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The first question I would ask is, how mechanically minded are you? Can you fix the car yourself, or will you have to pay a garage every time something goes wrong?
In any event, I would suggest that you look at buying a car that has a good reputation for longevity and reliability, to reduce your chances of having extra expense during the time you have finance on it. Japanese cars are normally recommended, something like a Yaris for example. Others on here will no doubt make more suggestions.
There's no answer to whether you are spending too much. If you can afford it, why not? Obviously it's possible to buy a reliable car for £500, but if it's not, you'll possibly spend your spare time working on it, and negate any savings. Personal choice really!
Edited by Mike H on 21/12/2011 at 11:02
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If I may make a suggestion - try your hardest to pay your insurance all in one go. You will pay a lot less. I learnt to drive when I was 24 (~4 years ago) and my insurance on a 1.6 Focus cost me £800 - I really feel for you having to cough up over a grand for a miniature car!
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Unless your job and income is absolutely guaranteed do not take a loan out, even if you've got the most secure job in the country still don't take a loan out on something that will depreciate and has ongoing maintenance and running costs.
Its your first car so you need somebody with you who really knows about cars underneath the body (as against talks big) when you look to buy, and you need to find a good reliable tame mechanic if you can't fix it yourself....in fact if you have such a chap around and he works on a particular make all the time that could be your lead on what to buy.
Buy what you can afford, if it all goes pear shaped after a while you'll not still be paying plus interest on something long consigned to bad dreams.
As for aftermarket warranties, i can't speak for others opinions but if you take £250 in crisp tenners, light them and watch them burn at least you will have got something from the deal.
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Fiats are one of the most unreliable cars on the road, as Mike H says look for something Japanese. We have had a couple of Micras and never spent a penny on either. You could get a belter newer than the Fiat for your £3000, insurance group 2 and well for the 1.2 and they have a fair turn of speed.
Always remember when buying used that the previous owner may well be selling because the car has a fault, this is especially important if you buy private.
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"Fiats are one of the most unreliable cars on the road" and the Micra is probably the least cool car for a 25 year old to be seen in. May not be an issue for the OP, but I'd go for the Punto out of the two any day. We've owned five Fiats over the years and they have been no less reliable than the other makes and with the added advantage of being easy to repair and cheap/available parts.
I'd also bear in mind that whilst you are gaining experience you may well scrape the odd curb or pick up the odd parking knock. The newer the car, the more it may bother you that it no longer looks prestine. An old car for 6 months lets you get some miles under your belt.
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"Fiats are one of the most unreliable cars on the road" and the Micra is probably the least cool car for a 25 year old to be seen in.
You have been lucky, simply look at any reliabilty forum, Fiats are way worse than Nissans.
Surely a new driver needs a car that is reliable rather than ultra cool, being parked up waiting for a breakdown truck is not very cool especially if you have a lady in tow at the time.
The OP appears to be a sensible chap, looking cool was not one of his criteria.
When I bought my first car it cost £75, insurance cost £50 and it never let me down but what a total bag of s***e, would be considered as lethal today. Earlier this year I sold some tyres to a chap on e-bay, he came to collect them in a "W" reg Proton of some description. He had bought an Astra and had been trying to sell the Proton but no-one wanted it. Looking around it there was no rust, paint was great, the interior was unmarked with only 35,000 on the clock, one previous elderly owner. He was going to scrap it later that day. If only cars that good for £200 had been available in 1974, young people have never had it so good.
Sod "Cool" when the car would have cost peanuts.
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When I bought my first car it cost £75, insurance cost £50 and it never let me down but what a total bag of s***e, would be considered as lethal today. Earlier this year I sold some tyres to a chap on e-bay, he came to collect them in a "W" reg Proton of some description. He had bought an Astra and had been trying to sell the Proton but no-one wanted it. Looking around it there was no rust, paint was great, the interior was unmarked with only 35,000 on the clock, one previous elderly owner. He was going to scrap it later that day. If only cars that good for £200 had been available in 1974, young people have never had it so good.
Sod "Cool" when the car would have cost peanuts.
There's a Proton dealership near where I live. They aren't actually ugly and they're cheap as chips.
Personally, I couldn't care less what a chap drives as long as he doesn't drive like a complete a***.
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Thanks for the replies. A lot of information to take in there, but incredibly helpful. I'm certainly rethinking my options.
I think saving money would undoubtedly be the most sensible option as i want to buy something decent and reliable, but I fear my impatience might get the better of me. It's a long time to wait after passing my test, especially if I still intend to go with the more expensive car.
I'm not really mechanically minded, which is why the used dealer with a warranty seemed to be the best option... Whatever I buy, i'll take someone with me who knows more than I do! And i'm sure I can pick up some car maintenance knowledge fairly rapidly.
I knew someone would mention that Fiats are unreliable. I've heard the same before, but I've also heard the newer models are a lot more reliable. The problem is if I start looking at Fords or Vauxhalls, my insurance quotes inflate to ridiculous amounts. I'll definitely check out the Japanese makes, but I've never been too crazy about the looks of their smaller cars.
@ Chris M
That's interesting you say that Fiats are easy to repair with cheap/available parts. I'd gotten the impression elsewhere that Fiats where expensive to service and maintain. Thats one of the concerns I had over borrowing money to buy one - that I wouldn't still be driving it by the time the loan was paid. Good looking cars, I was just a bit worried about reliability.
Edited by dan.hall on 21/12/2011 at 13:23
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@ thunderbird
You're right, reliability and not throwing my money at a wasted purchase is my main concern. But being a guy aged 25, I am trying to get a decent looking car at the best price I can without compromising my insurance rates, and the Grande Punto fits the bill there.
Edited by dan.hall on 21/12/2011 at 13:30
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Dan, you'll have to do some test drives. Only you will know what you feel most comfortable in, and what you're happy with.
Having said that, I'd be looking at small Toyotas and Kias and the like if I was buying a first car that I didn't have to share!
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I bought aToyota Yaris 6 years ago.
Quote from local MOT Satation: "we get very few probelms from them".
They also do service and repairs.
Quote from MOT tester. "I hate Fiats and Renaults and Citroens. When things go wrong, they are usually difficult to fix and owners don't like to pay the costs of fixing them properly"
Edited by madf on 21/12/2011 at 14:37
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I bought aToyota Yaris 6 years ago.
Quote from local MOT Satation: "we get very few probelms from them".
They also do service and repairs.
Quote from MOT tester. "I hate Fiats and Renaults and Citroens. When things go wrong, they are usually difficult to fix and owners don't like to pay the costs of fixing them properly"
Seems like some people really have an issue with Fiat, while others seem to think they're the best cars they've driven. Need to get a test drive in so I can decide where I stand on the matter.
If you look here for example http://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-reviews/fiat/grande_punto/33706 the occasional person seems to have a bad experience, but the majority rate it highly.
A number of reviewers also comment it's ideal for a first car.
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It's a long time to wait after passing my test
I waited 7 years!
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Just looked at a couple of reliability/customer satisfaction surveys, grim reading for the Grande Punto. In Auto Express it came 99th out of 100, in the Motoring Which? survey it came 46th= out of 50 in its category.
With reasonably modern cars like the Grande Punto don't expect them to be easy to repair because like most modern cars you will require a large assortment of special tools and electronic diagnostic equipment. Since Italian cars traditionally suffer poor electrics you will need access to a good Auto Electrician since DIY is virtually impossible. This does not just apply to the Fiat, problem sorting on any modern car is way more difficult that it was in my youth when a man with a big hammer could sort most problems.
Remember when the Grande Punto came out, we had an old telly at the time and when the adverts came on it could not display the full name, would you have bought a "rande punt"?
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Just looked at a couple of reliability/customer satisfaction surveys, grim reading for the Grande Punto. In Auto Express it came 99th out of 100, in the Motoring Which? survey it came 46th= out of 50 in its category.
Do you have a link to that survey on Auto Express? Looking for it now but can't find it. The car itself gets fair to good ratings there, but its the user experience ratings I'm more interested in.
Thanks for mentioning that site. Some useful information on used car ratings, I'm surprised I didn't come across this before.
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Thanks for the links. Both extremely useful!
Reliability Index looks good. Quite amusing that Porshe for example is almost a rock bottom 'poor' in every single category. If thats correct, they must cost a fortune to keep on the road.
Fiat seems to be about halfway down the list, which isn't nearly as bad as it could have been. Still not convinced they're as awful as some are saying. Japanes cars sitting in the top 3 slots as suggested by others on this thread.
The autoexpress link shows top 100 cars rated as 'favourite/most popular' of 2011, so I'm not sure how much indication that gives of the reliability of the car itself, but still, lots to pore over here before I make any decisions. Thanks again : )
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The autoexpress link shows top 100 cars rated as 'favourite/most popular' of 2011, so I'm not sure how much indication that gives of the reliability of the car itself, but still, lots to pore over here before I make any decisions. Thanks again : )
The full AutoExpress report has categpories for
Reliabilty
Build Quality
Running Costs
Performance
Braking
Ride Quality
Handling
Practicality
Comfort
Ease of Driving
They have all bases covered but how relevant practicality, comfort, ease of driving, ride quality and performance are I don't know, surely these should be checked on a test drive, if you are not happy don't buy. At least they don't have a category for appearance like one survey had a few years ago, why would anyone buy a car they did not like the shape of and then complain, did they buy it wearing a blindfold for gods sake.
Edited by thunderbird on 22/12/2011 at 14:38
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