Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) | Technical matters | Back Room Forum

Fri 9 Aug 2019 21:28

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Turkish_Emperor

Hi,

First time posting on here, hoping for some general advice. Sorry for the long post (I just really am looking for clarity on what to do).

I've had my Honda Accord 2002 for just over 9 years. I do on average 8000 miles. Car has 116k on the clock.

9 years ago when I bought it, it had 47k on the clock, didn't trust the owner, but needed the car, so got it at a good price and decided to be safe and have the timing belt changed (the body finish and issues simply didn't match the 'history' of the car, car looked like it'd done a LOT more than 47k).

Anyway, that was nine years ago and I've done 69k myself.

I live in a rural area, street parking, farmers tractors have hit my car, plus I don't mind it's many scratches (means I don't have an expensive car to keep worrying over) and I like that side of my motoring (I've had expensive cars in the past and I was always worried about anything might happen to it, not so this car).

So...... I did used to have it regularly serviced for the first few years at Honda, then a local kwik fit type outfit, and then finally, I decided that for the miles I drive, it was all a waste of money so I just have been doing the oil-changes myself and fixed anything that'd go wrong.

(all because as I say, I live in a rural area, have to street park it, often under trees, and it can and has been hit / scratched / dented by something, a tractor or van I suspect).....

So..... about 4 years ago (I'd had new discs all around, new calipers on front and all new pads), about three years ago I had 1/2 of the a/c fixed. The following year I had another 1/2 of the a/c fixed. 2 years ago a new exhaust and a year ago 4 new tyres.

As I say, I keep changing the oil every 9k miles.

So..... now to my questions

It failed its MOT (it does so every year and I just get whatever is needed doing done).

last year was on £90 of welding.

This year the MOT place have quoted me £150 to do some more welding.

I don't mind the welding but my REAL question is regarding the Cam Belt.

I got that changed and now it's a YEAR overdue. Mileage wise apparently I've got another 6.

Apparently the cambelt is to be changed every 75k or 7 years, and I've done 69K on the cambelt changed 8 years ago.

What should I do ?

The welding will sort its MOT for another year. But what if the Cam belt goes during that time ?

My biggest worry then is that I won't even have a car to drive around to find another car.

If I have the cambelt changed (£300), then I feel I have to keep the car for another 2 years at least to justify spending yet more money on it (all the while, the longer I keep it, the more it's likely to fail on things and the more it's going to cost me).

Again, I don't really want to get a 'decent' car because of where I park the damned thing !

I love the car, it does me, and I don't mind all the battle scars it's got, as I say I've owned it for 9 years and I'd love to keep it for 10.

I know this all sounds confusing, but I'm at a real loss what to do, so any advice I'd gladly love to receive.

I'm all ears.

Thanks,

Jez

PS - bear in mind that I don't bother having it serviced and it's been the most reliable car I've ever had. I just let it fail its MOT, get whatever needs doing done and continue. 8k a year... cheap motoring ? Or am I out of touch (why buy a car that costs me £000's when it's just going to get 8-10k driven out of it). My only worry is that it'll fail more and more on rust and not be saveable (the body car paint, whilst dented/scratched etc has no rust....). The rust is underneath.

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Fri 9 Aug 2019 22:09

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Harel

Good question you got there

and i think i understand how you feel about your car since i have a 2001 fiesta which I've had for nine years now and love it.

i guess many people try to cut the expenses of their cars by doing themselves the oil changes and other routine maintenance ,also fixing/replacing when something is broken

it seems to me like you have a decent and reliable car which you love and i assume you know how to fix it so unless it is rusted badly i think i would keep it if i were you

having a new-used car doesnt mean it is going to be repairs free and you will still have to do the oil, tires, brakes etc changes

also maybe you can change the cam belt by yourself?

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Fri 9 Aug 2019 22:27

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - elekie&a/c doctor

I owned one of these a few years ago, and at 100k miles decided to replace the cam belt ( 2 on these, cam and balancer shaft belts). Don’t know why I bothered, couldn’t see much difference between old and new parts, even the labelling on the old belt was totally legible. I would just get the welding done for the mot and drive it until it dies , which it probably won’t.

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Fri 9 Aug 2019 22:52

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - John F

Same here. If it works, don't mend it.

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Fri 9 Aug 2019 23:01

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Turkish_Emperor

John F, that's dicey ? If it doesn't work the car will be written off and then I'm stranded with no runaround to go searching for a replacement car.

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Sat 10 Aug 2019 11:41

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - John F

John F, that's dicey ? If it doesn't work the car will be written off and then I'm stranded......

All cars this age are 'dicey'. If one day it doesn't work the odds are it will be something cheap to mend. Our Focus cambelt is twice the age and mileage of your replacement belt and still looks and sounds fine - as your original one probably would have done. I seem to remember reading somewhere that newish cars are just as likely to strand you as old ones.

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Sun 11 Aug 2019 18:55

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Andrew-T

You are into bangernomics here. The basic rule is that mechanical problems are usually fixable if parts are available and it's not horribly expensive; if the problems are structural you may be on a losing battle. Depends where the annual corrosion is. You clearly love your car but don't mind it being a dirty workhorse, but that life isn't going to help with the corrosion side.

The car is intrinsically almost worthless, so you could convert to true bangernomics - when you decide the annual repairs have got too expensive, you scrap the car and look for another like it, since you are happy with an Accord. Someone somewhere should be selling a more intact one.

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Fri 9 Aug 2019 22:58

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Turkish_Emperor

Wow two replies so soon, thank you both so much !

Trouble is, you've each given me a different answer !

Harel, you raise great points. I could re-watch a couple of the YouTube videos on how to change the cambelt and re-assess. I''m sure it's not beyond me as I used to love tinkering with cars when I was a lot younger (30 years ago). I'm renting for years, so don't have access to a garage/trolley jack/torque wrenches etc anymore, so I'm guessing that'll be where my stumbling block will lie.

But you have hit the nail on the head, I love this car so much - the way it magically came to me at a time when I was at a real low point in life still amazes me whenever I think about it, and it's been the car I've owned for the longest by a mile, and the most reliable by far.....

Plus I do know everything about the car (apart from the rust !).

elekie&a/c doctor, you're coming from a place of experience, and you're saying that 100k it didn't look worn. This is the sort of comment I'm looking for because you won't get an honest answer from a dealer, they'll just tell you the manufacturer states every 75k. But surely there is a safety margin/factor built in (i.e. it's not going to pop at 75,001).....

I'm looking to keep the car for another two years and then I will need to get something (another one, only newer) to replace her.

So, for potentially another 20k miles (assuming I drive more frequently over the next two years) - is it worth a £300 gamble ?

Excuse me as I think this one out aloud.....

1) If I go with the a.c. doctor, and it pops - I've got no car to drive around. If it doesn't pop, okay, I'll have saved £300 but I'll have been worried during those 2 years !

2) If I go with Harel's suggestion, I've got at least 1 year, maybe 2 out of the car (depending on the next MOT) - then, that £300 would have been for peace of mind.

£300 / 2 years is only £150 a year. Come next MOT I'll only get welding sorted (if needed). If it needs more money spent on mechanicals I'll have to call it a day.

Sound's sensible ? Just thinking out loud. Help me guys :)

Thanks.

PS - forgot to mention - it's a Honda Accord 2.0i Exec (I think VTEC ?). Petrol engine.

Edited by JezUK on 09/08/2019 at 23:04

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Fri 9 Aug 2019 23:07

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Turkish_Emperor

Just found this thread via Google, surprisingly (maybe not) on Honest John's forum. Same question pretty much (and answered by a Honda technician, grease monkey).

Sounds like it'd be best to get it changed....

www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=35011

Edited by JezUK on 09/08/2019 at 23:08

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Sun 11 Aug 2019 12:40

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - John F

Same question pretty much (and answered by a Honda technician, grease monkey).

Sounds like it'd be best to get it changed....

www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=35011

Not to me it didn't, especially as those comments are 14yrs old. As g m said, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

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Fri 9 Aug 2019 23:09

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Harel

I guess if you need a straight answer than yes keep the car and do the cambelt job

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Fri 9 Aug 2019 23:46

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - bathtub tom

It seems the welding is getting progressively costlier each year. How much does it have to be before you find it uneconomic.

I've always found that once welding needs to be done, that's the death knell.

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Sat 10 Aug 2019 09:56

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Turkish_Emperor

I agree bathtub tom,

Once the rust worm has started eating away, it's not looking good from there on.

I'm going to get the cam belt changed. It's a small price to pay for peace of mind, and continuation of what I have and know.

Let's see what next year's MOT says :)

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Sat 10 Aug 2019 13:52

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Harel

Good luck

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Sun 11 Aug 2019 12:48

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - John F

I've always found that once welding needs to be done, that's the death knell.

Not necessarily. Spent £100 on Focus to pass MoT March 2017, no welding since then, just a corroded roll bar bolt March this year - £25. And it lives outside.

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Sun 11 Aug 2019 14:30

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - edlithgow

It seems the welding is getting progressively costlier each year. How much does it have to be before you find it uneconomic.

I've always found that once welding needs to be done, that's the death knell.

Spray it with something. I favor vegetable oil, mixed with diesel and motor oil, but in the UK there are more expensive options that may be better.

(I didn't think much of Waxoyl though)

Do it after the current lot of welding to reduce the fire hazard.

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Tue 13 Aug 2019 13:18

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Turkish_Emperor

***** UPDATE *******

Firstly, fantastic answers from everybody, thank you all so much - trouble is, you're all right !

The curved ball was delivered this morning when I drove the car to the MOT/Garage to be welded - I demanded a fixed price before they started work (they'd previously estimated it'd be between £150 - £250)..... but today, whilst I waited at Costa Coffee.....they called and told me not to bother, the car isn't worth it.......

So I insisted on their price and they said now it's been looked at closely, it'll be £350 to do the welding needed to get it though this year's MOT and more than that to fix the welding that's on an advisory (not a fail)......

I knocked them down to £300.... and instructed them to fix it.

So my plan now is to pay that £300 and continue for one more year - and during the latter part of that year I'll change the car and sell this one for scrap etc.

I also WON'T now bother getting the Cam belt changed - I'll take the risk as it is. If I get another 8000 miles out of the car (my normal annual mileage), great. If the cam belt fails and blows the engine up, then I'll have to ask a friend to help drive me around as I search to get another car.....

Each year this car has cost me circa £300 in repair bills (I don't get it serviced - I just change the oil myself).

I don't think that's too bad :)

"Bangernomics".... I could not stop laughing when I'd said that out loud !!! (never heard that word before !)

PS - I totally agree regarding spraying it with something underneath to protect it - I'll make sure my next Honda Accord (definitely the best car I've ever had) will get the underbody treatment in order to avoid this problem again.

I'll keep you all posted in a year's time to let you know how it all turned out ! :)

Thanks once again.

Edited by JezUK on 13/08/2019 at 13:22

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Tue 13 Aug 2019 15:49

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Andrew-T

"Bangernomics".... I could not stop laughing when I'd said that out loud !!! (never heard that word before !)

Jez, you clearly don't look in here that often. Bangernomics is a long-established theme with several adherents who try to keep driving while incurring negligible depreciation. It's a fine art which I don't try to emulate personally.

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Wed 14 Aug 2019 03:01

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - edlithgow

Ah well

Currus mortis est

Occurs to me that in Englandshire driving through a ford a few times in the spring might be an option to get embedded winter salt out of the nether regions.

(The river crossing, not a "Ford", though I did once drive through a Ford Fiesta in my Lada. Hardly felt it)

You could make it a rural outing/tradition. Like dipping your sheep.

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Wed 14 Aug 2019 04:01

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - edlithgow

If you want to go totally bangernomic, and you have the space, you might consider keeping the old one and mining it for spare parts.

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Wed 14 Aug 2019 11:10

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - skidpan

Occurs to me that in Englandshire driving through a ford a few times in the spring might be an option to get embedded winter salt out of the nether regions.

No need. Driving on wet English roads pumps enough water onto the underside of the car to clean it off. In comparison a jet wash is at best a bucket full.

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Fri 16 Aug 2019 04:55

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - edlithgow

Occurs to me that in Englandshire driving through a ford a few times in the spring might be an option to get embedded winter salt out of the nether regions.

No need. Driving on wet English roads pumps enough water onto the underside of the car to clean it off. In comparison a jet wash is at best a bucket full.

A happy thought. Should make driving in the rain a pleasure for y'all..

Here, not so much. In the current rainstorms its a bit like driving a submersible.

In my case possibly a leaky late Soviet submersible (recently saw Kursk) if leaky late Soviet submersibles had ineffective windscreen wipers.

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Wed 14 Aug 2019 13:17

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - John F

I've had my Honda Accord 2002 for just over 9 years. I do on average 8000 miles. Car has 116k on the clock......
(definitely the best car I've ever had)
....Each year this car has cost me circa £300 in repair bills (I don't get it serviced - I just change the oil myself).

I don't think that's too bad :)

Well, I think that's dreadful :( You must have had some lemons! I don't think our 140k Focus (older than your Accord), which also doesn't get 'serviced' , has cost much more than £500 in repair bills in its whole life! (wheel bearing, coil pack, fuel pump, welding).

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Wed 14 Aug 2019 18:03

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Turkish_Emperor

Or maybe I used to run more expensive cars ? (which I did used to have serviced regularly).

Aren't Ford cars are cheap for a reason ;) first and last one I owned I was convinced was made from reused sardine cans.....

Edited by JezUK on 14/08/2019 at 18:04

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Fri 16 Aug 2019 15:38

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - SLO76

Not worth doing a timing belt change on a car that’s one step from the scrap yard. Do the basics only and bin it when anything major fails. These engines aren’t hard on timing belts anyway so I’ll bet it’ll never fail.

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Mon 19 Aug 2019 14:55

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - gordonbennet

I'm late to this one but agree about getting the welding done but i'd then run if for another year and see what happens at the next MOT, if it's passable with just a few quid spent, then give it another oil change and get another year, you won't find cheaper motoring with a decent sized comfortable car than this.

Regarding the cambelt, i'm not familiar with the layout, but on most cars its possible to remove at least part of the plastic cover and have a good look at the belt, especially if you can see it where it stretches the teeth over an idler/tensioner, if it looks good it will almost certainly carry on.

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Sat 29 Aug 2020 14:20

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Turkish_Emperor

I thought I'd update my post of a year ago :)

During lockdown the car had a serious failure - the power assisting cooler pipe had rusted (it's right at the front of the car, in front of the radiator and is a common failure on a vehicle of this age)....

Furthermore, the part is not cheap, nor was it available anywhere else, not even off a scrap yard or ebay, so I had to buy an original (as if lockdown wasn't bad enough, try having no car at all and living in a rural area to boot.....)....

Thankfully I was able to purchase the part online (£200) and fitted it myself (lots of online help, thanks to the Honda Forums)....

Next, the Engine Mount needed replacing (again, another common problem and also one which thankfully I could also fit myself - cost around £50)....

Finally, I gave it a good service, plugs, air-filter (hadn't been changed in around 5 years), pas fluid etc....

And...... the car passed its MOT 2 weeks ago with NO Fails :) (an absolute first in a long time).

No advisories on any rust (on the structure).

So.... another year's motoring - but still the cam-belt is something I'm still pondering whether to get changed - were it to fail it'd be a major inconvenience that'd cost in lost earnings / car hire / minicabs etc - to get it done would cost around £320, and that'd give me peace of mind for the next 2 years (and then I really must change this car).

So... effectlively £150 per year over the next two years.....

(I drive around 8,000-10,000 miles per year, but am hoping to do a bit of sight-seeing across our beautiful country, hence why I'd really like the peace of mind bit of getting it done).

Edited by JezUK on 29/08/2020 at 14:22

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Sat 29 Aug 2020 15:09

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - SLO76

I wouldn’t bother. These aren’t hard on belts, it’s rare that a failed belt will be the reason for an Accord going for scrap. I’d leave it be and make sure you’ve money set aside ready to replace it when something major fails. Basic maintenance only is how I’d treat such a low value motor. If something good comes up in the meantime then snap it up, it’s always best to car shop when you’re in no rush.

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Sat 29 Aug 2020 15:27

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Railroad.

I wouldn't bother either. Changing the cambelt, or otherwise, guarantees nothing. It might reduce the risk of a failure but it cannot and does not guarantee it won't. It's an old car and it owes you nothing. I would just do the essentials and keep it going the best you can. It'll most likely go on for a good while yet.

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Sat 29 Aug 2020 16:05

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Turkish_Emperor

Parts do wear, I accept that, and I accept that those parts will more than likely be other than just the essentials.

My approach is that £200 - £300 a year on new parts is better spent on this than putting £5000-7000 down on a 5-7 years younger car, a 2008-2010 car (which may come with issues as well).

It's a tough call, but by 2 further years from now I know other parts will be ready to start wanting to be changed (exhaust, brake pads etc) and then I really will have to say adios to this VERY faithful vehicle....

(I'll have had it for 12 years by then and in all that time, the total cost of all services put together would have been less than just one of my larger Mercedes services I had done previous to this car....)

PS - Car is on 123,700 now (so less than 8,000 since I posted exactly last year).

Edited by JezUK on 29/08/2020 at 16:58

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Sat 29 Aug 2020 17:31

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - John F

If I've read this thread right your cambelt has only done 77,000 miles. I would echo all those above who suggest leave well alone. The original cambelt in our Focus has done nearly twice this mileage and is nearly twenty years old. I would expect your Honda's to be just as good.

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Sun 30 Aug 2020 01:55

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - edlithgow

If I've read this thread right your cambelt has only done 77,000 miles. I would echo all those above who suggest leave well alone. The original cambelt in our Focus has done nearly twice this mileage and is nearly twenty years old. I would expect your Honda's to be just as good.

I would echo those above who echo those above who suggest rolling the dice on the cambelt change. which is what I'm doing myself on a Honda Accord 97.

I'd also echo those above who say spray it with something

Spray it with something.

In The Yook corrosion is a more immediate and guaranteed existential threat than a cambelt failure,. and countermeasures are risk free (provided you keep it off the brake disks) requiring no expenditure, skills or tools beyond a disposable plant sprayer thing, eye protection and some rubber gloves.

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Sun 30 Aug 2020 06:42

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Turkish_Emperor

If I've read this thread right your cambelt has only done 77,000 miles. I would echo all those above who suggest leave well alone. The original cambelt in our Focus has done nearly twice this mileage and is nearly twenty years old. I would expect your Honda's to be just as good.

Thing is, Ford Focus cambelt changes are suggested at 150,000 miles, Honda Accord cambelt changes are to be at every 70,000 miles.

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Sun 30 Aug 2020 09:32

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Andrew-T

<< Ford Focus cambelt changes are suggested at 150,000 miles, Honda Accord cambelt changes are to be at every 70,000 miles. >>

And then there is the additional variable of whether all cambelts (and their copy equivalents) are of equal durability; plus the sort of life each car has been subjected to. All these numbers are very round, and should include a decent safety margin. But who knows ? If you are a gentle driver, leaving well alone may be a safe bet.

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Sun 30 Aug 2020 09:33

Honda Accord 2002 - Car failed MOT, need advice (do I keep repairing?) - Railroad.

Thing is, Ford Focus cambelt changes are suggested at 150,000 miles, Honda Accord cambelt changes are to be at every 70,000 miles.

Those are only recommendations and only apply when the car is new. The manufacturer has no idea, nor cares about the condition of your car, or how it's used once it's sold and gone into service. Take all service and replacement interval recommendations with a huge pinch of salt. Common sense must be factored in as soon as the car takes to the road, and certainly once it's over two or three years old.

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