Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services

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Wed 20 Jul 2011 23:15
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - Chipmonk0606

I am after some advice and what my chances are with getting a favorable outcome.

In a nutshell, I took my car to a well known car servicing centre last week for an MOT and when I went to pick it up I discovered that the whole of the near side had been damaged including wing mirror. The damage looks like it had been done with either another vehicle or heavy object scrapping the length of the car from the near side passenger door to the near side rear bumper. Resulting in heavy dents thay have pierced the door skin and rear wing.

The garage are denying that they did it and claims that the car was already like that when they did the MOT. In otherwords they are saying that the car was either damaged before I drove it to them or it was damaged within their customer car park.

They also say that cars parked within their customer car park are the responsibility of the owners and if something happens to the car it is not their responsibility. This they say is clarified by a sign at the front of their building saying "cars parked at their owners risk".

As far as I am concerned once I hand the keys over to them, the garage has a duty of care to look after the vehicle. But if their is a sign outside would this absolve them of blame?

I have already started the process of taking them to small claims court but wondered what my chances are of claiming for damages because at the end of the day it is going to be my word against possibly a few of them.

Some points to consider:

The car was dropped off early in the morning and picked up at the end of the day. Meaning they had the keys to car for the whole day. Therefore the damage would have been done within that time.

The MOT report only mentioned broken wing mirror and not any damage to the car. Which means if the car had already been damaged should they not have specified this on the report as well as the broken wing mirror?

The damage to the car will cost in the region of £960 - £2000 to repair. If it goes to court, is it likely that the garage will be represented by a solicitor?

What are my chances of winning this claim?

If I win, would I be able to get the full amount to repair the car as the value of my car is approx £1100?

I would be very grateful if anyone could off me some advice on how to tackle this.

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Thu 21 Jul 2011 07:51
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - ifithelps

You have done the right thing by starting a starting a small claim.

It may be the garage will offer to settle when they receive notification of a hearing from the court, which carries much more weight than you saying: "I intend to claim against you."

While it is your word against theirs, you can build your case a little with a statement from the last person to see your car undamaged.

As you say, the MoT sheet also supports your case.

I think if the court finds the car was damaged in the care of the garage and on their property, the sign is irrelevant.

County court hearings are aimed at settling disputes, so the more reasonable your stance, the better you will get on.

I don't think you can reasonably claim more than the value of the car, give or take a modest amount for expenses.

Get a couple of estimates for the repairs to include with your claim.

County court hearings are informal, so I wouldn't worry if the garage is represented or not - that's up to them.

As with all court hearings, be polite and respectful to everybody, and say 'please' and 'thank you' a few more times than you would normally - judges like that sort of thing.

Behaving in this way adds to your credibility, which is at stake here.

Another point in your favour is the standard of proof in civil hearings is 'on the balance of probability', rather than 'beyond reasonable doubt'.

On the balance of probability your car was damaged in their car park, but that's not beyond reasonable doubt because there are no known witnesses.

It may not come to court, I think there's every chance that when the garage realises you are serious, you will hear from their insurers.

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Thu 21 Jul 2011 12:44
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - Chipmonk0606

Thanks very much for your comments and how to present myself at the hearing if it comes to that.

I have never been in court before and would not know how to act or say lol

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Thu 21 Jul 2011 15:08
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - concrete

Hello Chipmonk, sorry for your troubles. Unfortunately just another thread in the tapestry of life. It will cause you some work and bit of concern but that is what you need to do to get redress from the ' nothing to with me brigade' who will not own up to anything.

You are correct in stating that the MOT should have noted any bodywork damage. A couple of years ago both my nearside doors were dented (her indoors in Sainsburys car park). The MOT noted the damage with a brief description. I looked for the certificate to forward to you, but cannot find it. Suggest you visit another MOT centre and ask if they would normally record the damage and how.

If positive get another MOT done and produce the certificate as evidence. Ifithelps has given you great advice too. The balance of probabilties is important. If the damage is not on the MOT then the car must have been damaged AFTER the test. That means they drove your car into the test bay and PARKED it AFTERWARDS. Because they have done this they cannot hide behind the 'owners risk' clause. They have a duty of care to park your vehicle where it is not likely to be damaged.

Also there must have been some noise involved in the collision and similar damage to another vehicle or maybe a bollard (as per my missus) or wall. Go and examine the site and take photographs.

The advice about court behaviour is vital. Wear a suit and tie, best manners and stay calm at all costs and try to look relaxed but alert. Put your case in 'bullet point facts' and do not embellish or exagerate. The judges are friendly and fair and will listen to the arguments from both sides. If there is anything about the other sides evidence you disagree with do not interupt, note it down and wait until they are finished. Then politely ask the judge to clarify your concerns, he may then cross examine on your behalf or invite you to, so be prepared.

Practice at home, with someone playing 'devils advocate'. You will get the courts respect by being seen to be reasonable and fair and this and it will lend weight to your case that you are genuinely agrieved by the events and feel that resitution should be made by them. You do not have to prove they damaged your vehicle, merely that it is the most likely explanation, and it was done while in their care, after the MOT and during or after they parked it.

Really good luck with this. Let us know how you get on. Cheers Concrete

Edited by Avant on 21/07/2011 at 19:28

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Thu 21 Jul 2011 15:39
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - jamie745

The "vehicles parked here at owners risk" sign does absolve them of immediate liability for if you park your car in there and come back to find it damaged/nicked etc, meaning you're expected to use your own insurance to get the problem sorted. However, by the sounds of it, the owner didnt park it there, someone from the garage did, so if they're claiming thats where it got damaged, then they put the car there. If the car park had CCTV this could be cleared up very easily, as in did another customer bash into it on their way out or something? Or even worse still, did the mot tester or whoever parked it scrape it when moving it? Going by the description of the damage i wouldnt be surprised if he reversed it out of the MOT bay at an angle and scraped the side on the wall in the process as most MOT centres have quite a narrow entrance to the MOT bay.

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Thu 21 Jul 2011 19:10
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - Collos25

If you cannot give correct advice I suggest you keep quiet,the at owners risk sign does not absolve the garage if the car was on their premises for a prebooked work.

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Thu 21 Jul 2011 21:31
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - Chipmonk0606

Thanks for all your comments so far, the advise about the behaviour in court is very constructive. Although I think the key is prove that my car was fine before it went into the garage.

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Fri 22 Jul 2011 11:49
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - ifithelps

...the advise about the behaviour in court is very constructive...

The judge won't expect you to have in-depth knowledge of court etiquette, but here's a couple of extra points.

The correct form of address for him is 'sir',

If it's a her, then I prefer 'ma'm' to 'madam', because the latter has come to have two meanings.

You may find the court is more like an office, but if it's a traditional court, stand up when speaking, and stand up when spoken to, particularly by the judge.

If possible, take three copies of the documents you are relying on - one to hand to the judge, one to hand to the enemy, and one for you to refer to.

As you say, the key to the case is to prove - but only on the balance of probabilities - your car was fine when you left it.

Predicting the outcome of a court case is notoriously difficult, but if the court finds the car was undamaged when the garage took it, a ruling in your favour should follow.

You certainly have a runnable - and winnable - case.

But go into this prepared for both outcomes.

If you follow Kipling's advice to treat triumph and disaster just the same, you will leave the court with your head held high, whatever happens.

Edited by ifithelps on 22/07/2011 at 11:53

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Fri 22 Jul 2011 12:07
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - concrete

Chipmonk, hopefully your MOT with no recorded bodywork damage will do this for you. Also, as suggested another MOT that does record the damage as a matter of course, from an independent MOT tester. I suppose some signed statements from anyone who saw the car prior to the incident might help, but if they are relatives it carries much less weight, but neighbours might be helpful. I would ask the garage where the work was done if they have a cctv system, when you go and examine the area for signs of damage that could match up with your car damage. Take a camera. Like ifithelps, I think your case is quite strong and if you argue it properly you could get a result. That is the key here, cool facts delivered clearly and calmly so the court can decide. Best of luck. Concrete

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Fri 22 Jul 2011 23:40
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - Chipmonk0606

Contacted Halford Autocentres (used to be Nationwide Autocentre) and asked if they normally record the condition of the body work prior to MOT testing and they said they do.

Asked the same question to two other branches of the well known garage services and had a mixed response in that sometimes they do, and sometimes they don't.

But will get the MOT testing done again at Halfords.

However I have managed to find a witness who saw my car about 15 mins before I dropped it off to the garage. Meaning I can prove my car was not damaged before it went to the garage.

Did a search on google and found a number of cases whereby vehicles have been damaged whilst at the well known garage chain (although not the same branch).

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Fri 22 Jul 2011 23:46
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - Chipmonk0606

When I dropped the car off to the garage, I parked it in the customer car park and then handed the keys over to them.

When I went to collect the car, it was parked in a lower level within the garage building where there was limited lighting. Furthermore the was parked with the damaged side facing the wall. My guess is that they parked it like that in hoping that I would not see the damage.

Once again thanks everyone for the comments and in particular Ifithelps and concrete. The both of you sound very knowledgeable! Would buy you both a pint if I could :)

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Mon 25 Jul 2011 17:31
Audi A4 Avant - Damaged to car caused by garage services - concrete

Thanks for the comments. This forum is usually full of good comment and from people who have been in similar situations. Also when we do get another legal beagle the comments can be verified. I and many others would not post unless offering something constructive, even if it is just sympathy. However, it sounds like you are building some good evidence for your case, hopefully enough for the other side to show the white flag. Let us know of any developments. I have had several pints this weekend and enjoyed them all, I will enjoy several more if you get a result. Cheers Concrete

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