`Will a risk/cost gap continue to widen in future diesel engine design, when compared with petrol`
About 15 years ago diesel had it for simplicity and reliability,but how many of us are still buying diesel from the `inertia` of that initial experience?
Its well documented about misfueling, putting petrol in diesel cars. But there is also increasing evidence on the web of concoctions of cooking oil being put in common rail diesels.
Then there is FAME biodiesel at over 5%. I came across one such pump in Calais, it looked (felt) great. from a (psychological perspective)
You know, green, save the planet and all that..... It was the different EN spec that stopped me in my tracks. But how many will know that outside an enthusiasts forum like HJ?
You can bet a *lot* of cars are going to get it. Now add on the petrol misfueling, some getting cooking oil, then increasing complexity and repair cost of diesels.
Is owning diesel, in particular buying used, even less viable from a cost/risk perspective as every year passes?
Even with perfect fueling are diesel complexity and repair costs going to *continue to widen the gap* on petrol?
Regards
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I think your implied suggestion is that the cost/risk factors associated with the ownership of a modern diesel have risen considerably and I would agree. I think there have been two main factors at work here, one understandable and one unhelpful.
The understandable factor is that of market forces which have given us diesels which outperform their petrol counterparts and use much less fuel in the process. Good work.
The unhelpful factor is legislation. Just as the fitment of catalytic converters to petrol engines years ago forced us all to waste millions of gallons of fuel by burning it at a stochiometric mixture, the fitment of particulate filters to diesels to ensure compliance with Euro IV and beyond renders such engines less efficient and more costly to service and repair. It's a tragedy that in some diesels, extra fuel has to be burnt in order to keep the particulate filter temperature high enough to burn off the soot.
In both instances, the politicians have effectively caused more fuel to be burnt per task by closing a line of engine development which could have resulted in further fuel savings and consequently lowering pollution levels. We could have had lean burn petrol engines and diesels with ultra precise fuelling to minimise smoke.
My own solution has been to buy one of the last Euro Cat III diesels with a Bosch fuel system. Next time I'll probably go for a petrol car as my annual mileage will decrease, but it's a pity that the politicians inhibit important fundamental engine developments by ill considered short term "fixes".
659.
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659
I couldn't agree more with every word of that. It'll take a little time, but once there's general awareness of the impact of Euro-4 on diesel running costs; then the idea that diesels are cheaper will be dead.
One of my lease-company fleet customers estimate that if a Euro-3 C5 HDi was doing 45mpg for a driver, then a Euro-4 one will do 38. Add-in the DPF/fluid replacement costs and there's no saving over 3 years if DERV averages 1p/ltr more than 95RON.
LPG is cheaper; but needs a lot more spent on development. Still too many niggling problems; although a fleet of all-gas Connects seem to be doing OK - so far.
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I bow to the superior knowledge of 659 and screwloose on the technical issues of diesel car ownership but I am avoiding another diesel for a simpler reason.
Modern diesels seem to me to be so complicated that most things are simply beyond the scope of a competant home mechanic like myself. I know it's easy to harp on about the good old days when the turn of a screw on a carb adjusted your mixture and idle speed but having owned an Astra (izusu engined) I would not contemplate another diesel car until I am wealthy enough to turn the car over to the garage every time a light flashed on the dash.
Ok, modern cars run very nicely UNTIL something gets flagged up by a sensor and the ecu is upset and goes into limp home mode and before anyone says it, I know that happens on Petrol and Diesel cars but again, speaking as a home mechanic (and I consider myself fairly competant), I find that the benefits in terms of fuel economy in owning a diesel car can easily be out-weighed by the massive costs when they go wrong............
As Terry Wogan would say, 'Is it me??????'
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once there's general awareness of the impact of Euro-4 on diesel running costs; then the idea that diesels are cheaper will be dead.
I have to say there is a lot in what you say. My Euro 4 Audi A4 2.0 TDI is looking to be a good bit more thirsty than my old 1.9 TDI A4, and all indications and info show that this is a general trend, even down to the Audi dealer telling me "nah mate these 2.0 engines aren't as frugal as the old 1.9". However there is still a significant gap between a petrol car with equivalent performance on MPG.
Regarding reliability, personally I have never had any engine related unreliability issues, although I do think that common rail technology has gone through a difficult adolescence which is largely now mature. I still think there is a place for diesels, especially as diesel is now the same price as petrol (as it %^&*&* should be).
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