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I have 3 classics (or heaps of junk for the non-initiated) in regular use at the moment. \'68 Morris Minor van, \'71 Morris Minor 2 door saloon and a \'73 Rover 3500S. None of them give much street cred, impress women much (except the missus god bless her), but I love driving them. Still have room for a few more....
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My first car after i had passed my test was a 20 quid Austin A40, my neighbour had a scrapyard and he fixed this one up for me with a MOT, boy it was a belter never let me down, started everytime, but when i took it in for its MOT it was going to cost me 60 quid, so my neighbour just did me up a Ford Anglia instead, until us women could apply for HP, remember gents, then us women were chattels not allowed a mortgage or HP, had a Chrysler Avenger loved it to bits, had a Datsun 120y but they were a lot more expensive than 20 quid.
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Women couldn't apply for a mortgage of HP? I thought that was before the Married Women's Property Act 1882...
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Why not have the best of both worlds? Buy an e-type replica or something similar...or isn't that a classic? Been thinking about it and think a modern build replica makes a lot of sense over an original...classic style with modern reliability and no rust...you know it makes sense!
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Fair point Gen and I can see entirely what you mean...but! An e-type replica is not practical for a family. I've mentioned before that I can't afford two cars. I know that you've mentioned previously that a classic should cost from £10-15k. I can afford less than 10% of that!!
Besides, to me at least, a replica would totally be missing the point. I know that it would be reliable, but the last thing that a true classic car enthusiast wants is a reliable car! We enjoy sorting problems, repairing stuff and fettling. OK, so it's not so much fun in the persisting rain at night, but the AA only costs £43.
As has been mentioned in previous threads (not yours, IIRC Gen), classic cars can be confused with cars that you have a fond memory of. Not a problem as far as I am concerned.
I guess I just don't find over complex cars a thrill. At least you know where you are with a classic. I'm afraid that I do not find the idea of traipsing off to the garage every time another of the many lights on the dash lights up appealing. My 1986 Granada is the most complex car that I have ever owned, and it is going to stay that way!
I reckon that this thread has demonstrated perfectly the old saying 'live and let live'. One man's classic is most definitely another man's banger!
Here endeth the lesson...;-)
Cheers
Rob
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Well, if I had a choice I\'d have a Bristol FLF bus, and a nice shiny Bristol car.
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Got a 74 beetle in bits undergoing total body off resto at the moment. Suppose some may class it as a classic, personally I would have preferred pre war Morris or Austin but couldn't get one that half retorable.
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Other than the blindingly obvious (a M***** O****d), then I'd suggest a Yugo 45, particularly those sold by the dear departed Swithland Motors group, remembered by all in the retail motor industry for an inimitable series of adverts starring a character called Wally...
And if that's not good enough I'll don my flatcap, put on my check sports jacket, dust off the stringbacks and saunter off in an Alvis TD21.
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Theere's no need to actually own a classic car.
Join the Classic Car Club www.classiccarclub.co.uk/
Must be getting on for 60 cars to have the use of nationwide.
Best 2 grand I ever spent.
Here's some pics of the ones I've been out in so far.
myweb.tiscali.co.uk/humungus/
(avoid the Mustang page if you are on dial-up, it's rather large)
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I've got a 1967 Riley Elf stored in a back corner of my garage. Been meaning to attend to the floor (well the airspace where a floor was!) for years now. Might be a project for when I retire (or fail MY MOT - whichever comes first!
Graeme.
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Have had second thoughts now.
1950s: Jaguar XK 120 drophead, Bentley Continental;
1960s: aforementioned Alvis, Aston DB5, Lamborghini Miura SV, Ferrari 275GTB, roadgoing GT40; Mini Cooper S; E-Type 3.8; M****s O****d; Cobra 427; Growler's Mustang; Healey 3000; Rover P5; MGB GT V8
1970s: the same Porsche 911E; Ferrari 365 GTB/4 Daytona; Corvette Stingray; Golf GTi;
1980s: Audi quattro coupe; Jaguar XJS V12 Convertible; Ford Escort RS Turbo (the ultimate turbo-nutter b*****d car); Caterham Seven.
1990s McLaren F1; Ferrari 456 GT; BMW M5; Merc E300 TD
Now beat that, guys & gals
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Oops, forgot summat: 1980s: Ford Sierra Cosworth RS500
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Saw the first XK120 at Earl's Court 1948 - right up close but they would not let me sit in it (erk's uniform?). I was definitely going to have one as soon as the world came right; while I knew the 1945 election was a disaster I could not then comprehend how comprehensive it was.
The XK was, of course, about a decade behind the Alfa 8C-2900.
Tomo.
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Did I miss it, or has nobody mentioned the Capri 3000? If you needed a matching car for your mid-life crisis in 1976, this had to be it. Disco fever on wheels.
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There should be a separate section for the whole RS family - Capri RS3100, Escort RS1800, Escort RS2000, Escort RS Turbo, Sierra RS Cosworth, Escort RS Cosworth...even the RS200.
Which brings me on to one of those 'is this frame big enough for my head' moments. I got invited to a tyre company bash at Donington Park a few years ago, just after the rally bigwigs had outlawed cars like the RS200, and was lucky enough to get chauffeured round the loop by the late, great Roger Clark.
He was bus running his Porsche dealership in those days, but could still turn it on, raising my heart rate through the roof as he slung this thing round. By the time he'd finished you could smell the oil and watch the tyres steaming...what a man.
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Ther local ford guys put together some awesome beasts back in the 70s and 80s - 250 build, so they could race them as 'production' cars ...
There was a V8 Capri (Pirana), a v8 Sierra (XR8) and some 2.4l Escorts.
All these are still much sought-after vehicles.
The other manufacturers came up with a few equally muscly cars - the BMW 335, Opel Kadett (astra) 2litre superboss, etc.
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Ian, didn't they also do a Cortina XR6? I seem to remember Ford's rally bosses trying that one out over here in competition trim in the mid to late 70s with a view to taking it rallying. Didn't work out in the end, but opened our eyes to some of the monsters being turned out in SA.
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Yep, the old XR6 - 3litre V6, and went like stink!
In circa 1981, my father was tech director of a large electronics firm. He borrowed an XR6 for a weekend from the local Ford garage - it was company car time, and the dealers were falling over themselves to be nice to the company, and sell them lots of cars...
At the time, my mother had just learnt to drive, with the instructor having a pale blue VW Beetle, which wasn't exactly built for speed. Father turns up in this large red beast, and takes mother for a spin, "to see how you like it"...
Returned white-faced a short while later. Mother, used to having to put her foot down to get anything out of the beetle, had tried the same trick with the Ford as she straightened out after turning a corner... vast amounts of black rubber left on road, and the back end sliding like crazy!
Net result - no XR6 for father! He opted for a Chevrolet Commodore instead, which was a poor substitute in my teenage opinion.
Oh, the other great South African Ford was the one-ton pick-up, based on the Cortina. They were available in 1.6, 2.0, 2.5 and 3L versions, and even in 4X4! I believe many made it to britain.
A local bloke is writing a book about all the "made in SA for SA" vehicles - including all of the above-mewntioned, and many more besides... I can't wait!
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Having got all the \'cars I\'d buy if I won the lottery\' out of my head, how about these as classics?
Alfa Romeo GTV2000/ Alfasud 1.5Ti; 1980s BMW 325i (the ultimate yuppie car?); Citroen CX Familiale seven seater (an early MPV?); Fiesta XR2 and Escort XR3i (they set the hot hatch fires burning); Sierra XR4 (remember how the plastic sills used to stain within days? And the \'Belgian bi-plane\' wing?); Fiat Panda (remember the fold-down fabric seats?); Honda Prelude with 4WS; Mazda RX-7; Peugeot 205 GTi; Porsche 928; Renault 5GT Turbo (a hot hatch so hot it vapourised the fuel!); Rover 800 Coupe (but only with the 2.7 V6, thank you); Saab 99 Turbo (the true start of the turbo era); Toyota MR2 and Celica 2.0GT; Vauxhall Calibra Turbo; VW Polo C Formel E (the one with the automatic stop-start device to save you fuel in traffic); Volvo 340 (the ultimate geriatric mobile).
Now try and beat that lot...
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Ok been sitting here to see if some of my wagons come up, they have, been horrified by some of the cars mentioned (marina, xr2) so here is my contribution
citroen traction avant. If you want to pull a babe its easy in one of those.
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Absolutely right. Those rear hinged front doors are perfect for alighting without grazing the shine on your jackboots or splitting those tight jodhpurs.
One of the few decent French cars ever made.
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Fiat 500 Abarth. Astonishingly fast for an aircooled 500 cc twin.
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People rave about the Beetle. I had a 66 one which was awful. Far from being reliable it was always going wrong. I got very good at lifting out the engine single handed and replacing dropped valves and beat-up pistons, although when reassembling I never got those complex heater air ducts to go back right. I hated the thing and sold it to a University professor who tried to sue me for his money back....
Classic can equal awful and I think the 1970's is a classic (oops) repository of autonotive ghastliness. If "classics" echo the social climate of the era, as someone said, nothing could typify better was was an awful decade generally.
My brother's 1979 Triumph Toledo -- broke down 3 times in the first week he had it. British Leyland's finest hour, not.
My cousin's TR-7: this spent so much time in the shop being fixed I'm not even sure he ever actually drove it. So he changed it for a Fiat X-19 (he was a bit of a slow learner).
My sister's 1975 Allegro whose rear windshield popped out when it was being jacked up to have a wheel changed.
The Fiat 124 (still made till recently in Turkey believe it or not) with wafer thin panels. The Fiat 125 (fast version).
The Vauxhall Chevette I hired in 1978 at Heathrow..well, 'nuff said about that.
But my other cousin's Datsun 120Y (the one that looked like a Coke bottle and came in a fetching turquoise) was a super car. Appalling to look at but wonderful to drive, and, boring boring, never went wrong.
Now, if you have ever been to Australia, the Holden FX and FJ of the 1950's are true classics. Many around even today out in the bush. Absolutely indestructible until they eventually imploded into a heap of rust.
...but for me it has to be the Yanks: the 1949 Ford Sedan, the 1956 Crown Victoria with the complicated roof that folded back into the trunk, the "Christine" Plymouth of 1957 with those wow fins and the push button gear change, the 3000 Miles to Graceland '59 Caddy and the 52 Buick Straight 8 with the shark's teeth grille. The Studebaker Champion 1954 (lovely little flathead 6, ran one very briefly)and the '57 Buick Le Sabre where you floored the gas pedal to start the engine, the '59 Chevy with those enormous flat horizontal rear fins. Fortunately all of these are alive and well and a visit to any US classic car show will find most of them. Pure rock 'n roll.
..enough already
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Oh dear,
I've owned quite a few of the 'Classics' mentioned above.
Fond memories of the Alfasud, horrid memories of the E-Type (Biggest disappointment ever. I'd wanted one since I was 14 and when I got it it had all the dynamic qualities of a very fast blancmange)
The one I never had, already mentioned above....
Lotus Ford Cortina 1. With the alloy panels and the green stripe. But now my wife has a Citroen C3 diesel, and the performance figures are almost identical. How time moves on.
Rob P
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Alfasuds & Sprints definitely, Alfa Bertone coupes certainly. Also had a yen for the Lancia Beta coupe, the HPE and the Gamma. Fiat 124 coupe looked terrific. My favourite looking saloon though was the NSU Ro80. Faboulous lines and I bet the Cd was as low as anything today.
Now where\'s that lottery ticket?
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My lovely, lovely Alfasud 1.3TI:
bangernomics.tripod.com/images/alfa.jpg
Note Goodyear rally tyres, tan vinyl roof and 70s-tastic orange paintwork. What you can't see are the holes in the floor, sills and inner wings. I'd be tempted by a perfect one, but that might be hard to find these days.
Richard Hall
bangernomics.tripod.com
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Was that Champers on the bonnet, or a posh petrol can?
Hell of a car, and look at that Citroen CX Familiale in the background. Used to lust after the CX, a really graceful car, but like the Sud I suspect they're mostly ashes to ashes, dust to dust these days.
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That's strange, my link has stopped working. Seems that Tripod doesn't like me using my webspace as an image store - presumably because it bypasses the banner ads that are supposed to pay for the service. Still, the photo is on this page:
bangernomics.tripod.com/buyguid2.htm
That is indeed a bottle of (probably very cheap) champagne. Oh happy days of generous student grants, and banks who gave credit cards to irresponsible young men who used them to buy rusting Italian cars. The 'Sud was marvellous as student transport, but I suppose insurance would be prohibitive these days.
Richard Hall
bangernomics.tripod.com
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I am just going through the "get a TR6 for the summer" phase. Perhaps nostalgia overrides the fact this was a 1970's BL product, but they still look great. Whether I will think the same in a year remains to be seen!
Best part of the process is wading through the (free) Moss catalogue identifying all the parts of a "real" car, not the computer controlled Audi I have today.
www.moss-europe.co.uk for your catalogue if you're thinking of buying a "British" classic.
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Right then - my definitive (to me, at least!) list of classic automotive 'must haves':
1. Alvis drophead (to my shame I can't remember the model name)
2. 1960s MGB
3. Early Morris Minor Tourer
4. Alfa Romeo GT Sprint
5. 70s Rolls Royce
6. Mercedes Benz 500SL
7. Mini Cooper
8. Bristol FLF
9. Early Leyland Atlantean PDR1/Met Cam or Weymann
10. Leyland National II
11. Triumph Dolomite Sprint
12. Bristol VR MkI
13. Austin Allegro Vanden Plas
14. AEC Matador
15. Leyland Comet
16. Leyland Leopard/Alexander (I passed my test in one of these)
17. Jaguar XK8
18. Daimler V12 (70s/80s)
19. Mazda MX-5
20. A blooming great garage to keep all these in...!
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Resembles a Euro version of the list of vehicles found in Saddam's collection, then crushed by American tanks a couple of weeks ago. (A quick web search will throw up a few copies of this story and very tragic pictures of wanton destruction!)
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Rob and any other readers, if you like Bristol cars then have a look in their showroom.
They have a dark blue open top on display. I do not know the model but it is a possibly a 40? not the recent models. It has no windscreen fitted, just a very minimal wrap around perspex fly deflector. I think it looks fantastic.
Now what should a gentleman wear to prevent all those flying insects spoiling his big grin on a sunny afternoon?
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I've just spent a happy hour in my local scrappy taking a wiper linkeage of a crashed Granada. What a place it is! Loads of classic - Marine Coupe, Minor, Rover 2200, Triumph 2000, Hillman Hunter, Bedford/Plaxton coach, US Army trucks (massive beasts!), Mk II Escorts, 1950/60s Seddon Atkinson lorry. Damned good job I've not got a large garage.....
Cheers!
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>>>Marine Coupe
D'oh! Meant Marina of course. Although some uncharitable souls here would say that they deserve to be at the bottom of the sea ;-) !
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Let's do a reality check here: there are classics and there are just plain old.
Charles Dickens produced classics. Mills & Boon didn't (don't).
Glad to have sorted that little matter out once and for all :+)
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Rob,
Where's this scrappie then? Wouldn't mind taking a look myself. Cheers.
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My real 'classic' has been staring me in the face for ages. A 1995 M E34 BMW 540i with manual box. It's finished in Oxford Green, has black hide upholstery with just the right patina of age, the six-speed manual 'box, wooden gear lever, a nice set of M5 alloys, and just under 140k on the clock. Drove it a few weeks ago and it's as sweet as a nut.
Character, presence, discerning choice. Only one thing wrong: belongs to somebody else.
Now, if I'd got a few grand knocking around I really would make the guy an offer.
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Richie,
Sorry I've not replied sooner - been at the in-laws' over the BH weekend!
It's in Chorley, Lancashire. Martindale's on Crosse Hall Street. The Rover and the Triumph are pretty much terminal, and I was too engrossed in getting my wiper linkeage to closely investigate the rest! I'll ask the mods to pass on my e-mail addy to you if you contact them to ask for it if you want to know how to get there.
Growler - one man's classic is another man's scrapper!! ;-)
Cheers!
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