Third party insurance help please - pullgees
I was involved in an accident in the early hours of Sunday morning. There was a wrecked car straddled across the road which had already been in accident. The car's lights were not on. It was a country road with no street lighting. The car was not visible until I was almost on top of it, I managed to hit the brakes and swerve a little but there was no time to avoid and I ploughed into it. I was injured also my passenger and my car is a write off. The driver of the car I hit was arrested for drink driving. I only have third part fire and theft cover plus legal cover. Okay that's the situation.

My insurance company tell me they cannot make a claim off the third party on my behalf because I hit a stationary vehicle and as far as they are concerned it was my fault. Can this be right? Is there any other recourse I can take? Thank you.
Third party insurance help please - FotheringtonThomas
My insurance (..) as far as they are concerned it was my fault. Can this be right?


Yes, of course it was your fault.

Is there any other recourse I can take?


No. I should though, if I were you, consider revising my driving technique.
Third party insurance help please - BobbyG
Pullgees the way you need to look at it is the fact that you were driving at a speed not suitable for the road and the ability to stop safely.
If it was a country road it could have been an escaped cow, a broken down vehicle, a large puddle or whatever, but the fact is you could not stop your vehicle due to the speed you were doing.

Sorry if its harsh but thats the normal rule of the land if you hit a stationary vehicle.
Third party insurance help please - FotheringtonThomas
If it was a country road it could have been an escaped cow a broken
down vehicle a large puddle or


... a sharp bend, someone walking along, someone crossing the road, a victim of a previous colliosion, ...
Third party insurance help please - movilogo
Unfortunately your insurer was right. If you hit a stationary object, it is entirely your fault.
It doesn't matter if the other car was parked

illegally on road.
Third party insurance help please - Peter S
Sorry to hear of your accident; I hope your injuries are not too serious.

Unfortunately, IMO, I think you'll struggle to claim from the third party. No the car should not have been there, but their argument back will be that you should have been driving at a speed appropriate to the visibility... Easy to say I know, and I'm sure most of us have driven in a way that assumes nothing will be round the next corner at some point, but that's a risk we take

I hope it all works out for you

Peter
Third party insurance help please - BobbyG
And you may now find your passenger claiming compensation against you for his injuries?
Third party insurance help please - FotheringtonThomas
That's one of the things that the OP's insurance covers.
Third party insurance help please - MVP
I think the relevant part of the Highway Code is the statement that you must always be able to stop within the distance you can see, which is of course common sense,

126
Stopping Distances. Drive at a speed that will allow you to stop well within the distance you can see to be clear.

e.g if you speed around a bend, but there is a traffic jam the other side, you shouldn't pile into the back of it!


MVP

Edited by MVP on 23/09/2008 at 10:49

Third party insurance help please - Optimist
I tend to agree with all the other posters.

But if the driver of the car you hit had been arrested for drink-driving, I'm surprised there weren't hazard warnings put in place by the police to warn of the obstruction in the road.

Had the car just been left?

Third party insurance help please - FotheringtonThomas
But if the driver of the car you hit had been arrested for drink-drivin


The OP said "was", which is not "had been"!
Third party insurance help please - Optimist
Thank you FT.

I was busy editing my post on that very point when you replied and kiboshed my edit.

I wanted to clarify that and also wanted to ask OP if the car he hit was the only car in the first accident.



Third party insurance help please - FotheringtonThomas
I was busy editing my post on that very point when you replied and kiboshed
my edit.


Sorry, isn't it annoying when that happens! I have had to use "back" and "cut'n'paste" before now!
Third party insurance help please - FP
I feel really, really sorry for the OP here and uncomfortable that some of the postings have been so brusque and ready to condemn.

I'm sure the OP is to blame, but I shudder when I recall the countless number of times I would have been in the same predicament.

"There but for the grace of God..."

Pullgees, my sympathy and best wishes for your, and your passenger's, recovery.

Edited by ChrisPeugeot on 23/09/2008 at 11:47

Third party insurance help please - Mutton Geoff
Brow of hill, approaching a bend, I *always* drive with the view that there is an immovable stationary object just out of view. Sadly many people don't and then wonder why they collide with things. And they call these events "accidents" ;-(

OED - "accident"

1 an unfortunate incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally.
2 an incident that happens by chance or without apparent cause.
3 chance.

www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/accident?

Third party insurance help please - pullgees
It was a straight road on a dual carriageway very dark The car I hit was black sideways on so not even the reflectors showed up. The police fully understood my situation unlike some posters here too ready to pass judgment. Possibly could have avoided it going very slow as it was I was doing 50 mph. The car resembled nothing more than a dark shadow. I was on dipped because of oncoming traffic.
Third party insurance help please - jc2
I knew some one who died in this way-he was driving up a dual carriageway at a legal speed and an artic had slewed across the carriageway because the driver had fallen asleep-his vehicle went under the artic-removing the top of his van and his upper body.
Third party insurance help please - oldnotbold
Were the Police already on scene at the time you hit the car? Give us an approx timeline of events.
Third party insurance help please - rtj70
Unfortunately I think you're going to be unlucky. Even a black car side on should have been visible from a distance.

Think yourself lucky you did not injure anybody in the accident. You have my sympathies.
Third party insurance help please - pullgees
The police had not arrived, it was up to me to dial 999 for police ambulance and fire brigade.
The drunk teen whose car I hit couldn't find his mobile and the driver of the vehicle who he hit (the first accident ), was too dazed with a head injury to do anything. The kid hit this vehicle in the rear with such force that it threw it off the road over an embankment onto a by-road which was running parallel with the dual carriageway. I don't know what the time lapse was between the accidents. There was very little traffic on the road so could have been anything from a few seconds to a few minutes. There were no other cars at the scene before I got there . I had my hazard lights on to avoid any further collisions. I think I did well with a fractured sternum, I could hardly breath at first.
Third party insurance help please - Steve Pearce
I was on dipped because of oncoming traffic.


Which seems strange, because you said the black car was sideways on on a country road. How was the oncoming traffic getting past it?
Third party insurance help please - pullgees
Please read the posts it was a dual carriageway.
Third party insurance help please - Optimist
Was the car your "drunk teen" hit moving or stopped when hit?

Third party insurance help please - Mapmaker
At least your third party insurance will cover you for damage you did to the black car and occupants. I dare say that if you were doing 50mph you turned it from "partly salvable" to "totally useless".
Third party insurance help please - Bill Payer
Many of the answers here seem wide of the mark in my opinion - it's illegal to leave an unlit vehicle on an unlit road with speed limit greater than 30MPH for very good reason. If the vehicle was mashed up such that its reflectors couldn't be seen and was in a dangerous position then it would be all but invisible and my view would be that that vehicles insurers should be liable.

A guy was killed near me not so long ago when he pulled out of a lane onto a B road. He was hit by a van which came around a bend doing 50MPH. At the inquest the Police said the van driver would not have seen the car until he was 35metres away, however no blame could be attached to the van driver as he was driving within the speed limit.

Anyway, regardless of what anyone else thinks, there's absolutely nothing to stop you making a claim. Whether it would be successful or not is another matter. Have you get legal advice cover, perhaps on a home insurance policy?

Edited by Bill Payer on 23/09/2008 at 15:35

Third party insurance help please - Westpig
i know that more facts have become forthcoming later in this thread...but nevertheless I think the poster has been a bit hard done by on here

i couldn't guarantee i wouldn't hit a sideways parked black car on a dark dual carriageway at night on dipped beams, with other debris/cars in the carriageways i.e. limited options to swerve..

i can't see how the other driver's insurance can't be liable as the definition of an accident is 'if owing to the presence of a motor vehicle on a road...etc'

i'd suggest trying again with your own insurer and being more insistent or contacting the other insurer yourself...how about a solicitor?
Third party insurance help please - jbif
... i'd suggest trying again with your own insurer and being more insistent or contacting the other insurer yourself...how about a solicitor?


I agree with Westpig and Bill Payer. see

www.trafficaccidentadvice.co.uk/your-rights-as-a-d...l
"
Was the item marked so that it was visible to an approaching driver?
If the collision occurred at night was the object lit so that approaching driver could see it clearly and give themselves time to avoid it? In the case of skips there should be flashing lights to indicate where the skip starts and ends, and how far away from the road it is.
If the object was not clearly lit or made visible then the owner is responsible. This is usually in the case of parked cars or private skips. If there were roadworks involved, or a hole dug in the road, then whoever is in charge of carrying out the work is responsible and needs to be contacted. You may need to check the item carefully to see if you can figure out who the owners are - a utility company such as gas, electricity or water board, a contractor carrying out work for a private or public company, or perhaps a local authority. Make a note of the owners contact details, or ask around to find out who the obstruction belongs to or is the responsibility of.
Once you have this information, set about taking any photographic evidence that you can to prove your point.
If the object was unlit or in a dangerous position, make sure you take photographs that illustrate this, and try to include something in the photograph that can indicate scale - for example, a CD.
If the object has been left actually on the road in an unsafe position or in a way that contravenes the highway code then the owner of the vehicle or object may be found to be liable for the accident.
If there have been any previous accidents or issues caused by the obstruction, then it is likely that this could count as evidence that the object was the reason that the accident took place, or at least was a contributing factor. "


Third party insurance help please - Optimist
I agree and this is why I've been seeking more info from the OP.

It sounds like a complete mess, with the alleged "drunk teen" entirely responsible for everything that has happened.

Keep going pullgees. Don't give up.

Third party insurance help please - oldnotbold
The OP needs to get a clear report on the event - full diagrams, times, and pictures in daylight of scene, the lot.

Then present a claim, and be prepared to take it to the small claims court (if less than £5,000, I think). His insurance co. will not assist, but he may have legal assistance on his policy, which should be of use.
Third party insurance help please - Optimist
OP said >> I only have third part fire and theft cover plus legal cover. >>

I've never had to use legal cover. If OP's insurance company have turned him down and said it's all his fault, what's his legal cover worth?

Pullgees. Also have a look at your house cover and at any cover to which you're entitled by reason of membership of an association, union or somesuch.

Third party insurance help please - Bill Payer
If OP's insurance company have turned him down and said it's all his fault what's his legal >> cover worth?

I've seen many comments saying this kind of cover is useless.


This might be an occasion where it's worth trying one of the credit hire accident mmanagment companies, such as Helphire. Not sure if they will take on someone who is 3rd party though?

Normally I hate such outfits as all they do is bump up the cost of the claim, but their opinion would be interesting - they won't take a case on unless they're pretty sure of winning.
Third party insurance help please - oldnotbold
It needn't be expensive to present a Small Claims case, and if you win all your costs are automatically awarded. Probably worth a free 20 minute consultation that some lawyers offer.
Third party insurance help please - pullgees
I had to go offline for a while. I'd like to thank the last few posters who have been more reassuring. with good advice. I have contacted a "no win no fee" lawyers firm who specialize in road traffic accidents and they were quite interested. Once they get all the details - police report etc, they will make a decision on whether they think I have a case.

 

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