Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance | Motoring discussion | Back Room Forum

Sat 17 Nov 2018 22:24

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

I found a similar forum post from 2009, and thought I will check with experienced buyers here what is the standard practice nowadays.

First time that I am buying a brand new car, after part ex, value is 31450, paid £500 on credit card, car on order, provisional delivery 07.12.2018, dealer mentioned please pay the remaining balance of £30950 on 30.11.18 by bank transfer. I assumed it is normal practice, but nothing of this sort written on the order form.

I realized reading on the forums that I may not be protected if the dealer goes bust, or the car does not arrive in time, or the car is damaged in transit (Japan). I checked with the bank, they suggested that I call them to put a marker on the account, and pay by debit card and there is no limit, although the dealer had hinted that there is a limit on debit card payments! All this ringing alarm bells, or am I getting unnecessarily worried.

Is this the norm to pay the whole cost upfront even before the car has arrived? Can I insist that I will pay by debit card, or faster payments electronic transfer on the day of delivery.

Many thanks

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Sat 17 Nov 2018 22:35

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - SLO76

In all the years I sold cars I never asked anyone to pay by cleared funds before delivery whether it was a £300 banger or an all singing all dancing top of the line Shogun. Tell them you’ll pay the balance on delivery as per the norm. The only reason they’d ask for the money in advance would be if the firm was in trouble and they needed the money in as soon as possible which means you could find yourself in the position of having no car and no money should it fail in-between. If you were paying by cheque then I could understand it as it takes time to clear but bank transfer is instant.

Edited by SLO76 on 17/11/2018 at 22:38

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Sat 17 Nov 2018 22:46

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - bathtub tom

As I understand it, as long as you paid part on credit card and the total amount is over £100 you're protected.

I'd still tell the dealer to take a running jump.

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Sat 17 Nov 2018 22:53

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Thanks very much. I also felt reassured paying the deposit on credit card, but have learnt that the protection applies up to amounts of £30000, I am paying just above. Thank you

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 11:15

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - James2018

Section 75 will not apply to this as transaction is over £30k. The credit card co will not help you.

Pay on the day after you have seen the car using a bankers draft (usually about £10) or TT transfer to the dealer after you have seen the car and checked it over.

If the dealer goes bust within the 7 days you may lose the money and the car.

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Sat 17 Nov 2018 22:56

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Thank you, I agree, perhaps they are trying to the get the monies in on 30.11.18 to meet their targets for the month, or for the salesperson to get the commission/bonus. It's a factory made to order, I doubt that if I pay on the day of delivery they will have a problem. At most I loose the £500 deposit, but sleep in peace for 7 days, rather than pay my hard earned savings and feel worried.

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Sat 17 Nov 2018 23:45

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Avant

Provided that you didn't agree to pay a week in advance when you signed the order contract (and even if you did, it's unusual enough that they should have drawn the clause to your attention for it to be valid), you can't be forced to do so.

The dealer is unlikely to be so stupid as to forgo a sale of a £31k car just because of this. As suggested above, they're probably trying it on.

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 07:10

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - gordonbennet

I've been one of the transporter drivers before arriving at a car dealership at 8am to collect the entire stock the very day after a business were still taking monies from ordinary people just like me/us.

Invariably its a drawn out affair as the receivers crew work out where the vehicles have to go to (depending on who 'owns' them) and dig them out among the inevitable chaos, no doubt local radio plays its part at this point and by mid morning i've seen tearful and angry exchanges when customers waiting for cars they have already paid good monies towards, sometimes only hours before, arrive at the site.

I wouldn't be paying my hard earned for the vehicle until handover time either.

Edited by gordonbennet on 18/11/2018 at 07:11

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 07:52

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Thank you, this is very useful.

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 07:52

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Thank you very much

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 08:06

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - KenC

I have bought two new cars in the last 15 years, on both occasions I had given a small up front deposit, one was 500 the second 250, on the day the car was ready for collection I attended the dealership then, as mentioned I used a credit card for each, however I am not 100% that this would afford me consumer credit act protection ( things change and some are excluded)

1) visually inspected the car

2) paid for the car over using a fast transfer from my bank

( obviously having cleared funds in my current account)

3) then last of all the vehicle was registered and taxed by the supplying dealer at the point of

collection and the V5 arrived the following week

I would not have paid either in advance

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 08:17

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - FiestaOwner

The last couple of cars I have bought (from dealers): I've paid a deposit in advance by credit card (around £200).

I've then paid the balance as a chip and pin transaction by debit card on collection of the car.

Would be very wary of paying such a large amount up front. In fact I just wouldn't pay up front!

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Tue 4 Dec 2018 11:36

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

The dealer has said that they would register and tax the car at the point of delivery. I understand that they have access to some DVLA software for first registration. Do they do it once the payment is made, or I ask them to do it before I make the final payment please? Just anxious in case their software is not working and then I am not allowed to drive the car away. Also do they get the registration plates made and fixed before the point of delivery, or do I have to wait for the plates to me made after I make the payment.

Most insurance companies are not allowing me to complete buying the policy online as the registration number I have chosen is not on the database, as the car is not registered yet.

The delivery date is thus Friday 7th December.

Thank you very much

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Tue 4 Dec 2018 15:26

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - RT

The dealer has said that they would register and tax the car at the point of delivery. I understand that they have access to some DVLA software for first registration. Do they do it once the payment is made, or I ask them to do it before I make the final payment please? Just anxious in case their software is not working and then I am not allowed to drive the car away. Also do they get the registration plates made and fixed before the point of delivery, or do I have to wait for the plates to me made after I make the payment.

Most insurance companies are not allowing me to complete buying the policy online as the registration number I have chosen is not on the database, as the car is not registered yet.

The delivery date is thus Friday 7th December.

Thank you very much

Ask the dealer if they can do 7 days insurance free - it's how they usually get over the requirement to be insured before being taxed

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Tue 4 Dec 2018 11:36

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Most insurance companies are not allowing me to complete buying the policy online as the registration number I have chosen is not on the database, as the car is not registered yet.

The delivery date is thus Friday 7th December.

Thank you very much

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 08:39

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - barney100

Honest John said years ago, 'even new cars fall off transporters' Don't pay 'til you've inspected it. You are the customer so don't pay anything except the deposit 'til you are happy. If in doubt pull out, it's a lot of money.

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 11:46

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Thank you all the very useful replies, much appreciated.

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 12:29

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Bolt

I bought 2 new Hondas from main dealer in 2016, a Jazz and Civic and was told by salesman not to pay in full until we had inspected the vehicles and was happy with them, I put £100 deposit on each and paid the rest on collection by debit card 3 weeks later.

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 14:27

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - concrete

Well paindoc, you have all the advice you need here. Just to reinforce a few points. My uncle worked in finance all his life. He always said there two kinds of bad payers, those that never paid at all and those that paid in advance. DON'T DO IT. You say nothing about advance payment is mentioned in your order form or agreement. Then simply tell the dealer that you will pay after a full vehicle inspection after delivery. if it takes a day or so make payment then so be it, better safe than sorry. If the dealer doesn't like this or threatens to cancel the order, then let him and get your deposit back. The dealer has varied the terms of the agreement by insisting on advance payment, therefore you are entitled to walk away from the deal if he is not prepared to fulfil his obligations. Sounds fishy to me but you are sort of committed to a deal until the agreement is broken. I have bought cars in the past and paid by debit card. As long as the funds are in your account to cover the amount. There may be a limit of 30K per transaction so check with your bank. If that is the case you can pay 30K debit card and the balance in cash or credit card. Be careful though, at present you are only risking £500 but that is a bad enough loss if this goes south. Remember, you pay when you get the keys and documents.

Cheers Concrete

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 14:59

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Ian_SW

The dealer made exactly the same request when my wife bought her car. In that case the car was a 'ex demo' rather than brand new, but that makes little difference.

We told them either we would pay the balance (in cleared funds by debit card) on the day or wouldn't buy the car at all. It took them a while to agree to this, but the real prospect of not selling the car convinced them in the end. I think the reason they do this is to avoid paying the fee VISA charge them on the debit card, but there are ways for some types of bank transfers to be reversed for a few days after they have been made.

There were several stories in the newspaper of people who'd paid in full in advance fo r furniture to be delivered a week later shortly before House of Fraser went into administration. They lost both the money and the furniture. Exactly the same could happen to the dealer, but in this case the lost money would be even more.

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 15:35

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Falkirk Bairn

A son bought a new car 2 weeks ago - trading in a 2 year old Mini.

£500 reservation fee & an agreed price on Mini assuming it was as described.

4 hour drive. He arrived at 10.30 in Newcastle, he inspected the new car, they gave a cursory look at the T/I. All was in order.

Visa Debit card for the balance - back on the road by 11 ish.

I have bought 4 brand new cars in the last 17 years -

2001 Personal Cheque for whole amount, no T/I

2005 Building Society Cheque

2007 Bank Draft

2012 Switch

All paid after a meticulous check on the new car - it was raining in 2007 so I had them take it indoors, dried off so I could properly assess the car.

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 16:22

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Thank you all. The consistent message is that do not pay until the car has been inspected. They made me sign some terms and conditions, but they appeared standard (such as my cancellation rights after 14 days of delayed delovede etc.), but nothing to suggest that I make the payment one week in advance. They didn't put a copy of the terms and conditions in the folder they have given me, the folder has a copy of the order form, and leaflets on gap insurance and body protection stuff. Yes they may feel slightly insecure with debit card payment due to the card merchant not transferring funds into their account for a couple of days, but this is their problem. I would have paid. I have read online about this dealer, and the particular saleswoman dealing with me on a review website where it's mentioned that one customer transferred the money into their account, and the customer had to keep ringing to check if the monies have arrived, they didn't bother to call back to confirm. You just need one digit of the bank account number to be typed wrong in error when doing online transfer, and you wouldn't see the money again. Thank you so much.

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 16:50

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - RT

Thank you all. The consistent message is that do not pay until the car has been inspected. They made me sign some terms and conditions, but they appeared standard (such as my cancellation rights after 14 days of delayed delovede etc.), but nothing to suggest that I make the payment one week in advance. They didn't put a copy of the terms and conditions in the folder they have given me, the folder has a copy of the order form, and leaflets on gap insurance and body protection stuff. Yes they may feel slightly insecure with debit card payment due to the card merchant not transferring funds into their account for a couple of days, but this is their problem. I would have paid. I have read online about this dealer, and the particular saleswoman dealing with me on a review website where it's mentioned that one customer transferred the money into their account, and the customer had to keep ringing to check if the monies have arrived, they didn't bother to call back to confirm. You just need one digit of the bank account number to be typed wrong in error when doing online transfer, and you wouldn't see the money again. Thank you so much.

AFAIK the transfer is done in seconds under Faster Payments - the limit is £100,000 but your bank may have a lower limit. The last five cars I've bought have been done using Debit Card after inspection.

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 21:49

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Bromptonaut

AFAIK the transfer is done in seconds under Faster Payments - the limit is £100,000 but your bank may have a lower limit. The last five cars I've bought have been done using Debit Card after inspection.

Faster Payments tends to have a limit around tens of thousands where human intervention is required before an internet banking transaction goes through. Troubled me twice. Once transferring money from our Mother's estate to my sister and another when paying off my mortgage.

Had to speak to somebody at the bank (Santander) and then wait for a call back from their security team. Call back focused on ensuring I'd done appropriate diligence over who I was paying to and on transaction being irreversible.

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 22:10

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - RT

AFAIK the transfer is done in seconds under Faster Payments - the limit is £100,000 but your bank may have a lower limit. The last five cars I've bought have been done using Debit Card after inspection.

Faster Payments tends to have a limit around tens of thousands where human intervention is required before an internet banking transaction goes through. Troubled me twice. Once transferring money from our Mother's estate to my sister and another when paying off my mortgage.

Had to speak to somebody at the bank (Santander) and then wait for a call back from their security team. Call back focused on ensuring I'd done appropriate diligence over who I was paying to and on transaction being irreversible.

I had no issues with higher amounts for two of our car purchases

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 16:24

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Vitesse6

Bought a new Golf in 1985. Paid by cheque, drove home. Dealer rang, sorry to bother us, but could we come back and sign the cheque!

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Sun 18 Nov 2018 22:00

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Thank you, I see the problems with faster payment ttransfer then. Debit card perhaps the best, as long as I call the bank beforehand and they put a marker on my account.

Good old days of trust Vitesse6, unsigned cheque also accepted as a method of payment.

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Mon 19 Nov 2018 16:21

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - skidpan

Dealer rang, sorry to bother us, but could we come back and sign the cheque!

I can remember dad having a new car in 1978 and paying for it with a cheque written by the company finance director (full amount less discount - I had his old car). The following week he got a phone call, the cheque was bouncing round the showroom. The dealer was not best pleased.

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Mon 19 Nov 2018 17:18

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - jgrahampo

last two dealer cars I bought (Volvo and MX5) paid upon collection using Visa Debit card. Did speak to my bank (HBOS) the day before to notify them of my pending purchase and large unusual payment. They said they didn't need to know.

Both transactions went through using chip and pin without a hitch.

Do not pay anything other than the minimum deposit up front, otherwise what leverage do you have if things aren't right. damaged car or delayed delivery?

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Mon 19 Nov 2018 17:56

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Miniman777

Bought a used BMW X3 2 months ago. £500 deposit on a c/card (full well knowing the limit of s75 is £30k), paid balance (£40k) on debit card on the day of collection, warning bank of large transaction and name of retailer. Not a problem. Tax sorted online at dealers and 7 days drive away insurance too.

TBH, I'd be concerned about the unfair pressure to pay in advance too. Their cashflow problem (assuming that's what it is) is not the purchaser's concern. There have been examples of untrustworthy salesmen too.

Pay the balance on the day with a card after full inspection, drive away happy (hopefully) or tell them the deal is off. You are in the driving seat.

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Mon 19 Nov 2018 18:00

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Andrew-T

Honest John said years ago, 'even new cars fall off transporters'

They certainly do. I once had to drive round one on the main road near here which had done just that, sideways.

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Mon 19 Nov 2018 21:14

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Big John

I've also paid the balance of my last two cars on a debit card - was as easy as buying a packet of Polos.

Edited by Big John on 19/11/2018 at 21:14

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Tue 20 Nov 2018 09:56

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - daveyK_UK

The real reason it’s done in advance is to speed up the transaction on the day and avoid any delays with banks querying payment , etc.

they normally only ask for payment the day before , not 7 days in advance

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Tue 20 Nov 2018 12:32

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - RT

The real reason it’s done in advance is to speed up the transaction on the day and avoid any delays with banks querying payment , etc. they normally only ask for payment the day before , not 7 days in advance

Modern transactions are so swift that it hardly delays it more than a few minutes.

Given the dates involved, it seem to me from the OP that the dealer was trying to get the sale into the previous month.

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Tue 20 Nov 2018 12:56

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Thank you. That's why the salesperson stressed on 30th November do much. She even wrote it down on the front of the folder as well in big font.:-)

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Wed 21 Nov 2018 10:20

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Brit_in_Germany

If they want to have the sale in November so badly, then surely there is some room for negotiating a mutual benefit.

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Wed 21 Nov 2018 11:27

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - SLO76

“Given the dates involved, it seem to me from the OP that the dealer was trying to get the sale into the previous month.”

When the car went out didn’t matter when I was selling for a dealer, the sale was recorded from the moment there was a signed order form and a deposit. Maybe things have changed or others operate differently but I still suspect the dealer is desperate for money and has cash flow issues and thus I wouldn’t want to pay before receiving the goods.

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Thu 22 Nov 2018 06:51

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Thank you SLO76

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Fri 23 Nov 2018 09:09

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Dingle232

The last 2 cars I have bought (not new, used) have involved the dealer asking for money via bank transfer before I collected them. It seems to be a developing trend and is obviously their latest ruse to try and stitch people in and make it difficult for them to walk away.

On both occasions, I refused and insisted on transferring the money when I inspected the car. Surprise surprise (contrary to their protests that it can 'take hours') the money hit their account straight away and I drove the car home.

Coincidentally, or maybe not, one was a Honda dealership.I'd walk away before I did as they ask.

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Fri 23 Nov 2018 10:11

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Senexdriver

The last 3 Audis I’ve bought (from the same dealer), I have been asked to pay on the day before handover. It does save one matter when the car is collected and on that basis I’m happy to comply, but I wouldn’t pay any sooner.

The first time I was asked, I was a little surprised. I asked the salesman what would happen to my money if the company went bust overnight, to which he replied “That won’t happen, sir”. I didn’t have the heart to say it to him, but having dealt with many insolvencies in the course of my work I thought to myself “And you as an employee would be the last to know!”

If I buy my next car from the dealership and if I buy outright, I shall be interested to see whether there are any changes to payment terms if this is the start of a trend.

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Fri 23 Nov 2018 10:24

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - SLO76

If you pay in advance before delivery and the firm goes bust in the meantime you’ll find yourself at the end of a long line of creditors and it’s highly likely you’ll lose every penny. Never pay more than the minimum deposit before delivery of the goods though you could protect yourself by paying at least £101 of it on a credit card which if I’m remembering correctly covers you for the full balance but again there’s absolutely no need. Asking for money in advance is just the dealer principal pushing to get money in. Tell him or her no, you’ll pay on collection.

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Mon 26 Nov 2018 20:20

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Update: the dealer called me today reminding me to make the full payment through bank transfer by Friday 30th November. The dealer was clear that they want to register the car this month. The car arrives at the dealership on 5th December.

I said I will pay on delivery. There was a long discussion that ensued where the dealership argued that the discount was based on the fact that I will pay by the end of this month. This was however never the case, the discount was negotiated well before the order was placed and before the payment instructions were provided to me. After the long discussion, the dealership agreed for the payment to be made on handover of the car. Thank you all for guiding me.

The dealer said that they cannot accept debit cards for such big payments at all. I agreed to bring a bankers draft on the day of delivery. They also agreed to send me a list of registration plates to choose from.

They have said that they will register the car with DVLA and pay the tax on the day of delivery after I have made the payment.

I received an email later stating that they would now accept debit card for this payment, and that I do not have to bring a bankers draft.

Thanks very much all for such useful information, I would have been in the dark otherwise. Throughout the process I was made to feel by the dealership that they are doing me a favour by selling the car.

Thank you

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Mon 26 Nov 2018 22:30

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - joegrundy

Good to hear that you have sorted this out.

For the benefit of other/future readers I want to reiterate the very sound advice given by other posters about not paying in advance of receipt of the goods.

Using a credit card gives best protection (within the legal limits) and using a debit card gives some protection (via the charge-back scheme).

I was a Fraud Squad DI for many years and dealt with (far too) many cases where customers had paid for goods in advance only to end up with no goods and a position way down the list of unsecured creditors with no hope of getting any money back (all perfectly legal, you understand).

Demands/requests for payment 'up front' may indicate that the business is strapped for cash and heading for insolvency. Not always, of course, but it should raise a flag.

And a true story to illustrate this. I dealt with the case of a main dealer. He bought in new cars financed by a 'stocking loan'. The loan was to be repaid as the cars were registered and sold. (He also had the cheque book and was authorised to issue HP loans for cars he sold). He was made aware in advance of when the manufacturer's auditor was due to pay a visit. He would contact owners of recently sold new cars and ask hem to bring them in for 'a check'. They would be valeted, number plates taken off, and lined up as unsold stock. 'Unsold' therefor the manufacturer's stocking loan onthat car didn't need to be repaid. Things went completely t*ts up when this was finally discovered, of course.

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Mon 26 Nov 2018 23:31

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - Big John

Not a car but when I last bought and paid for a new sofa and chairs from Courts they went bust before delivery - fortunately I'd paid with a credit card and got all my money back. Lot's of people didn't!

Edited by Big John on 26/11/2018 at 23:32

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Tue 4 Dec 2018 13:39

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - paindoc

Most insurance companies are not allowing me to complete buying the policy online as the registration number I have chosen is not on the database, as the car is not registered yet.

The delivery date is thus Friday 7th December.

Thank you very much

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Tue 4 Dec 2018 14:02

Honda CRV 2019 - Dealer expects full payment 7 days in advance - skidpan

The dealer has said that they would register and tax the car at the point of delivery. I understand that they have access to some DVLA software for first registration. Do they do it once the payment is made, or I ask them to do it before I make the final payment please? Just anxious in case their software is not working and then I am not allowed to drive the car away.

The garage will ask you to sign paperwork which confirms they have registered the car etc.

Also do they get the registration plates made and fixed before the point of delivery, or do I have to wait for the plates to me made after I make the payment.

Does it really matter provided they are on when you drive off.

Most insurance companies are not allowing me to complete buying the policy online as the registration number I have chosen is not on the database, as the car is not registered yet.

On Aviva's site when it does not recognise the reg number (perfectly normal for a new car) the site allows you to inputs car details manually from drop downs. Would expect every site to do this unless its a rubbish company that does not want business.

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