VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - TopScot

Can anyone tell me why the VW cc has such a short timing belt interval compared to simile VW's, skodas, seats etc that use the same engine with a double interval of 100k compared to 50k on the cc?

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - SLO76
It's 4yrs or 120k on pre Sept 2009 cars and 5yrs or 140k on post if I remember correctly which is as long as I'd really want to leave a rubber belt on a high mileage taxi, in fact I'd be doing it along with the water pump at 5yrs or 100k at the most. www.volkswagen.co.uk/need-help/owners/cambelt-chan...e

Edited by SLO76 on 31/07/2017 at 18:46

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - John F

Why 5ys for this, yet 10yrs for a turn-of-the-century Ford? (or life if bathed in oil - e.g. Ford's ecoboost). I think the unscientific sales team just think of a number, as modern aramid belts will probably last the life of the car/engine if the pulleys they drive don't break or seize. Mine always have.

Obviously the sooner the recommendation, the more remunerative work for the garage trade. I suspect that's the answer to the OP's puzzle. At my last MoT I asked my experienced busy garage owner when he last saw/repaired a broken cambelt. He couldn't remember.

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - SLO76
To be honest John I think VW are profiteering here either that or they're being overly cautious, possibly a combination of the two. Their belt change time intervals are what we'd expect back in the 90's from the likes of a CVH Ford etc. I think their mileage recommendation is at the top end of what I'd personally recommend however at 120/140k.

Some cars are prone to early belt failure, Renault being probably the most common. I've seen Clio's and Megan's with ruined engines via snapped belts at 5yrs old with less than 60k on the clock but I've never seen a 1600 Focus, a Honda of any kind or a VW Passat for that matter. If it was a basic petrol motor as with your Focus and had a low value I'd stretch it a good bit but a complex and highly expensive to replace turbo diesel like this isn't worth taking chances with for the sake of £350-£400 every 100,000 miles.

On a further note, it's worth shopping around for a price to do it then approach your local VW dealer to see if they'll price match. Mine almost did with my Polo 1.2 TDi (belt and water pump) coming to within £30 of a local backstreet garage while giving a 5yr warranty on the belt and any related damage done if it were to fail plus the dealer used VW parts while the other garage were using aftermarket bits.
VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - gordonbennet

Its many years since i owned a VW group car, mk 1 Golf1.6 Diesel as it happens.

The route the cambelt had to run it's hardly surprising the recommended life was so short, don't suppose things have got any simpler or more sensible in VW land.

What i don't understand is why some makers have to make the camblet change such a performance, and this is not confined to VW nor east west engines either.

There is no reason whatsoever why the cambelt should be driving anything other than the camshaft(s), if engines were designed sensibly and changing that belt was an hour's work with a genuine belt kit under £100, no one would bat an eyelid about getting them done every 5 years or 100k whichever came first.

Toyota managed to design their 3.0D4D engine so the belt is simple and cam drive only, you don't even have to remove the auxilliarly belt to access the cambelt, all timing marks in place none of this locking kit faff and jacking the engine up off its mounts designed to make the job as scary as possible to keep the job seriously expensive and in house.

Vote witth feet people.

Edited by gordonbennet on 31/07/2017 at 20:51

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - TopScot

Thanks for all the replies. So vw told me it was 50k interval changes on the belt? Am confused why the site is saying 100k. My last Taxi wad the Hyundai i40 that had a chain. And if I hadn't had so many problems with the clutch and the huge prices for parts for Korean cars I would have bought another.

Edited by Ciaran Taxi on 31/07/2017 at 20:53

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - SLO76
It's not a big cost over 100,000 miles and tax deductible on a working vehicle like this.
VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - TopScot

I wouldn't bother about 100k. But every 50k at £500 a pop. I'll do 50k miles in a year

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - skidpan

Why did you not research this before buying. I always find out about service costs and other replacement costs before buying, that way there are no nasty surprises ahead and if I am not happy I just walk away. That is why I never bought a Subaru Impreza turbo despite looking twice, a service every 6 months was going to cost me £2000 over 5 years, a Ford at the time was service every year and was costing me about £700 over 5 years.

When we bought the Leon 1.4 TSi the situation with the cambelt was very confusing. When we looked at the Golf the VW salesman said it was replace every 3 years or 30,000 miles. I could not believe that because for a higher mileage user it was going to be very frequent. Looked on the Skoda site and it clearly siad that in the new TSi the belt was for the life of the engine and no maintenance was required. The Seat salesman did not have a clue and said it would be the same as the diesels. Cannot remember what they were, seem to think it was 4 years.

So I decided to e-mail Seat and get a definitive answer in writing, this is what they said copied from the e-mail:

we recommend the cam belt is first checked at 60,000 miles, and every 20,000 miles thereafter. If there is no damage at these points the cambelt will not need changing. If the belt is not changed, regardless of condition, it must be replaced at 120,000 miles or when the vehicle is 5 years old, whichever comes first

So for me doing 8,000 miles a year it would be 5 years but for a high mileage user potentially 120,000 miles both of which appeared reasonable.

Why doesn't the OP contact VW?

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - John F

...... e-mail Seat and get a definitive answer in writing, this is what they said copied from the e-mail:

we recommend the cam belt is first checked at 60,000 miles, and every 20,000 miles thereafter. If there is no damage at these points the cambelt will not need changing. If the belt is not changed, regardless of condition, it must be replaced at 120,000 miles or when the vehicle is 5 years old, whichever comes first

So for me doing 8,000 miles a year it would be 5 years but for a high mileage user potentially 120,000 miles both of which appeared reasonable.

Not to me it isn't.. 5yrs for a modern quality belt is unreasonable to the point of absurdity. On that basis our 17yr old Focus would be on its third cambelt.

Any other items the car trade would like us to be replaced 'regardless of condition' when 5yrs old? Tyres? Brake piston seals? Suspension bushes? It is high time the motor industry got its act together on the vexed and expensive question of cambelt servicing. Beltchangers have commented elsewhere they can hardly tell the difference between old and new belts (I wonder how many are unscrupulously re-used?)

Bell curve graphs of cambelt/tension pulley survival in popular cars should be available so customers can make their own judgements re replacing their belts - or even buying the model in the first place.

Sensible advice from SLO76 as usual. Clearly either the French supplier used to make them out of cheeserind or the cog teeth were razor sharp.

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - Wackyracer

I know of at least 5 broken cambelts on 5 different cars, Ford Capri, Ford Escort, Vauxhall Vectra, Fiat Punto and Mazda MX5 those are the ones that spring to mind without thinking too much.

The Capri and Mazda were OK as not interference engines.

Edited by Wackyracer on 01/08/2017 at 13:58

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - SLO76
"The Capri and Mazda were OK as not interference engines."

Thus my love for Mazda petrol engines and the reason why so many survive into old age. It was a common thing in the 90's on Mk III Cavaliers but again they were (excluding the 16v's and I think the diesels)) all non-interference units. Slapped a new belt on, reset the timing and off you went.

Edited by SLO76 on 01/08/2017 at 14:28

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - skidpan

Not to me it isn't.. 5yrs for a modern quality belt is unreasonable to the point of absurdity. On that basis our 17yr old Focus would be on its third cambelt.

Any other items the car trade would like us to be replaced 'regardless of condition' when 5yrs old? Tyres? Brake piston seals? Suspension bushes? It is high time the motor industry got its act together on the vexed and expensive question of cambelt servicing.

I change the belt as per the manufacturers recomendations for 3 reasons

1 I accept that the manufacturer knows more than me about their engines

2 It does not cost a fortune in the whole cost of motoring

3 I am not an idiot and don't like palaying Russian Roulette with expensive assets.

To expand on point 2 over 5 years the Leon would have cost about £4500 on petrol, £620 on servicing, £100 on MOT's, £1000 on insurance, £150 on VED, 6 tyres @ £60 each £360 plus other minor bits such as £120 for 2 brake fluid changes etc. Total cost £6850, lets call it £7000.

The cam belt change inc a water pump on Seat menu is £459 so that adds another 6.5% to your motoring costs which is 1/2 of sod all.

If you cannot afford to follow the manufacturers recomendations or simply believe you know better give up motoring please for the sake of other peoples safety. Not in the least bit bothered if you die in a fireball when your cam belt breaks in the outside lane and ypur 20 year old tyres fail when the engine sizes and locks up the wheels.

When I fitted the Focus Zetec engine to the Caterham it came from Ford sealed in shrink wrap on a yellow plastic crate (containing some silica gell bags) where it had been stored for 5 years. The engine sump was full of some thick green gloop that was intended only for storage and a 5 year old cam belt. The sump was being changed so the oil was drained and when in the car was filled with a suitably cheap 5w30 to flush the engine out which was replaced after about 50 miles with some more 5w30. The cam belt was left since Ford recommend 10 years or 100,000 miles. When the engine was 10 years old (2014) I bought a Gates kit which cost about £100 which included the belt, idler pulley and tensioner and changed them. Although it had done onlt 10,000 miles approx it was stupid not to spend £100 since a snapped belt would have cost way more that that to sort. In truth it was an excellent decisison since the idler pulley had quite a bit of play in the bearings.

All these Zetecs were built in 2004 and were unused when the Mk 1 Focus stopped production. They are still being sold by several specialits companies. The engines are now 13 years old.

Last year on a website I frequent there were two enthusiasts who thought they knew better and ignored advice. One drained the gloop out of the sump and after he had fitted the new sump refilled with the thick gloop. He could not get oil pressure before starting but carried on and trashed the engine before it had mooved a single yard. Another ignored the advice to change the cam belt and had it snap within a few weeks wrecking his new engine. Both were out of pocket for several thousand pounds.

The Capri and Mazda were OK as not interference engines

No idea about Mazda's but from memory the 1600 Pinto was non-interference but the 2 litre more often than not ended up with bent valves etc.

Edited by skidpan on 01/08/2017 at 16:02

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - jc2

Other way round-2.0/1.8 OHC were non-interference.1.6-you could be lucky and 1.3 OHC(not sold in UK-we used the Kent) always destroyed the valves.Strictly,these were T88 engines-the Pinto was the 2.3 OHC used in the US.

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - Wackyracer

The Capri was indeed a 2.0 and we just lined up the timing marks and fitted a new belt. It was 30+ years ago, the car was my sisters boyfriends.

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - Railroad.

The recommended intervals for changing the toothed belt WERE xx,xxx miles or x years when the car was new. It's not new anymore and so these intervals no longer apply, nor can they be relied upon. It's now a used car with untold wear and tear. No-one can say when a problem is going to occur. You decide when (or if) you change the cambelt. No-one can advise you with total certainty when's the right time to do it.

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - TopScot

Volkswagen clearly don't have a clue. One dealership told me 50k. Another told me 60k, another told me 90k. And my local mechanic told me 5 years or 120k!

VW CC - 2l TDI - Timing belt interval - SLO76

Volkswagen clearly don't have a clue. One dealership told me 50k. Another told me 60k, another told me 90k. And my local mechanic told me 5 years or 120k!

Looks like all VW dealers are not the same. My local dealer has been outstanding to date and there was certainly no doubt about the t/belt interval on my Polo or my Caddy from their service dept. Both were carried out at discounted prices that pretty much matched local independents and instead of having a dirty vehicle returned to me covered in oily finger prints as per the norm with backstreet garages both were valeted inside and out.
 

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