again - probably the wrong place to put this.
Personally, I'd rather be looking for kids/prams/people/other cars on the road rather than gatsos/camera vans/potholes but because they're there, we'll just have to adapt. There will always be people who are more aware than others no matter how much they try. RF does what I deem to be a sensible speed on the motorway and has never been done since 1983 yet you hear of some people doing 35 once and being hit. Hopefully it will never happen to me but if I did kill someone and I was speeding dangerously (i.e. - it being my fault) then I would find it difficult - nigh on impossible to drive again.
--
Adam
|
|
You've got it, Adam. The road I use every day has a 40mph limit through a village. The limit is just right. I observe it religiously, even going well under it if the conditions dictate it.Without a speed camera to enforce it, either. Drive and enjoy doing it!
|
|
|
|
|
Hallelujah, brother! And I have my bus pass but sometimes, just sometimes, when no-one's looking . . .
|
|
|
|
Hi Adam, sorry for the belated reply ... but I really wasn't trying to label you "as an immature youth who speeds recklessly". Far from it: I actually think you sound very much less reckless than most young folk.
In fact, are you sure that you aren't really some pensioner winding us all up by pretending to be a young'un? [grin]
But you're right, we have difft views on speeding ... though I wouldn't view you as being reckless. Just not equipped with as quite as many recks as I would like folks to be :)
But seriously, my point was about how anyone would handle a NIP which arrived when they knew they had been intentionally speeding. It wasn't intended as a dig at you, but I can see from the way I wrote it that it might have come across that way. If so, sorry -- that wasn't my intention.
It seems to me that some people will try anything to get off, even when they know that they broke the law: some of the cases on pepipoo could be read as being about folks who are trying any trick available to avoid getting the rap for an offence knowingly and intentionally committed.
Maybe I am too much of a moralist, but I reckon that if someone is caught when intentionally breaking the law, they should say "fair cop" and take it on the chin.
|
I too am sorry NW. I wasn't in the best of moods when I posted that. If I was ragging past a camera then I'd own up. If I got an N.I.P for 32-33 then I would fight it. For the obvious reason but also in light of the possibly innaccuracies of the Gatso. Much faster though and I would cough up whether I agree with it or not.
but I really wasn't trying to label you "as an immature youth who speeds recklessly"<<
You should be....I am!
;-)
--
Adam
|
Whether to own up? A tough one...
If I went past a camera in a 30 limit at 90ish then I would probably remember doing so and would own up. But that hasn't happened and won't happen.
Most of the times I approach a camera my speedo is either reading below the limit or within a few mph of the limit at most. Now, say I am distracted at the crucial moment by a different potential hazard, and just before braking for that hazard I pass the camera at an indicated 36, and trigger it. What then?
Easy: I would use every "trick" I could think of. Why? Because what NoWheels calls a trick, is in fact an attempt to make the SCP prove that I have actually comitted the offence, as they are required to do in any prosecution. The important factor is that I do not know whether I have offended; even if my speedo read 36 it may have been faulty. Even this assumes that I can recall the speedo reading; ask yourselves what speed you were travelling at on 5 January 2005 at 8:03am (say) - I don't know about you, but I can't remember.
Put simply, I am not in the habit of pleading guilty when I do not know whether I offended!
|
"Most of the times I approach a camera my speedo is either reading below the limit or within a few mph of the limit"
Luadable
"Now, say I am distracted at the crucial moment by a different potential hazard, and just before braking for that hazard I pass the camera at an indicated 36, and trigger it. What then?"
Well firstly I would ask why having been distracted by a potential habit your speed went up when surely it should come down?
"Put simply, I am not in the habit of pleading guilty when I do not know whether I offended!"
You dont have to, you can challenge every intended prosecution in court. If you fail you pay costs.
|
why having been distracted ....
Answer: "Most of the times I approach a camera..." Anyway, it's a hypothetical scenario.
You dont have to, you can challenge every intended prosecution in court. If you fail you pay costs.
My post was to answer NoWheels' question as to why use "tricks" to evade prosecution; why not just admit it. I wanted to show that, being human, I might not know whether or not I was guilty. For other offences, it might be reasonable to call them "tricks"; I would probably remember whether or not I knifed someone a fortnight ago. But speeding is different, and that is why.
This is not a justification for speeding, merely a justification for defending a prosecution for speeding.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Dear All,
I am a Merseysider and can confirm that a scheme is NOW operating in St Helens - not a full speed camera partnership, but actions to the effect of.
I made a personal prediction that this would spread to the entire county, and after seeing this topic I don't doubt it.
In April 2004! it was planned to create a partnership
snipurl.com/c288
but this was disbanded
snipurl.com/c286
BUT there is 'hope' of it being reformed (page 2).
---------------
I am in a county now where there is a massive speed camera pertnership. on my way to town, i passed a radar that flashes if u r going too fast, then a 30 gatso, then another warning radar. Same again on the way home...what fun. By the way i was never NOT in a mobile camera zone!
going to bed, i heard about 10 cars souped up doing 50-60 in a residential, yet main road with double parked cars. If you ask me, get the traffic units on patrol!
|
jbyron,
I've shrunk the url's you posted as they screwed up the page width, but the second link didn't work before I even attempted shrinking it.
DD.
|
|
|
jbyron,
I'm from St Helens myself and I know a while back they were going to form one but it got shelved. Apparently it's taking off again.
I've seen a few traps but these have been civilians.
Thanks for the info - most interesting.
--
Adam
|
|
|
|
|
