Turns out its not the sump - on inspection on a ramp, it became clear its the main seal between engine and gearbox, so a gearbox out job to replace.
.*******
Any ideas what would cause this as aside from a manufacturing issue, I cant see why it would happen.
It is now loosing a 1/3 of its oil every 5 miles, more so as it warms up, which will make the 8 mile drive to the garage on monday, er, interesting and rather smokey!
Is there any safety aspect to the oil going onto the hot exhaust?
Im going to pressure wash the underside of the car sunday to get rid of whats already there and reduce the smoke as much as possible but Im worried it will get catastrophic before I arrive so should I worry or just not look at the smoke as I driving along?
It doesnt block vision behind me, its sort of like a blue haze.
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If it's losing that much I don't think I'd drive it. Get a mate to give you a tow or better still get it trailered. You've not had it long , have you? Any warranty?
Edited by nick on 06/11/2008 at 12:08
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Well ive worked out that if I fill it up to 3/4 up the dipstick, it will be at the minimum mark by the time I get to the garage. My dad will follow me in his car with a tow rope incase it gets beyond reason.
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How much of that oil is making it to the road? Motorbicyclists might not thank you for making their lives more dangerous.
Also, if the leak gets much worse suddenly, then you may well cause engine damage that won't be covered by warranty.
Given your circumstances, I'd be demanding the garage come and pick it up, or get it taken in by the AA / generic recovery service.
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Most of the oil is running down the underside of the car esp at speed and it is 60 all the way. Going slow seems to drop the most oil.
Unfortunatly, I couldnt get the garage to collect it until two weeks time which is way longer than we can wait.
My mech said its about as bad as it will get and he reckoned it would make it to the main dealer, albeit smoking abit.
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I came off a bike once on a corner due to oil the road. lucky though, just a badly bruised right hip area.
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If your dad has a towrope, and is going with you to the garage, get him to tow you.
As mentioned, your proposed action is very antisocial - and jolly unpleasant for anybody else who might be following.
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Well ive worked out that if I fill it up to 3/4 up the dipstick it will be at the minimum mark by the time I get to the garage.
If you mean way past the full mark then DO NOT do that.
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Before you drive to the garage, could you please tell us which route you will take.
As a motor-cyclist I would be keen to avoid the area !
Ted
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Other road users at risk, esp. 2 wheeler users. And your own tyres. They don't last too long after being in a slick of oil.
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Dont worry, I bought a rigid towing bar this afternoon and my dad will be towing me there.
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My dad will follow me in his car with a tow rope incase it gets beyond reason.
Buy a Clarke tow bar TB2S as in:
www.toolsbypost.com/product.php?id=4201
Less than £25 and it will solve all your towing issues. Forget abot tow ropes. The towing driver does everything, all the towed driver does is steer (keep behind the towing vehicle).
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Think of others and get it trailered. Dumping loads of oil all over the road is anti social. If oil does fall on a very hot exhaust then there is a risk of fire.
Haven't you got breakdown cover? That should get the car towed to the garage. Just drive a long enough distance from your house and say smoke starting billowing out. They'll probably see the large leak and tell you to get it recovered anyway!
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Is there any safety aspect to the oil going onto the hot exhaust?
There can be stu. In Spain I was driving a friend's old 2 litre Ford Scorpio which was guzzling oil (partly at least, I am sure, because she was very careless and forgetful about checking the level and had undoubtedly allowed the low oil pressure warning light to come on a couple of times). Anyway, pulled into a garage, bought some oil and started pouring it in rather impatiently. It spluttered and bubbled going into the cambox and a good big dollop ran down onto the exhaust manifold, where to my surprise and alarm it burst into flames. However I managed to blow it out like the candles on a birthday cake before it burned through any insulation on wires or set light to anything else.
I had already graunched the car against a bollard in a Seville back street, and been forgiven. If I had burned it out in a garage forecourt, the second forgiveness might have taken a bit longer...
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Im going to pressure wash the underside of the car sunday to get rid of whats already there and reduce the smoke as much as possible ...
I'd leave the pressure washer until after the repair. If oil is coming out, it's not impossible for water under pressure to find it's way in. I'm not suggesting you would spray directly onto the damaged area but with a pressure washer, water is spraying all over the place.
Use a hose pipe instead of pressure to avoid damaging underseal, rubber grommits etc...
Is it possible to move the car on Sunday afternoon/evening to the garage when the roads are quieter ?
Edited by gmac on 06/11/2008 at 18:19
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It being towed, already said that now some while, anti-social bandwagon has left the town - unlike many older folk, im young, listen to advice, changed my approach to be more considerate - the oil barely drips when the engine isnt running so its no worse than many cars ( infact barely a thimble full has leaked out since I stuck a tray underneath it ).
Good point about the pressure washing - it made sense to me from a smoke reduction point of view, but if its gonna be towed, it wont smoke anyway and im sure the garage will clean it up.
Unfortuantly not possible to move the car Sunday - I did think about that but the garage is a family run jobbie that is closed Sundays - its an 8:15 start unfortunatly on Monday - atleast the roads we will be going on arent busy even in rush hour and there are plenty of long stretches to overtake, plus place to pull in if needs be.
My misses car isnt supposed to be towed at over 30 mph being an auto - should I put an additional sign aside from the 'On Tow' sign to say max 30 mph - Im sure most people understand the limitations of towng but may want to know what to expect so they can decide to take overtaking opportunities?
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"main seal between engine and gearbox, so a gearbox out job to replace"
What a pain, thought Kias were better built than this, I wonder if an engine mounting has failed causing this? Hope you get it sorted !
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Thanks chap, im furious about it to be honest - there are many things I would expect to go wrong with a car, but this is not one of them on a 4 year old far eastern product - its a part that often lasts the life of the car. I will certainly be asking many questions about why it has failed.
I can only suggest that it is perhaps an upcoming issue on 54 plate Picanto autos if indeed there is a design fault or production issue with some cars - there arent many around anyway as early as ours. Who knows. Will know more on Monday hopefully.
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Good luck tomorrow. Fellow Picanto owners anxiously await the verdict.
{- its leaking so bad now in 10 miles it managed to use enough oil to leave the dipstick dry - I just stuck 2L of oil in it and that only just got it up to the mark.}
i.e. two thirds of the total engine oil capacity including filter. Some leak!
Are you sure it has got its ATF fluid up to the mark, at least? I guess the torque converter will take some strain as you tow (I wouldn't, but you have clearly made up your mind). At least you have a towing hook that looks as if it was designed for a Chieftain tank.
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ATF is fine, its only engine oil thank goodness. The manual says that it can be towed for 50 miles so Im fairly sure the 8 miles to the dealer wont be a problem.
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Well, got the car back. Verdict was a failed rear main oil seal ( their term not mine ).
While they had the gearbox off they noted that the driveshaft on that side was in poor shape and replaced it free of charge ( on account of they having sold us the car and it being one of theirs from new ).
We were quoted originally £309 to do the seal but in the end, the bill was only £269 which we were very pleased about.
Reason for failure would appear, as far as they could tell, a sub-standard seal.
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Good result Stu.
Happy Motoring Phil I
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Have I missed something, I thought that Kias all had a 5 yr warranty, or is this a new innovation implemented since 2004?
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In 2004 the warranty was 3 yrs Manuf, only recently have the longer warranties been implemented. As I understand it, the Ceed has a 7 yr warranty, not sure about the others in the range.
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I would make sure all the crankcase breather hoses are in good shape and not blocked (including the PCV valve). A blocked breather can cause the crankcase to pressurise which could blow a crankshaft seal.
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Reason for failure would appear, as far as they could tell, a sub-standard seal.
As the car seems to have been serviced and supplied by the same dealer, request them to ask KIA for a goodwill payment.
Motto: You don't get if you don't ask.
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It doesnt help that the dealer no longer sells Kia so I see little incentive for them to and they have already been very helpful.
On the plus side, we got a decent discount on the labour, plus a goodwill repair of a component that we would never have known was on its way out - if you deduct the labour discount, plus the cost of driveshaft replacement, it was a cheap repair overall.
Honestly, I just cant be bothered to persue it - its not a major failure like some poor souls on here have suffered. We have already decided we will replace it in Feb with a Sirion auto which we have been promised a favourable deal on given our troubles. I also hear Februsary is a good time for a deal even in good times. My misses LOVES this car, she wouldnt get out of it at the dealer.
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Thanks for posting the verdict. I can see your point about trying to recover the costs - suspect our Kia dealer would charge rather more!
I think Picantos still have only a three-year warranty. Ours has a mildly irritating high-pitched whistle or whine (throttle-related) when it gets fully warmed up; needless to say the feedback at service is "nothing unusual noticed" (they only drove it round the block). Should I start looking at breather hoses or drive shafts? Otherwise a fine little car (emphasis on "little").
Interesting that your committee now favours a Sirion. We looked at this (and its cousin the Perodua Myvi) and came down for the Picanto for cuteness and insurance costs (and in the case of the Myvi, fit and finish and dealer support). But it was a close-run thing and if choosing again today I would certainly put the Sirion a class above a Fiesta or Corsa.
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Funny you should mention that 'whistling' noise - ours has it too, not at low revs or high, but around the 2-3000 rpm mark which, as an auto, ours spends most of its time, but only when the car is under load. We didnt think much of it and it got alot less noticable after it was serviced prior to delivery, so its been tolerated.
The reason my misses likes the Sirion is several reasons: She is just over 5ft tall and has exceptional trouble finding a car designed for those so short - european cars are useless for this, whereas the far easterns seem to cater more those of diminutive stature.
She tried a Focus auto which she liked but it left her knees just an inch from the underside of the dashboard and in order to see over the steering wheel, she had to have the seat set high, which in turn left her just 3 inches from the windscreen - rather dangerous.
In the Sirion, she had a full three inches between her lower leg and dashboard, plus the steeringwheel is positioned in such a way that she can get comfortable and feel in control without being noticably close to it ( a problem she has in the vast majority of cars Picanto included ).
She was also over 1ft away from the windscreen in the Sirion.
It also has a much bigger and nicer shaped boot than the Picanto, excellent warranty, decent economy even as an auto and in general is very thoughtfully designed. A brand new Sirion auto is just £8995 plus any further haggling so its great value AND its a proper autobox. Even better, the 1.5 auto Sirion is barely any more to run than the 1.3 so you can get quite a perky auto still with supermini running costs.
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