Judging by the tone of these posts no one else has had their (expensive) car damaged by a cyclist then?
Not me, never once in 20 years of driving. And that includes working as a delivery driver in London. Maybe I'm just lucky, or live in a nice part of the UK that is free from evil cyclists.
But then I do try my best not to go driving into them.
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Judging by the tone of these posts no one else has had their (expensive) car damaged by a cyclist then?
www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=325401
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I did back in '98 - his fault - big egg sized dint in the bonnet and a smashed windscreen. Happily he suffered only minor injuries. I was cleared in the subsequent inquiry !
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When we lived in Tenerife we'd cycle everywhere.
I did clout a few cars but - I always said mucho sorry senor, its the cyclists attitude towards Paul that was wrong and could easily have led to drawn swords (or worse!)
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horrible image Macavity. Glad I can't get up to 155mph on my Coyote lightweight MTB!
Edited by Mick Snutz on 13/01/2010 at 14:07
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Given that my car has had more damage done by supermarket trolleys that by cyclists should they have to have registration numbers and insurance?
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ruddy awful - very sobering indeed
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Judging by the tone of these posts no one else has had their (expensive) car damaged by a cyclist then?
Nope. I'm usually on the road, and they're usually on the pavement!
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Judging by the tone of these posts no one else has had their (expensive) car damaged by a cyclist then?
I collected a cyclist on the bonnet of my company Astra Belmont in '88 or thereabouts. He was crossing a Pelican against the red, head down, going at some speed. I checked for pedestrians moving at pedestrian speed and set off without noticing the 2-wheeled blur. I collected the cyclist on the bonnet and ran over his bicycle, braked hard and deposited him on the remains. Cracked the number plate and the cyclist bent the wiper trying to hang on. Rightly or wrongly I gave him a fiver towards his getting home costs.
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He was crossing a Pelican against the red
Cycling across a Pelican crossing is not allowed. So if he got hurt you'd have not been liable. Or so I am led to believe.
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Cyclists... Well, there is always going to be one who acts like Joseph Spah isn't there?
I saw a good example recently on the A240 approaching Tolworth northbound.
For about ½ a mile just below Tolworth, there is a segregated cycle path about ten feet wide seapated from the 40mph dual carriageway by a ten feet wide grassy verge; it is well signposted and the start of the lane is as clear as a very clear thing on a clear day.
And where do we find Mr Cyclist?
Yes - in the middle of the inside lane of the dual carriageway, effectively taking up the space of a car, totally oblivious to the ¼ mile long queue building up behind him...
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Muggy,
Segregated cycle paths are a mixed blessing. If well designed and properly surfaced they're great, unfortunately very few are.
There's one alongside the unclassified county road linking two local villages. Its quite wide (except when it's blocked by the regularly bent crash barrier. But its surfaced with a mix of loose grit and broken glass with occasional mounds of dog poo. OK on a mountain bike and passable with care on my Brompton. Unuseable on my fast sports/tourer.
In more urban settings they're all to often inadequately marked or prioritised. There's a famous picture somewhere, admittedly distorted by a telephoto lens, with about a dozen cyclists dismount signs, each marking a junction or dirveway.
Few of any sort have been gritted in the recent bad weather and don't get me started on those shared with peds and dog walkers.
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Segregated cycle paths are a mixed blessing ...
For those of you who regularly interface with cyclists I recommend reading "Cyclecraft" by John Franklin. It may give those of you who are interested in making safe progress among your fellow travellers a perspective on why cyclists do some of what they do. This book is the basis for the Bikeability* training courses which are being taught to the next generation of cyclists. Things are changing out there; educate yourselves.
*Bikeability replaces Cycling Proficiency.
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I suspect the cyclist complained of had read cyclecraft. As described he's in a good primary position.
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At least this country was far-sighted enough to stop pedal cycles getting onto a Motorway !
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>> He was crossing a Pelican against the red Cycling across a Pelican crossing is not allowed. So if he got hurt you'd have not been liable. Or so I am led to believe.
My understanding is that if you cycle on a pedestrian crossing, then you are classed as road traffic and should obey the same rules as cars.
If you get off and walk then you are classed as a pedestrian and enjoy the rights of way over traffic.
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"but you have to admit that his threads are popular"
No they're not. They are repetitive and too many of you rise to the bait. Which he wants. The next time he posts, don't bother to answer. He then might drift away in a puff of SMOKE.
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A very narrow minded view spood, if I may so so.
Others may not agree with you, have you considered that?
Pat
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Thank you Pat. I think there's more than just Spood should read your post. As a moderator, I find it easier to skim the many messages with substantive content for undesirable content than than those which are having a pop at another member.
IMO, on this site, it really is the moderators job to decide when a contributor is overstepping a boundary, and not for all the part time wannabee mods to chime in and take threads off course by doing so - there is a Report button which can be used for this purpose.
Behind the scenes, we have been watching and discussing Paul2007s handicraft for some days, along with others which require our regular attention - as we always do. If and when we decide that something should be done, then it will. So please would people refrain from trolling Paul2007. And Paul2007, this doesn't mean it's open season for you.
btw I've come across two new terms. Concern troll and sockpuppet. Check Wikipedia if you don't know what they mean. We have some of them here too - you know who you are - so do we ;-)
Edited by smokie on 14/01/2010 at 13:25
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So if he got hurt you'd have not been liable. Or so I am led to believe.
Liability didn't come into it. A fellow human had been shaken up; I could leave the scene easily, not so easy for him.
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Hawkeye I was not suggesting anyone leave the scene just that the police wouldn't (or at least shouldn't) be after the driver in this circumstance.
Edited by rtj70 on 13/01/2010 at 18:50
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............ I gave him a fiver towards his getting home costs.
For the likely logic in this, read Hawkeye's profile.
Edited by L'escargot on 14/01/2010 at 07:56
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For the likely logic in this read Hawkeye's profile.
Because he owns a caravan? :-)
What do you see as the logic? I want to know what I'm missing.
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Because the profile reads like that of a decent guy.... which he is.
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Because the profile reads like that of a decent guy.... which he is.
Thanks - yes, that's the impression I got. Just thought L'esc was hinting at something more subtle.
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Just thought L'esc was hinting at something more subtle.
No. It was my fault for being so vague.
Edited by L'escargot on 14/01/2010 at 09:03
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No. It was my fault for being so vague.
No problem. Actually another decent guy gave me £10 IIRC after knocking me off my bike some years ago, although I hadn't been doing anything unlawful at the time so he got off pretty lightly considering I had to replace the bike. (I was young free and relatively well off back then so wasn't that bothered.)
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considering I had to replace the bike
Probably not true - more like an excuse for a new one :-)
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Because the profile reads like that of a decent guy.... which he is.
Oh, I thought it was because he was a Yorkshireman, anybody else would have given the cyclist a tenner...
;)
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anybody else would have given the cyclist a tenner... ;)
Hell's teeth; it were int' 1980s when a fiver were worth summat. A tenner were a month's shopping back then. [Feeds into cardboard box sketch ...]
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Hi
As i cycled home tonight i came upon 2 lines of stationary traffic on the approach to a traffic light controlled junction where i wanted to turn right.
I saw the lights ahead change from from green to red so knew the traffic was going to be stopped long enough for me to safely filter between the cars and get to the cyclists advance stop line at the junction.
As i got close to the junction I noticed that a silver VW Polo was stopped inside the ASL, so I positioned myself behind his nearside rear and waited for the lights to change.
The driver of the car behind (a middle aged guy wearing a yellow hi-viz jacket in a metalic blue Saab ) apparently had a problem with this and beeped. I looked over my shoulder, he mouthed something that looked aggressive, I shrugged to say I had no idea what he was saying and continued to wait for the lights to change.
When traffic lights changed and the right filter light came on I turned right and cycled on my way. I could hear the Saab revving aggressively as it turned behind me. After about 30 metres he pulled alongside me, as i was level with his rear door he indicated and immediately turned sharply into a side road on the left. I only avoided a collision by slamming on my brakes and swerving to my left.
Now, I count that as an attempted assault with a deadly weapon, the guy knew exactly where I was and deliberately tried to run me off the road with his car when I had cycled 100% legally and in accordance with the highway code. If I hadn't taken evasive action he would have hit me, and it was only luck that I didn't hit any ice as he forced me into the gutter.
I was unable to to get the number of the driver who attempted to assault me with his car, as I was too busy saving my life. As compulsory number plates, licenses and tests are obviously not enough, is it not time that these cretins in their cars are forced to carry GPS tracking and register every journey they make so people like me/you can and stand half a chance of getting these people locked up.
Rant over!
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Smallfish,
I'm afraid this happens now and then, the mouthing, aggression and revving/beeping are usually a good clue.
You did all the right things as well. Much better to wait behind the front most car and track it through the junction than go right to the front & be blamed for "holding up the cars".
Edited by Bromptonaut on 14/01/2010 at 21:46
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I fear you have missed the irony of SF's post! (Hint: compare it with the OP.)
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> I saw the lights ahead change from from green to red so knew the trafficwas going to be stopped long enough for me to safely filter between the cars and get to the cyclists advance stop line at the junction.
As a car driver, motorcyclist, and admittedly rarely pedalcyclist, I can not understand why so many cyclists feel the need to 'filter' through stationary vehicles, often banging mirrors, scratching paintwork etc, just to get to the head of the traffic, knowing that they will be immediately overtaken by the faster vehicles?
surely the act of being overtaken on a pedal bike is risky business? I know its one that when I am on a bike, I try to keep to a minimum.
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Many drivers, at the end of the day, are jealous that cyclists can work their way through a queue and this annoys them to the extent they take it out on the cyclist. Its just simple old-style bullying, big boy against wee boy.
If you are a cyclist and stay at the end of the queue, chances are the light will change to red before you get to it, and then you have the scenario you describe anyway.
As a keen cyclist, I always work my way to the front (where possible) especially when there is the bike markings at the traffic lights. It is amazing however how many motorists make a point of moving over towards the kerb to block the cyclists route.
On my route to work there are various traffic lights and big pavements and few pedestrians. Where possible, at the lights, I cross on the pavement because as a car driver, the last thing I want is a bike holding me up when the lights turn green. Its not always possible though.
In fact on my chosen route, for the last 5 miles into Glasgow, I travel faster on the bike than in the car. It could be argued why do cars overtake my bike as they know I will always catch up with them!!
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On my route to work there are various traffic lights and big pavements and few pedestrians. Where possible at the lights I cross on the pavement because as a car driver the last thing I want is a bike holding me up when the lights turn green. Its not always possible though.
Right, so presumably we now have lane discipline on pavements and pedestrians are so predictable in their movements that you pose absolutely no risk to them whatsoever.
So now, as a pedestrian that was hit by a 40 something year old cyclist whilst on a pavement (again, NO cycle track in the vicinity), am I supposed to take comfort that whilst I'm STILL in pain after SIX months, at least some cars - presumably with brakes, mirrors and competent drivers - didn't get held up?
Thank you so much for sharing your logic there, I feel so much better now and will sleep far more easily tonight; having read your posting, safe in the knowledge that my sleepless nights and pain have been worth it to shave a few seconds off the journeys of some commuters.
* One thing - If I've mis-interpreted your posting, please accept my apologies if you actually walk and push your bike along the pavement. I'm assuming you ride along the pavement though upon the basis of your drawing attention to there being "big pavements and few pedestrians".
Edited by schneip on 15/01/2010 at 01:34
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schneip, the junctions I am referring to, on London Road in Glasgow, at 7am in the morning, there are no pedestrians.
I do have sympathy for your pain though, cycling along this road at 6pm one night I got knocked off my bike by a pedestrian walking across the road who did not look. I suffered a cracked rib, was in pain for 3 months, lost the skin from my shin to my kneecap.
The pedestrian had no number plate, no tax, no insurance and so, like you I just need to accept that sometimes accidents do happen. Majority of accidents can be avoided but sometimes they just happen.
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The pedestrian had no number plate no tax no insurance and so like you I just need to accept that sometimes accidents do happen. Majority of accidents can be avoided but sometimes they just happen.
You're right, it's extremely irritating (re. pain caused by someone else's ineptitude), and please excuse me if my last posting seemed a rant. My right elbow is still burning and making clicking sounds all of the time and using a computer mouse doesn't help.
There's been a lot of talk in this thread though about pedestrians not having number plates, tax or insurance. Maybe one day we'll all end up taking out personal insurance to cover liabilities (aren't things heading that way/already that way in America)?
But re. number plates, I think cyclists should have them because:
a) If a cyclists hits a pedestrian, the cyclist is more likely than the pedestrian to make a quick get away (assuming he can still ride), and not give his details.
b) I'd tentatively suggest a) also applies if the cyclist hits a car where there is congestion or other property. This thread began with a posting where this had appeared to happen.
c) It can't be rocket science to find somewhere to fit a number plate. Surely a simple bracket could be used to secure a plate to part of the frame, towards the real wheel - or maybe from the metal bar attached to the base of the saddle? For years cyclists have been able to fix lights!
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Driving north out of London today. Finchley road to Hendon way. Lights turned red, me and other lane stopped to let vehicles out of road to the left (Burgess hill?) at the petrol station. Lights turned green for Hendon way, but stayed red for straight on. We were blocked by white-van-man wanting to go along Finchley road. Much horn tooting. White-van-man, sideways on, in front of me started giving face-contorted verbals. I was grinning at the incongruity of it all, as after all I'd given way to him and held my hands up to say 'It's not me' as the tooting continued. Give him his due, he wound his window down and loudly apologised.
Sometimes situations can be mis-interpretated.
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I've no axe to grind one way or the other here, as long as cyclists keep to their side of the bargain and drive within the rules of the HC I'll do the same... after all I'd hate to have the guilt of knocking one over...
But...
From what I've read on here from several cyclists they seem to want it both ways... its wrong for us motorists to block them or even get annoyed with them, but its ok for them to break the law at will, such as riding on pavements and putting pedestrians at risk...
You can't have it both ways, Mr Cyclist, if you have a go at us motorists for our misdemeanours then you must also be able to be held liable for your misdemeanours... and at the moment the reason so many of you get away with it is that its virtually impossible for anyone to positively identify you...
If you continue to behave in such an arrogant manner, then I'm afraid you will bring compulsary registration and insurance on yourselves...
Think about it next time you are cutting through the pedestrians on the pavement or crossing to save yourselves those valuable seconds, eh!
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b308, I am a motorist and a cyclist.
Every day I drive I see constant traffic violations.
It could be not signalling, going through on amber, blocking a hatched area, use of mobile phone, not wearing seatbelt, speeding, tailgating, lane hogging. I saw at least one of each of these today on the M8.
Everyone of them were in vehicles with registration plates, not one of them were stopped by police for the offences.
Its not just cyclists that break rules, all types of motorists do as shown above. Some drivers will never do any of the above, same as some cyclists will be squeaky clean. Some motorists will be caught and I know of cyclists that have been stopped as well.
Its a fact of life but as I have said before, the motorist sitting in the queue is annoyed at the cyclist, not because he might hurt a pedestrian, but because he is getting ahead in the queue from him. Its just another type of road rage.
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I have never denied that, BG, but my point is that if cyclists carry on like they are then some sort of regulation will become inevitable, is that what you want?
BTW I'm not a cyclist, and as a motorist try to respect other road users, but I am a very regular pedestrian, and it seems over the past few years its becoming increasingly common to be nearly run down by a cylist (including the postie one morning!), the HC is quite clear on that matter, unless a cycleway is marked on the pavement you aren't allowed on it unless you are walking and pushing it.
All I see are excuses, and no admission that you too are in the wrong...
Do two wrongs make a right?
No!
You and your fellow cyclists need to get your act together or the likes of Paul will get their way and you will become as regulated as the motorist!
Edited by b308 on 15/01/2010 at 11:02
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b308, definitely don't want that!
Maybe I should make my view a wee bit clearer, when I say I jump onto the pavement I am meaning a deserted pavement at 7am in the morning.
I totally disagree with those cyclists that do this in town centres during the day, you know the type I mean. From a cyclists point of view, it really annoys me to see that as I know we will all be branded the same!
I admit that I am technically in the wrong when I jump onto the pavement, but it is the same decision making process that I use when I choose to exceed 30mph , 70mph limits (in my car I hasten to add). Sometimes you make the judgement call that it will be OK, others you wouldn't dare.
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I totally disagree with those cyclists that do this in town centres during the day you know the type I mean. From a cyclists point of view it really annoys me to see that as I know we will all be branded the same!
Fair enough! :)
Just for the record I too don't want to see cyclists regulated (re tax for instance) either, all it will do is provide "jobs for the boys" which the rest of us will pay for, but I can see it coming, just hope I'm wrong... and it would be a nightmare to police, they can't even police the motorist properly so I can't see how it would work for cyclists!
Edited by b308 on 15/01/2010 at 12:10
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