I forgot to put the pass in my window last night when i parked up been greeted this morning by a £120 "Civil Penalty charge notice" what does this mean? i'm fine so long as i ignore all coraspondense or i have to pay up? Never mind i've been parking on the estate for the last 2 months in this car everytight with a pass....
Bopttom line says" You are therefore required to pay a civil penalty of £120 within 28 days. The charge will be reduced to £75 if paid within 48 hours or £100 if paid within 14 days"
Many thanks
Edited by rtj70 on 04/06/2009 at 12:32
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Is it a private estate/roads or Council run scheme?
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Pizza man, in a strange sort of way I hope for your sake it is enforceable. I assume you like other residents will have had to pay for your pass. Makes a mockery of it if it turned out that you could park there with no pass and not be prosecuted?
Having said that, no way that you can appeal and show the pass asuming it is a long term pass? Slipped off the dashboard and out of sight?
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passes were free, it's a self finacning scheme.....
It's a private residential estate that noone wants to live in due to the hitler like parking company, my dad got done last year when he parked in my space in his learner car which has the family name emblazoned all over it for 5 mins.
Like the DVLA wit the failiure to display a disc they couldn't give a stuff if it fell off the dash, none of us wanted what they do, we wanted a company that would respond to phone calls if someone parkjed in your space unauthorised and towed them away, if someone is in your space they get either ticketed or clamped really -ing helpful as you still have nowhere to park and can't park on the estate as you pass only allows you in your space not a visitors one.....
and thats one of the things that gets my goat there's several visitors spaces you can use......if you have a visitors pass. useless, our estate is like a ghost town cause people don't want to visit in case they get clamped!! and you can only have one visitor pass per house, which means i'm generally the visitor and if anyone comes over they have to park off the estate.
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 04/06/2009 at 11:27
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I'm still not quite following this... from what you have said its on a private estate, so the roads are not "adopted" by the council... on that basis, as residents/property owner you should have some say on how the parking is "policed" and be able to change the way they do things?
Their contract must be with someone, sounds like you need to get yourself and your fellow residents more involved with the running of the estate and get things changed...
I think many of us would like to live on a road where parking is stricly controlled so you don't have people parking and commuting, parking on pavements or blocking your drive, etc!
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If the residents have no say and it's a private estate, it sounds like there is a company operating according to their own rules. It also sounds like the residents originally setup this arrangement.
... about time someone amended the rules.
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Ask them for photographic proof that you wern't displaying your permit. If they haven't got it tell them what to do.
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Speak to your local Authority to confirm whether or not there is a statutory residents parking/No waiting Order in force for the area.
The fact that your ticket says Penalty Charge Notice as opposed to Parking Charge Notice tends to indicate me that it is other than a Private operation and consequently will have to be paid unless you have grounds for challenging which does not appear from the post. Permit has to be displated - it wasn't. QED.
dvd
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Dear Sirs
Thank you for your penalty charge notice. I enclose a photocopy of my residents parking permit for your information, and accordingly appeal the penalty charge on the basis of it not having been correctly applied.
I look forward to hearing from you that you have lifted the charge.
Yours faithfully
Pizza man.
Presuming this to be a first offence, 10:1 you'll get off. No lies in the above letter. Just vague enough...
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It's a civil penalty, not a fine, therefore ignore it and it'll go away. like the supermarket/retail park ones, they can only claim for damages caused by you parking there, and since there's no loss incurred by other residents since you live there too but just didn't display a pass, they'd have no chance to take you to court for non payment.
These charges are ridiculous, and the more people who just ignore them, the more likely these bandit companies are to just disappear since they'll have no revenue.
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Not sure if its as clear cut as that, S. If its a private estate and the residents don't want everyone else parking on there then they are doing a useful job... but they do need to be controlled and ground rules introduced so everyone knows where they stand... in this case it seems that isn't the case.
These private companies can be too overzelous, but if you look at some of the ways people park are you surprised?! Personally I'm all for proper policing of parking... but both sides need to know that there is some give and take.
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As Shawad said above and as according to Pepipoo, which has lots of advice on this issue, a private company cannot fine you or charge penalties in this way. They're operating a racket: they write scary letters using lots of vaguely threatening legalese in the hope that most people will pay up.
You are not obliged to pay. There is a tiny chance that they would try and take you to court, but this would prove costly and time-consuming for them (they have to prove you were parking "illegally", that you weren't displaying the permit, that they actually do own the land / have the rights etc). In practice, these companies don't go to court because they can't win.
Councils, however, CAN fine & charge penalties.
Edited by craig-pd130 on 05/06/2009 at 14:50
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>>>>Councils, however, CAN fine & charge penalties.<<<<
..which is why you should check with your local council re any residents/no waiting order.
It is an offence to copy a PCN......the official ones are headed Penalty Charge Notice.
Private firms try to copy and so that they do not infringe call them Parking Charge Notice and make them look official...
dvd
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The estate is a housing associaton one and the housing association setup there aggreement with the parking company after we said we would like some form of policing and then as i said above they got in someone who clamps and fines instead of actually keeping the spaces clear of unwanted cars, whats the use of your space if someone elses car is clamped in it and can't be moved? you still need to park somewhere else and as i said we have visitor bays (about 30 odd of them) but you need a pass to park in a visitors bay (that really makes sense doesn't it?) BUT you cannot park your own car with the normal residents pass in a visitors bay (each residents pass is uniquely numbered, not that the clampers seem to have a list of what car has what pass...They could just give passes that are numbered to the parking space you own(each residents space comes with the property)), so there loads of the empty almost the entire time except on saturday nights when people have friends over and there's still usually a few free.
This is defineatly not a council ticket issued by a police officer/traffic warden/PSCO, it's a private company named after a group of fish that operate in the south hampshire region from what i can tell, they had a coupleof agreements in park gate where i deliver pizza but the residents there seem to be getting shot of them for a different company.
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If you are sure LA not involved by any Order then read this
www.tinyurl.com/2hr37d
dvd
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The estate is a housing associaton one and the housing association setup there aggreement with the parking company after we said we would like some form of policing and then as i said above they got in someone who clamps and fines instead of actually keeping the spaces clear of unwanted cars whats the use of your space if someone elses car is clamped in it and can't be moved?
Then there is your answer to your problem... You as residents have asked for the policing, if you don't like what they are doing get hold of your local Housing Association rep and have a few polite words.
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