Used Tyres | Motoring discussion | Back Room Forum

Sat 26 Jan 2013 15:51

Used Tyres - Hugo {P}

With tighter budgets being forced upon us I suspect this is one topic that will come up time and time again for discussion.

I have just spent £20 on two nearly new tyres for the Almera. I paid another £5 to have both tyres fitted to my wheels.. Local to us we have a scrap yard. They are not a breakers yard as such but they are an approved ELV depot. Most vehicles are processed and then crushed - the processing involves removing the wheels and separating the wheels fromt the tyres. A few, including a handful of Land Rover Discovery 1s and some commercial vehicles are kept and broken in the way a car breaker would.

If the tyres are very good they keep them back on the rims. In my case these have around 90% of the tread depth. If they are mediocre they do not bother. All the tyres I saw there had around 75% or more tread remaining. There are a few with 100% tread on that were obviously spares.

When you are quoted £90 to have new tyres supplied and fitted this has to be a reasonable alternative. I wouldn't pay any more for decent part worn tyres but I rather think our scrap yard is going to be doing quite a trade at the moment.

On the other hand, there are many motorists who would not venture near a part worn tyre. The thought of going to a breaker's yard and talking to some hairy ape of a proprietor about part worn tyres and thinking he may just peddle whatever it takes to make a few quid will put some people off. TBH if that was the only option to me I think I would go for new too. But when you're dealing with a bunch of people who have always been fair to you, know you and your family and you can have all the time in the world to look over the tyre, and wheel in question and make an assessment, the prospect is rather more inviting.

These tyres will likely last almost as long as their new equivalents and will have cost me less than a 3rd of the price. On the other hand some may get fobbed off by other places for a set with a 1/3rd of the tread remaining and paying over the odds. Thus when he comes to change them he's actually paid more per mile for his 2nd hand ones than he would have for his new ones.

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Sat 26 Jan 2013 16:03

Used Tyres - RT

Always check the manufacturing date of the tyres being offered,

The week and year of manufacture of a tyre is always marked on the sidewall.
A tyre marked 3308 was manufactured in week 33 of 2008.

Find a string of numbers & letters close to the tyres bead usually starting with DOT. At the end of the string you will find the 3 or 4 numbers relating to your tyres age.
If your tyres have just 3 numbers they will have been made pre- 2000 and even if they still have plenty of tread on them we suggest changing as they may be subject to rubber corrosion.

We do not recommend fitting tyres that are more than 5 years old even if they have been on the shelf.

tyres-exhausts-brakes-orpington.com/your-tyres-man.../

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Sat 26 Jan 2013 16:21

Used Tyres - skidpan

The law relating to part worn tyres is as follows:

Under The Motor Vehicle Tyres (Safety) Regulations 1994 (reg.7.) part of the Consumer Protection Act, it is an offence for anyone to sell part worn tyres that do not meet the following principal requirements:

1) The structural integrity should be free of large cuts, any bulges or lumps both internally and externally. No plies or cords should be exposed.

2) Part worn tyres which have not been retreaded must clearly show the relevant 'E' mark alongside which 'PART-WORN' must be permanently and legibly applied in letters at least 4mm high.

3) Tyres must have passed an inflation test prior to sale.

4) The original grooves must still be clearly visible in their entirely and must be to a depth of at least 2mm across the full breadth of the tread, around its entire circumference.

5) Part worn tyres which have been retreaded must show the relevant British Standards mark as applied at the time of retreading alongside which 'PART-WORN' must be permanently and legibly applied in letters at least 4mm high.

6) Any repair to a part worn tyre must have been carried out in accordance with paragraphs 4-7 of BS AU 159.

Do your tyres comply with all the above. Would be very surprised if they comply with 2 and 3, these are what most used tyre dealers are prosecuted for. If they do not comply I urge you to report the seller to Trading Standards for breaking the law and risking public safety.

But why buy part worn tyres even if they comply with the above. Your life depends upon 4 small patches of rubber and in the case of part worn you do not have a clue why they were removed from the car they were originally on. It could have been in a severe accident and damage could have been sustained that is not yet visible. At best tyres are not removed from cars when they are perfectly good for amny more 1000's of miles.

Good quality, budget, new tyres are generally available and are a better long term buy. For starters you have a garantee and know that the tyre has not been damaged. You will also get the full wear out of the tyre rather than what is left. If you paid £25 fitted for a 1/2 worn tyre £50 for a new one is just as good a buy and far safer.

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Sat 26 Jan 2013 16:50

Used Tyres - Collos25

Unfortunatley they cannot provide the tyres history and the letter above says its your life and other peoples at risk.Main source of used tyres is Germany where winter tyres are thrown away at 4mm and Summer tyres are normally disposed of at 3mm and because the lax rules of the UK MoT regarding tyres there is a ready market for these death traps.

The OP is also correct in saying that this subject has been talked to death splitting into two camps those that will use death traps and those that will not.

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Sat 26 Jan 2013 18:18

Used Tyres - Chris M

2) Part worn tyres which have not been retreaded must clearly show the relevant 'E' mark alongside which 'PART-WORN' must be permanently and legibly applied in letters at least 4mm high.

3) Tyres must have passed an inflation test prior to sale.

The OP knows these tyres are part worn and there is no suggestion that the seller was passing them off as anything other than what they are. If the OP has driven home and the tyres still have air in them, then they have passed the inflation test. There is no evidence to suggest these tyres are "death traps" any more than the tyres on the millions of vehicles that get sold second hand each year.

The majority of cars over 7 or 8 years old will be scrapped for minor accident damage, expensive (relative to the cars value) mechanical failure or MoT failure.

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Sat 26 Jan 2013 18:48

Used Tyres - unthrottled

2) Part worn tyres which have not been retreaded must clearly show the relevant 'E' mark alongside which 'PART-WORN' must be permanently and legibly applied in letters at least 4mm high.

3) Tyres must have passed an inflation test prior to sale.

Mine were properly marked, pressure tested and balanced in front of me. They represented good value for money for me (even on the £/mm usable tread depth), especially since my car won't last long enough to go through a new set of tyres.

There will always be people who are frightened of second hand tyres, but they're probably the people who feel out of depth in anywhere other than a glossy car showroom with complimentary coffee machines dotted around.

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Sat 26 Jan 2013 20:28

Used Tyres - Collos25

Not frightened "safe" is the word.

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Sat 26 Jan 2013 20:43

Used Tyres - RT

Once we're out of the showroom, we're all driving on used tyres.

Buying part-worn tyres is no worse than buying a used car.

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Sun 27 Jan 2013 14:13

Used Tyres - Collos25

Once we're out of the showroom, we're all driving on used tyres.

Buying part-worn tyres is no worse than buying a used car.

But you do not know the history of the tyre it could have come of a crashed car or one thats been on fire only an X ray would tell you if the innards were damaged.

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Sun 27 Jan 2013 14:18

Used Tyres - RT

But you do not know the history of the tyre it could have come of a crashed car or one thats been on fire only an X ray would tell you if the innards were damaged.

Nor do you know the history if you buy a used car.

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Sun 27 Jan 2013 18:03

Used Tyres - Collos25

But you do not know the history of the tyre it could have come of a crashed car or one thats been on fire only an X ray would tell you if the innards were damaged.

Nor do you know the history if you buy a used car.

Of course you would not know on a used car but I would think the odds are in your favour ,your buying the car with the tyres but when you are buying tyres only then you have a choice whether to buy or not to buy there are those the same as myself who would keep the odds in in their favour by buying new and those on the other side who would increase the risk factor by buying secondhand .Simple really you pays your money and you make your choice.

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Sun 27 Jan 2013 16:12

Used Tyres - Hugo {P}

With regards to the inflation test they were seen inflated on their original wheels when I bought them.

I actually have a 3rd, on a wheel that hasn't even touched the road - you can tell by the little bobbles on the contact area of the tread still being intact. I suspect it was a spare.

That isn't currently inflated but it is easily tested simply by attaching it to an air line.

I'm glad a number of you have mentioned about 2nd hand cars having part worn tyres. It's this little fact that people overlook.

A question to those people who won't touch part worn tyres - when you buy a used car do you immediately take it to the tyre depot to replace all the tyres so you know what you're driving on?

Whilst people will gladly accept a well presented 2nd hand car that could have hit a kerb with both front wheels at speed without causing any or very little visible damage and take the tyres on in good faith, they won't consider a tyre that can be put in front of them, off the wheel if need be so they can inspect it for punctures, sidewall damage, date stamp as above and cracking etc. Maybe it's the engineer in me that can't make sense of that.

The prepensity for people to take on board a whole used car that could have faults and be the subject of cheap repairs out of used parts (discs, pads, drums, hubs, shoes tyres etc - yes it happens) but to balk at being offered a tyre that is accurately described, well selected etc is there I guess.

I suspect a lot of the local car dealers will be getting in part worn tyres that still have plenty of tread to put on their stock - especially in this climate. Also, I wouldn't put it past some of them to rob the wheels off cars that they take as trade ins but end up scrapping.

It's also a question of economics. The poster who suggests that I paid 1/2 the price for 1/2 the tread is wrong. I didn't and I wouldn't. You have to look at cost per mile, I paid less than 1/4 of the price for 90% of the tread. There are those comediens out there who do charge 1/2 new fitted price for tat. I wouldn't pay that and I would probably avoid them on the same basis as one would a car dealer they know to be dodgy.

I do accept that there is always a risk to buying 2nd hand in anything. Whether it be a house, which is why you approach it with caution getting surveys etc, a car, a washing machine or anything which can work one minute and fail the next. There's even a risk involved driving a vehicle that you've had from new - I know all about that having broken down in the van recently.

However tyre sellers love to paint a picture of a used tyre come into the yard buried in a mangled heap of a car with shards poking into it from all angles then being offered for sale. I'm sure that sometimes happens in the same way that lemons of used cars come in with 1001 faults, get bodged up and flogged on. But find me a car manufacturer that warns against buying used cars - you won't because to run such a campaign successfully will kill used values and people will be reluctant to buy new if they can't trade old ones in or sell them on - their investment will simply plummit to scrap value the minute their new toys leave the show room.

Yes, buyers should be aware but to say that all used tyres are death traps is not IMO a valid arguement.

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Sat 26 Jan 2013 21:00

Used Tyres - Smileyman

Few years ago I sold a couple of tyres on ebay. I'd changed from 17" to 16" wheels and the 17" tyres had plenty of tread left. New they cost well over £100 each, were in perfect condition and less than 5 years old.

The buyer needed new tyres of the same size, he drove over 100 miles to pick them up - I can't remember how much cash I was paid but it fitted my ethos of not gratuitiously wasting something of value. This was a private sale, the tyre history known and seller reliable (I am!).

Would I buy a used tyre - possibly, but with caution.

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Sat 26 Jan 2013 21:19

Used Tyres - Bobbin Threadbare

If you buy a used car privately, it will have 'part worn' tyres on it....

These tyres make financial and environmental sense. What if the rubber was recycled into 'new' tyres? Would that make people feel better?

If the tyre is reasonably new (so that the rubber hasn't suffered UV degradation) and the tread is legal and quality is roadworthy, then they are a good idea. You can't guarantee that a new tyre fresh off the line hasn't got a flaw in it any more than a tyre with 10% usage.

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Sat 26 Jan 2013 21:36

Used Tyres - gordonbennet

I do exactly the same as you Smileyman.

I have sold numerous tyres on the auction site, i have good feedback for them, i describe them very carefully, i guarantee that the tyres have never been damaged or repaired or otherwise abused, i know because they have come from my vehicles for various reasons.

I also know that the world is full of dishonour and lies starting at the very top of govt, monkey see monkey do its filtered all the way down, so i would be extremely wary of buying unless i could tell that the seller was selling his own items and not buying truckloads of any old tat too pass on for a quick buck.

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Sun 27 Jan 2013 16:24

Used Tyres - Hugo {P}

I help run The D2 Boys Club where the members regularly buy, sell and swap tyres. We also discuss problems we've had with our vehicles and ask for advice on how to fix them.

To the best of my memory we haven't actually had even one problem reported regarding tyres, save for the odd puncture that can't be repaired easily.

I was offered a complete set of alloys with good tyres on for a very good price from one member. These will go on as my current ones wear out. In addition I have a set of 4 nearly new tyres for the Ka on the correct wheels.

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Sun 27 Jan 2013 18:21

Used Tyres - Cyd

Over about a dozen years of very active motorsport involvement throughout the 80s and 90s, myself and fellow motor club members must have bought 100s of second hand and rally remould tyres. These tyres were alll subjected to serious motorsport use of various sorts (mostly rallying of some sort). Lots of sideways action, loose and smooth 'tarmac' events, even some 'forest' stages along with tarmac and grass autotests.

I cannot remember ever having any serious issues with these tyres. True, we bought carefully and from reputable sources (as one should).

The tyres on my current car will need replacement soon, having about 4.5mm on three (so have c12k left, about 18 months motoring for me). One however has reached the legal minimum (the previous owner mustn't have replaced all at once), so I'm going to look for a replacement with 4-5 on it to allow me to get best value out of the set before replacing them all as a set of four. At around £500 ish for a set, I cannot afford to simply throw away good rubber.

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Sun 27 Jan 2013 20:38

Used Tyres - Hugo {P}

You could of course see what your spare is like and run that with it.

If it's new run that until the others need replacing, pop 4 good tyres on and pop the spare back in the boot.

If it's near its legal limit, put 2 new ones on the same axle (front) then pop the 4.5mm one in the back as the spare.

At some point I guess you'll need to swap front and back over, rather like I did with the van.

The two I got are exactly the same tread and they are on the front. The two on the rear are also the same tread - replaced in the same way a few years ago. But they are different treads.

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Sun 27 Jan 2013 21:00

Used Tyres - Cyd

Thanks, Hugo, but the spare is a space saver. And the worn one needs replacing.

BTW if you only putting 2 tyres on a car, they should go on the back. I shalln't go into why, it's been done to death (or check the advice on most major tyre manufacturers websites).

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Sun 27 Jan 2013 22:48

Used Tyres - Mr Fox

Why not buy and use them ? If you are satisfied that what you are buying is OK and worth the money, there are many arguments in favour, especially concerning buying a used car.

There are far too many negative people on here that must have nothing else going on in their lives so they can only spend their entire time to criticise and ridicule people who come on here with genuine concerns and questions they want to discuss in an open way.

I hope I get banned, I actually rather enjoy reading HJ's column in the Telegraph, but this forum is overrun with people I would not cross the street to help if they were on fire.

(Edit - sorry, Mr Fox, but I've had to edit this a bit, as some of your comments would have been like a red rag to a bull to the people you're rightly complaining about. Apparently it happens on a lot of forums: it's known as 'internet bullying'. They think that because you can't see them, they can say what they like, and they seem not to understand that some people, particular those new to the forum and not knowing much about cars, can be genuinely upset.

I should add that this applies to some other threads rather than this one, where the comments are reasonable..

I know absolutely nothing about racehorses: I really don't know whether females or males run faster or whether there's a difference. But if I needed to ask that very basic question on a racing forum, I hope that someone would reply informatively without patronising me or making it clear that they thought I was an idiot.)

Edited by Avant on 28/01/2013 at 00:33

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Mon 28 Jan 2013 02:19

Used Tyres - Hugo {P}

Thanks Mr Fox

I wanted to open up the discussion in general to get people thinking about this very subject and am not at all ashamed to admit that I last bought new tyres about 4 years ago. They were for my van and cost £50 each including fitting and balancing etc. Since then I have bought some 10 used all at £10 each, or slightly more.

The last 3 were 2 for the front of the car in question that were swapped over to the alloys on the car and the third because it was there, new and too good to pass up for when a rear may need doing - although my preference would be to have 2 the same tread.

The previous 3 were pretty much 3 years ago, same car. similar amount of tread remaining on 2 of them and a brand new spare - that time on the correct wheel for the car. As I ended up having to put the spare on an alloy rim to replace one that had a bad punclure and wasn't worth replacing I just threw the other spare on its steel wheel in the boot. That will need looking over when I come to replace the ones on the rear. as it will then be getting on a bit..

I also bought 4 tyres on the correct wheels for the Ka. Private seller who had changed his for the 14 inch alloys. These won't even incur the fitting and balancing cost when needed - they'll just go straight on and have the pressures checked. These have about 75 % or more tread remaining.

I do like a debate but just saying I'm fitting 'death traps' without providing a response to counter arguments I put is a little pointless.

I had a similar chat earlier today (yesterday now) with a friend of mine. I couldn't help notice his 15 inch tyres on his Vectra were getting low. He's going to be looking at £200 to change them all. I'm sure the scrap yard will have some good tyres on Vectra rims - all fitted and balanced and ready to go, but he won't be convinced - he buys new because he prefers to avoid what he perceives as unacceptable risk from having used. He too has only had to start replacing them once the ones on the car when he bought it got to minimum tread.

That said - I would probably pass up 90% of tyres offered for sale and would likely choose the seller very carefully. If I heard of someone doing them for £5 each I wouldn't necessarily rush to them. I know this guy and can trust him and the guys that work for him.

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Mon 28 Jan 2013 02:43

Used Tyres - Hugo {P}

Thanks, Hugo, but the spare is a space saver. And the worn one needs replacing.

BTW if you only putting 2 tyres on a car, they should go on the back. I shalln't go into why, it's been done to death (or check the advice on most major tyre manufacturers websites).

That is possibly partly due to the fact that front tyres wear quicker than rears and it makes sense to have older tyres on the front because there is less chance of them deteriorating before they are fully used. I made the mistake of having new on the front of the van and keeping the old on the rear. Recently I had them swapped over and now the fronts are wearing faster - hopefully before they perish, whilst the rears are much newer.

Now, in your case I would probably do one of the things below. I don't like those space saver wheels at all.

1) Buy yourself another standard wheel from a breakers with or without tyre (they go for peanuts if you can find one) put 2 new tyres on the car using your newly acquired wheel and the one with the tyre that needs changing, then keep the 4.5mm as a spare and ditch the space saver (or keep it incase you sell the car)

2) Buy yourself the 5th standard wheel with a tyre on it. Shop around and you should be able to get a good one with most of its tread for around £10 I reckon - store the one you need to change now and put the newly acquired one on in its place until the other one needs changing, then keep the better of the two as a spare and change the tyres on the other two wheels. Again you then have a 5th standard size spare.

3) Simply do what I did. Buy 2 nearly new treaded tyres on the correct wheels and swap them over. Stick the 4.5mm one in the boot in place of the space saver and ditch the other one.

That is of course assuming you're not running on alloys of course, and you would be happy to cope with the inconvenience of a regular wheel in the boot designed to take a space saver wheel.

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Wed 30 Jan 2013 20:44

Used Tyres - Mr Fox

Chatting to a Guy at AUDI, they replace all tyres that are more than 40% worn on their approved used cars, these tyres are in all probability absolutely fine, but in order that they can charge top whack for their used cars, average mark up over PX value is 4 Grand, they replace the tyres, and I'm sure these still have some value in them, I wonder what they do with them ?

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Wed 30 Jan 2013 23:44

Used Tyres - Hugo {P}

My guess is that like most dealerships these days they'll go to a tyre outlet for their tyres and said tyre outlet will claim to dispose of these.

It wouldn't surprise me if they channeled them off somewhere.

I'll never forget witnessing a couple who came into a tyre fitters whilst I was there. They were driving a Fiat Uno and had damaged a tyre and wheel. They clearly had no idea of the concept of used spares. After finding out how much a new wheel from Fiat was they took up a suggestion to go to a breaker's yard. Said breaker supplied them with the right spare wheel out of a Fiat Uno. It just happened to have a tyre on it. Total cost £5 at the time.

The tyre was immaculate - so why oh why go and get it changed for a new one??

That old tyre disappeard within seconds of coming off the wheel!

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Thu 31 Jan 2013 10:05

Used Tyres - Collos25

Perhaps it was out of date.

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Thu 31 Jan 2013 10:27

Used Tyres - RT

Removed by RT

Edited by RT on 31/01/2013 at 10:28

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