We hear about the large number of drivers who are driving illegally, without a valid driving licence. I've never seen a break-down of the statistics but one assumes they are mostly people who have by-passed the test procedure altogether or drive while they have been disqualified for an offence.
However, locally there was a fatal accident a few years ago, caused by a driver who had never held a licence because he had seriously defective eyesight. He was jailed. I also overheard chat on a bus some years ago about a man who was driving HGVs somehow, despite being medically barred from driving any kind of vehicle.
But is there another hidden class of illegal drivers? I mean people who have failed their test several times and then decided they were going to drive anyway?
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There are plenty of drivers out their have no licences, insurance, road tax. The reason being we are to easy going on these people when they are caught. I was watching a programme last week road wars I think. When they stopped a driver with no licence all he got was a £200 fine and a 1-year ban. For goodness sake what sort of deterrent is that. A 1-year ban for someone who has not got a licence anyway. The laws need to get a lot tougher in my view. I would remove a finger ever time they are caught driving without a licence starting with there thumbs ; )
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Sofa Spud, I personally knew of one such driver (this is over 40 years ago), who drove all the time on his own and with his family in the car, until he eventually managed to pass the test.
This is perhaps slightly different to the case of someone who deliberately decides never to take a test, as the man in question did repeatedly take the test until he was successful, but drove all the time on his own until then.
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Research has shown that of those new drivers banned under the reduced totting up procedure of 6 points only 50% retake their test - I doubt the other 50% simply decide not to drive anymore.
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no licence means no ins, so no point in giving ban as punishment, impound the car they are driving, no matter who it is registered to, and sell at auction give the money to charity. then a minimum 3months sentance and criminal record. Thats a start. We should put more onus on the owners of the cars in the uk. Also make the driver number part of the reg document when you buy a car and then this could be tied up to the reg keeper name and if they don't match then should be flagged and checked.
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There may still be a few elderly drivers who never had to take a test because they got their licences before the test was instituted.
Unless they are enthusiasts, and pretty fit, they may well be as frightening as my wife's late aunt, an academic. Not so much because they are old - fast reactions are seldom really needed on the road - but because the vehicles they learned on were so different from those of today and, er, just yesterday. If (as in the case of that aunt) they don't have a driver's kind of intelligence, they probably abuse their cars and cause confusion driving in modern conditions with rhythms and basic attitudes appropriate to the 1920s.
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>>they probably abuse their cars and cause confusion driving in modern conditions with rhythms and basic attitudes appropriate to the 1920s.
Disabled Driver smashed into 2 shops (Greggs & Littlewoods), knocked over 4 x people and it seems to be caused by the disabled driver not being familiar with the Yaris Auto box!!
She was said to be mid-fifties - not exactly mid 80's and 90's of drivers who have a licence with no test needed. I believe Driviong Tests started in mod 30's
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Someone said: >> Also make the driver number part of the reg document when you buy a car and then this could be tied up to the reg keeper name and if they don't match then should be flagged and checked. >>
Insurance and MOT are checked when you tax a car. Why not driving licence also? Or is the assumption that all unlicensed drivers are also untaxed, uninsured and un-MOT'd?
If they are insured a driving licence check could be made at that application point also.
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Insurance and MOT are checked when you tax a car. Why not driving licence also?
Owner of car may have insurance but may not have driving licence because they never drive
My late MiL was the owner , registered keeper and insurer for her wheelchair vehicle but had surrendered her licence some 20 years ago.
Company cars is the other obvious situation where that sort of check cannot work.
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At work, an employee of near-retirement age was found to be driving for the company while not holding a license for the last 4 years on medical grounds. (heart related issues). We have since all had to provide our driving licenses and insurance certificates to be held on file if we make mileage claims for our own cars or drive company vehicles.
Edited by Hamsafar on 09/05/2008 at 16:48
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we have to submit a copy of our licence every year if we have a company car
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Company cars is the other obvious situation where that sort of check cannot work. >>
It can as hamsafar points out above and my experience is just like his. No company will let you near a vehicle without being certain you're licenced to drive it. Think of the potential lawsuits.
I can't quite follow the poster's point about mil. If the law changed, she'd have had to keep her licence or have someone else as keeper of the vehicle, I suppose.
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cant work directly because the company cannot produce my licence (not a copy) when my car is retaxed so it's more complicated.
The point I was trying to make is that, while the insurance and mot are related closely to the car, the driver is not. At least 50% of cars, certainly newer ones, in this country are not owned by individuals but by organisations. Some of them, like the company I work for have very strict management of licence copies but it is not the same thing as showing a driving licence when taxing a car.It's just not practical to show all the licences of people who might drive a vehicle when it is taxed.
Edited by commerdriver on 09/05/2008 at 17:27
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Disabled Driver smashed into 2 shops (Greggs & Littlewoods) knocked over 4 x people andit seems to be caused by the disabled driver not being familiar with the Yaris Auto box!! She was said to be mid-fifties - not exactly mid 80's and 90's of drivers who have a licence with no test needed. I believe Driviong Tests started in mod 30's
And how many fatal accidents are caused by under 21s?....
Many more, I feel.....
OAP drivers are slow, yes, but on the whole are far less dangerous than youngsters!
And just to level the comments, I know a lady in her mid 70s in Scotland who is a superb driver, puts many of us to shame...
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impound the car they are driving no matter who it is registered to
Hard luck on the owner if they nicked it!! ;)
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I'm see what commerdriver is saying now.
But the problem is not with company cars and company drivers. It's with individuals and individual cars. If individuals can't tax or insure a car without a licence that might help.
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Surely if people are prepared to drive with no licence, they won't be bothered about driving without tax and insurance?
The problem seems very simple to me - it can make financial sense to opt out of the system altogether. Just regard the occaisional fine as a tax on my lifestyle and (as long as it costs less than being legit) I still win.
It even crosses my mind from time to time - am I being the foolish one by being legal?
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Just before I packed up instructing, I took on an elderly lady who had been done on a mobile camera. When she sent her licence off in response to the Fixed Penalty Notice she got a letter back telling her it had expired in 1974. That was in the days when a licence had to be renewed every three years, and having at that time been recently widowed she had simply forgotten all about it and carried on in blissful ignorance.
The court was fairly lenient on her imposing a fine and points, but she had to apply for a provisional licence and start all over again, happily managing to pass both theory and practical.
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Surely if people are prepared to drive with no licence, they won't be bothered about driving without tax and insurance? >>
That's what I thought and it is a problem. It gets cumbersome but I suppose you could re-design the V5C so that the seller had to see a driving licence and record the details and send those to DVLA before he parted with the car. That's for a private sale. A dealer always asks to see insurance, doesn't he? In my idea you don't get that without a licence.
Where people aren't in the system, persuade them to join by (as now) crushing cars and making fines sufficient as to really hurt.
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Ref Marlot's comment on fines as a tax, last year we had a similar programme to your Road Wars, but with the copped drivers also having their say. The young gentlemen travelling at high speed were quite open that the fines were just part of the cost of a bit of fun.
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