Audi A4 - Nominating

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Thu 21 Mar 2013 22:02
Audi A4 - Nominating - zee28
I received a speeding ticket and i was not the driver at the time of the alleged offence nor did i give permission for them to use my vehicle so after finding out who it was, i nominated that person. The problem is they live abroad and the police camera enforcement unit keeps harassing me for more information. Ive replied to them stating that i have provided all the information i have and they should get in touch with him directly, they have no photographic evidence of who was driving apparently, but they still wont leave me alone.
Does anyone know where i stand in this situation? Im prepared to take some responsibility as its my vehicle but am i innocent until PROVEN guilty or guilty until PROVEN innocent?! Help!
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Thu 21 Mar 2013 22:10
Audi A4 - Nominating - Armitage Shanks {p}

If you know someone well enough to let them drive your car the police may find it hard to beleive that you do not have contact details. I do not think that supplying a name will be enough, unless you can also come up with an adress or something helpful.

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Thu 21 Mar 2013 22:36
Audi A4 - Nominating - zee28
I supplied the name and address of the driver and in regards to knowing him, he's actually a friend of the family, i dont know him personally, he stayed at my uncles house for a few days when he was visiting the country, he took my car when i was away for the night and i was non the wiser until i got a ticket and he was long gone by then.

Edited by zee28 on 21/03/2013 at 22:37

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Fri 22 Mar 2013 06:53
Audi A4 - Nominating - Armitage Shanks {p}

Was he insured to drive the car? From what you say he took the car without your knowledge and consent? If so this in itself is an offence and I think that if you have given the police a genuine name and address you have made your best effort to meet the requirements of the law. Is he still a "Friend of the Family" BTW?!

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Fri 22 Mar 2013 07:28
Audi A4 - Nominating - Dwight Van Driver
Problem is if you cannot provide proof from some other member of the family who handed him the keys/saw him drive away/ letter accepting liability etc and that your Insurance covered an unnamed driver then the chances are that they may well slap a summons on you for for failing to name a driver.
What described is one of the oldest attempts to circumnavigate the system.

As far as theft/Twoc of the vehicle then as a friend of the family he may well enter a believable rebuttal, if he was amenable to justice in UK, that had he asked he would have been given permission to use the vehicle.

Again I am intrigued as to the security of the keys?????.

The recent Huhne case has highlighted the seriousness of the offence of attempting to pervert the course of justice and the determination of the authorities not to accept porkies....

dvd
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Fri 22 Mar 2013 12:32
Audi A4 - Nominating - dieselnut

I would post your story on the Pepipoo website. A lot of knowledge how to deal with there.

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Fri 22 Mar 2013 13:16
Audi A4 - Nominating - Rats

innocent until PROVEN guilty or guilty until PROVEN innocent?!

In the past, it used to be thye former, and the prosecution had to prove you were guilty, but somehow the Police, or others in these camera vans are now, Judge, Jury & Executioner!

Where has British justice gone wrong?

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Fri 22 Mar 2013 13:36
Audi A4 - Nominating - Bromptonaut

Where has British justice gone wrong?

It has not.

Ownership of a car, a large and potentially lethal piece of machinery, carries with it certain legal obligations. These cover insurance, maintenance and ensuring use is limited to those authorised. It also includes an obligation to name the driver in event of certain offences policed by camera.

You can still name the driver and they have exactly the same defences available as they were stopped by a police car.

In this case the facts outlined by the OP are similar to those alleged by many people lying to try and 'dodge the bullett'. In circs Police are therefore likley to dig deeper so as to explore truth including possibility the owner/keeper may have permitted uninsured driving.

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Fri 22 Mar 2013 17:06
Audi A4 - Nominating - zee28
Thanks for all the advice.
I'm fully aware of this sounding like a attempt to wriggle out of the situation but the truth is I'm not.
When I first received the ticket I actually was going to accept it under my name purely because I know what it potentially sounds like if I tell the truth and it would have avoided the headache and uncertainty if I had put my details down..
But I was advised by people that I should not do that and I should tell it how it is.. Morally and legally sound and justifiable but in practice, the law definitely is not fair in my eyes if this ends up with me being penalised.
Like I said before, I'm willing to accept some sort of responsibility but am not willing to be put out to dry by the police.
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Fri 22 Mar 2013 17:19
Audi A4 - Nominating - Armitage Shanks {p}

Damned if you do and damned if you don't! If said you were driving when you weren't that could be seen as attempt to pervert the course of justice. If you were NOT driving there is no way anyone can prove that you were. A sort of relevant thread here

forums.pepipoo.com/lofiversion/index.php/t70939.ht...l

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Fri 22 Mar 2013 19:38
Audi A4 - Nominating - Brit_in_Germany

You could try swearing an affidavit stating the facts according to your knowledge before a judicial officer of the court, or alternatively a solicitor. This would help to show that you are taking it seriously.

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Thu 28 Mar 2013 13:48
Audi A4 - Nominating - Peter D

Write to the person ang get them to write to the Camera Unit and provide all his details that are required by a NIP. He must admit he was the driver and provide his contact details and sign the letter. Do you think he/she will do that. Regards Peter

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Fri 12 Apr 2013 13:23
Audi A4 - Nominating - Driver Defence

The police will take one of two approaches. They will either not accept that person was the driver and summons you for failing to name, which carries 6 points. Alternatively, they will accept that person was the driver but ask you to prove they were insured.

Was the vehicle in your possession at the time? For failing to name you would have a defence on the basis you gave the information. The prosecution will have to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you didn't in order to convict you.

For the insurance matter, they would summons you for permitting him to drive without insurance. This carries between 6 - 8 points. You would have a defence if you can show that you didn't give him permission to drive the vehicle.

Hope that helps.

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