Peugeot 306 (1993 - 2001) - 99 2.0 hdi - starting problems P0230 & P1138

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Mon 7 Jul 2008 21:14
99 2.0 hdi - starting problems P0230 & P1138 - adamfernadam
My peugeot 306hdi is having starting problems and we are really struggling with what to try next to avoid taking to expensive dealers (not financially possible).
The car was running fine and was parked up one day when i went to work, on returning it would only fire up and then cut out again.
I took it to a friend with the diagnostics kit and the P0230 and P1138 were showing. From speaking to various peugeot workers and readin through forums it seems P1138 is a common code after a shutdown and P0230 usually relates to the LP fuel pump.

The car will fire up with the key and will run for maybe 5 seconds before dying again of its own accord. Putting the ignition on can hear the LP pump in the tank fire up and also fuel rushing through the inlet into the fuel filter. The engine will also rev within that 5 secs but then still dies the same.

Today the LP fuel pump was taken out the tank, taken apart, cleaned thoroughly including connections and filter. All wiring connections are good and there is obviously power as it is working and sending fuel through. Pump was refitted but no change. Fuel lines all checked and inlet taken out and car fired up. Fuel comes out at full pressure before car dies.

Petrol has not been put in and no dodgy diesel has been put in that i know of.

Plans for the morning are to put back on computer to clear codes hopefully..maybe will help im not sure and also see if any new codes come up?

Stuck for what to do this has been going on 3 weeks and im really fed up and stuck without my car. thanks!

Edited by Dynamic Dave on 08/07/2008 at 22:27

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Mon 7 Jul 2008 21:26
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - Screwloose

First, make sure that this isn't an immobilizer fault? The 5-second-and-cut routine might suggest that.

Can you see the rail pressure in live data? What is it for the 5 seconds at idle? You can feel the fuel pressure on these - the filter housing swells.

Don't touch any high-pressure pipes.
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Mon 7 Jul 2008 21:37
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - adamfernadam
Thanks for getting back so quick...

sorry, How would i check it for an immobilizer fault?

Do you mean to check the rail pressure while it is plugged into the computer? If i know what you mean i will find out and let you know what it is.

The fuel seemed to be running at good, constant pressure. On putting on ignition the fuel rushing into the filter was easily audible.
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Mon 7 Jul 2008 22:14
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - Screwloose

Check the handbook for immob info for that year; there should be a LED somewhere. [Security stuff leaves me cold.]

Yes; the computer should be able to access about 1800 items of live data in close to real time.

The pump should prime for ten seconds at key-on. If it runs for that time OK; but the engine only runs for 5 seconds; then it doesn't look like the LP pump......

Seen this?

www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?f=4&t=64...2
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Mon 7 Jul 2008 22:33
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - adamfernadam
Okay thanks i will try the immobilizer in the morning, screwloose. I thought it may not be this as would it start at all if it was immobilized...mine runs fine for 5 secs or so?

Will also try to get that lve data for you aswell as clearing codes/checking for new codes etc

The pump primes fine for 10 seconds over andf over..also as i said pump and all connections have been thourouglty cleaned and checked.

so try immobilizer..check codes and rail pressure...anything else? regualtors/sensors anything else?

Thanks for that link yeah iv already read it..not sure what i need to try from it as it seems slightly different circumstances..

Thanks screwloose

Edited by adamfernadam on 07/07/2008 at 22:34

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Tue 8 Jul 2008 21:15
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - adamfernadam
Hi screwloose (and anyone else who can help) !!

Today we checked the wiring to the box down behind the battery where the fuses etc are as there seemed to be a wire corroded through. Reconected and cleaned it all up but no change. If anything it seemed slightly harder to get started.When it did it was still running 5 secs and cutting out. Not been able to get it back on the computer til tomorrow so instead have had the fuel rail relay off and checked it.
Another 2nd hand one was put on but no change EXCEPT ONCE when it fired up and run for about 1 minute then cut out. This was interesting as it has never ran that long since the faults occured.

Would a brand new fuel rail relay help possibly some bad connetion dirt etc? could it be checked by holding it closed to make the connection while running the engine and leting go of it and seeing if ther engine cut out?

could it be an immobiliser problem like you said? still unsure where wiring etc is..but apparantly the key hole on steering colum contains the immobiliser part and the key has the chip in it. Maybe there is a fault in this causing a delayed cut out. Could maybe trying the spare set of keys be worth a try?

Any other ideas what else we can try next? Any other wiring areas/sensors/looms/relays etc? Injectors? Really unsure of next steps after what i have said above. Also hopefully get back on computer tomorrow try clearing codes and seeing if any others show up.

thanks
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Tue 8 Jul 2008 22:25
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - Screwloose

The fact that it ran for a minute must rule out the immobilizer; as the ECU only let's you have 3 seconds to provide it with it's correct go-code before it shuts down.

So; back to fuel pressure. Maybe you have a leaking injector that's dropping the rail pressure [there is no fuel-rail relay, that's just the fuelling relay module] except that it cuts out when revved too - so that doesn't fit.

Check that you have a steady 298 bar pressure at idle in live data. [700+ bar if it'll rev a bit.]
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Tue 8 Jul 2008 22:55
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - adamfernadam
Hi screwloose thanks for keeping in touch,

Yeah it was strange how it ran for about a minute thats the only time over the 3-5 secs since problems began. After that though we struggled to get it going again at all for a while?

Hopefully will get in on the computer tomorrow agin for codes, will try to get live data although have never done that before so unsure as to how to do it or how long it takes etc.

would a injector leak off test be worthwhile doing?

May of meant fuel pump relay not fuel relay sorry i wasnt there when it was being done today. what about the fuel pressure regulator mentioned in Gilberts post you gave me the link to..is that worth checking o-rings and tip...is that in LP or HP pump did you mean? sorry im new to alot of this.

thanks for continued help

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Tue 8 Jul 2008 23:47
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - Screwloose

Diagnosis on a common-rail is neither simple or easy - even for those equipped with £20,000-worth of kit and years of experience.

There are many possible causes of your very unusual symptoms. Lets get some hard data to clarify things a little first; otherwise it's all confusing speculation.

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Thu 10 Jul 2008 19:57
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - adamfernadam
Hi screwloose,

The car has been back on the computer today and all the codes were cleared to see what new ones would come up. There were more codes on this time than last time it was on when only the 2 mentioned above showed. The codes which showed were 5 that have showed before. These were:
1138 - Fuel pressure
0403 - EGR (which was disconnected last time the code showed)
1404 - ECU, Glow Plugs etc (a general code it seems)
1112 - Fuel pressure control/ wiring
0203 - In-tank LP pump

also new codes now showing :
1517 - Alarm/immobiliser
0335 - crank sensor.

The fuel pressure was checked in live data, however not a good reading as the car still only run for 3 seconds at idle then cuts out. However, the pressure reading was around 400. Best we could get in the tiny time it runs for.

The thought was it may be an immobilizer problem as this code is now showing and htis would be wired into the crank sensor and fuel systems etc causing them all to stop at the 3 seconds. However as you know the car has run twice over that 3 secs..once for 1 minute and once for about 3 mins so not sure if immobilizer makes sense.

The EGR was disconnected so makes that code not as important.. The intank pump has been taken to bits again all cleaned and also wired directly to power to make it run constant but changes nothing but the code still shows. Fuel pressure code showing but tests show it to be good and constant. The crank sensor i assume would mean the car would not star at all if it was that.

Not sure what to do next, if an immobilizer problem it needs to be done by peugeot. Is it time to just give in and get it looked at properly or anything else we should be doing?

Thanks for yor continued help!

Edited by adamfernadam on 10/07/2008 at 19:59

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Thu 10 Jul 2008 20:28
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - Screwloose

Yes; you've now got both of the terrible twins P1112 and P1138.

In full; on an EDC15C2 system.

P1112 is:- "Diesel high pressure monitoring function. Pressure lower than the minimum pressure." [Often a pressure leak.]

P1138 is:- "Fuel pressure. Stop requested but regulator still active." [Often rail sensor or it's connexions.]

The pressure you monitored at idle is interesting; it should have been 298 bar; but it looks like the default value of 400 bar was being used - not surprising with those two codes stored.

Remove and tweak the terminals in the rail sensor's plug. There is a modified link loom available if needed. Then remove and check the o-rings on the regulator in the centre of the pump - and it's vulnerable tip for swarf blockage.

If you can also do a leak-off test; so much the better.

Leave the rest of the codes alone for now.
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Thu 10 Jul 2008 20:57
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - adamfernadam
Thanks for the reply,

is the correct rail sensor a metal sensor middle facing down in the middle of the rail. with yellow coating with green wires i think coming from it?

The car had problems a couple of years ago which was sorted with something being done to that sensor, sort of re-rooted by the look of it. It was done my a mastertec fitter if i remember right. If its the same sensor maybe there could of something wrong on there if it was a bodge job in anyway im unsure of.

Will also check the regulator and report back probably tomorrow night with that one, slightly harder job.

thanks
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Thu 10 Jul 2008 21:53
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - Screwloose

Yes; it's the inverted one. It's on the high-pressure side; so be cautious if removing it.
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Tue 22 Jul 2008 21:05
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - adamfernadam
Hi there, sorry its been so long. The car was taken to a friend of a friend (ex peugeot) who said he would look at it to give further help and advice but has let me down and so we are back with it again.

We have checked the pins etc of thi rail sensor plug and cleaned etc but will still not run. Also checked the o-rings but all seemed fine and still wont start. Anything else we should try next screwloose?

After looking more into the full meanings of the fault codes alot seem to be short circuits to earth etc or suply interuption to sensors. I have an idea this will of been from when the car was serviced and tested before it packed in and the battery was moved, touching metal piping which shorted it all out. I have been told i was lucky as it could have blown every sensor etc and even door locks. Not sure how relevant that all is.

Thanks for your continued help

Edited by adamfernadam on 22/07/2008 at 21:09

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Thu 24 Jul 2008 12:35
99 2.0 hdi 2.0 starting problems P0230 & P1138 - Diagnostics Doc
Yeah defo look at the live data and look for key signal recieved or immobilizer inactive as the pump will always prime but wont cut in whilst cranking, need to check the crankshaft signal aswell but its important to check that the low pressure pump is delivering enough quantity and has a good flow rate to supply the high pressure pump, need a good 200 bar at cranking on the rail to open the injectors too

Edited by Diagnostics Doc on 24/07/2008 at 12:36

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