Im starting to think my planets are out of alignment.
My van has just come back from repair today, 5 days early.
It was bad enough that I was given a huge VW LT van as a loan vehicle which was totally impractical for getting up some of my customers narrow driveways ( and not the Astra type van I was promised by the hire company ).
I hoped that would be the last annoyance.
Seems that wasnt to be.
On getting it home I had a good look round.... Oh dear.
I had damage to both the inner and outer OS rear wings. The outer one has been done, but the inner wing was simply painted and the trim panel put back over it. I lifted the panel because it wasnt fitting right, only to discover there was a sizeable kink in the inner wing still.
That made me pretty angry.
Anyway, then I thought, the cage that holds the spare wheel was badly bent, lets have a look what they did there.... absolutely nothing as it happens.
I even went along to my Suzuki dealer who kindly let me take pictures of the underside of their Carry van so I could see what shape the cage should be and where it should fit in relation to the rest of the van.
The cage on my van is bent atleast 4 inches forward of where it should be and on looking at the cage from the underside, its buckled at the front in two places - easy to see and the repairer noted it down when I took it to them. This would explain why the large bolt that you unscrew the cage with, which is mounted next to the boot catch was at such a funny angle.
By this point I couldnt really believe what I was seeing.
So on I went - the rear floor in the cargo area has been painted, but the finish is childlike and where the lower floor was repainted, they dont seem to have cleaned it properly as the paint has gone blotchy as if it was painted over oil.
There was also overspray on the interior panels and the rear tyre, a scratch on the brand new rear bumper and a couple of new scuffs on the front bumper!
Ive loged a complaint with my insurer who are dealing with it, but honestly, Im about to strangle someone at this stage - why is it so hard to get any stage of the process right? The bodyshop sure get the prize for being no good at what they do though!
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Had a poor repair problem with a car a few years ago. Insisted the vehicle went to a main dealer for rectification, also had an independent assessor to survey the car.
He told me that work done by so called preferred garages were done down to a price and not up to a standard.
Had the whole lot done again and invoiced the insurance company for my wasted time.
--
Alyn Beattie
I\'m sane, it\'s the rest of the world that\'s mad.
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Was it the insurance co's repairer? I only ask because there seems to generally very high levels of disatisfaction with them.
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It was arranged by my insurer if thats what you mean? Dissatisfied with the insurer or the repairer?
Im going into the repairer tomorrow following a call from their bodyshop manager.
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It may be worth getting an Independent Assessor's report.
I went to one years ago, after a similar thing happened to me, I think it was about £40 but was gold-dust.
I also claimed it back, with the cost of a very expensive rectification.
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Ditto. I would have been stranded without the help of an independent assessor when my insurer sent the VW to a "preferred" contractor. Wrong, incompatible paint, peeling off. Had to be redone, and rechecked by my assessor before acceptance. I had no chance of making a cogent argument without someone who could properly judge what had been done, and the remedy required for all the faults.
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Was it the insurance co's repairer? I only ask because there seems to generally very high levels of disatisfaction with them.
The trouble is that if you insist on going to a different repairer and have problems, you end up in a no-mans land, where the insurance company is saying 'you should have used our repairer', and the repairer doesn't have to deal with you because you're not their customer, the insurance company is.
There's a guy on another forum I look at who's having exactly this problem and is pulling his hair out. He's taken legal advice and that was inconclusive.
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Stu. you have my sympathy.4 years ago my then Passat estate was side swiped by a van.The vehicle was collected by my insurance co. repairers.
The repairs were awful(I rejected the vehicle three times)The second time i refused delivery,it was still on the delivery trailer.I could see the overspray from 100 yards away.There were eight seperate faults,including the entire interior covered in white dust.(primer),un sealed panels,overspray,poorly/incorrectly fitted parts.I could have easily done a better repair job than them.They had even painted over the rubbing strips-it was nice that they "colour coded" them-unfortunately the paint started peeling off after a week.I made them replace all the trim,and valet the vehicle.I wrote a very strong letter to the insurance co., which stated that in future I would not use their appointed repairers,but I would use my local guys.
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I would never use an insurance co's recommended repairer.
A long-time friend of my father and I ran a bodyshop - employed 14 guys. Business took a bit of a dip and he ended up working as a recommended repairer for a couple of companies. Insurance co's started paring back the rate they would pay and refusing to authorise work that needed doing - i.e. he was forced into doing sub-standard and shoddy work. Eventually the business folded because they just pushed too hard. Hit him very hard because the business had been started by his father many years previous and he felt he'd let him down.
I would always use a local repair whose work standards I know. There is brilliant outfit only a mile from where I live, they're not cheap and do lots of specialist work (classics and exotics) but they are absolutely top-notch.
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Im just doing it all through my insurer because whenever something goes wrong, I can just call them up and let them be shirty with the repairer - I have refused to deal with the repairer directly as I said if their attitude to customers is anything like their attitude to their workmanship, id rather not have to talk to them.
On the plus side, my insurer was very effecient with my complaint and I had a phone call within two hours.
Just remains to be seen what happens tomorrow.
What concerns me is that perhaps a cheap job was done to keep the quote down rather than repair the damage that was there.
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The bodyshop round the corner from me run buy 2 guys refuses to have anything to do with insurance work because they always want it done on the cheap
All they do is body work for small firms fleets / a lot of taxis & also private cars, they get a lot of recommendations by word of mouth because they do a very good job & its normally a 6 week wait just to get in, they have no shortage of work either.
I had the roof & bonnet sprayed by them just after buying the car & they matched the rest of the cars paintwork perfectly, you couldnt tell it had been painted.
Unlike the big insurance approved body shop who couldn't even get the right shade of black, The insurance company inspector wasn't pleased when he saw it, took another week to get the colour matched correct before he would sign it off.
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May get a result yet - I had a minor arguement with the general manager who tried to talk his way around the bad work but I said id ring my insurer again and make a second complaint then, so he agreed to rectify the overspray there and then and tried to rub back some of the bad paintwork for a better finish which didnt work and they went through to the metal!
He denied the spare wheel cage was ever on the estimate - I said well who did the estimate... we did he said. He also tried to argue that the kink in the inner wing was done by a load in the rear of my van, just strange that it only appeared after a rear end shunt!
I argued that firstly, there was no impact damage from the inside and if an object had hit on the inside hard enough to make a large kink in the inner wing, it would have left a mark at the very least. He conceeded to this finally. I dont think he was used to people who knew about bodyshop processes as he changed his tune quite quickly when I could easily explain why what he was saying was ****.
Anyhow, when my van was brought back round, the guy who brought it round was far more helpful and said that he would sort out the inner wing, replace the spare wheel carrier and sort out the bad areas of paint inside - he said make a list of areas that arent good enough and leave it in the van when I drop it off for the day next week.
I got the impression he was the bodyshop manager as he had people skills! He was far more interested in getting the job done right and acknowledged that the job wasnt very well done as it was. He is also going to get the seam where the inner wing meets the floor sorted properly as it was still showing unpainted areas.
Onwards we go...
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I would never use an insurance co's recommended repairer.
I would always use a local repair whose work standards I know.
If it's going through your own insurance then what happens if your insurance comapny doesn't agree the estimate?
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Not surprised at all I'm afraid. My insurer last year, cluckcluckcluck, said in the policy that for £50 extra you can select the repairer of your choice. Took this option but they then refused to pay anything other than their approved repairers rate. Engineer was very rude and coudn't give a monkeys. Upset the franchised manager as well, who has 25 years bodyshop experience. They're no longer my insurer, and a few others either. Be warned!!
At the same time. a colleague has got her new Golf back from an authorised repairer in the wrong shade of red, and another friend her Skoda back with no NSF lights working....
Seems these repairer network garages are paid on volume and not quality. I think they even have to fund the loan cars the insurers offer as their own. I expect there are some good authorised repairers around, but not sure where they are.
Anyone on the backroom know the inside story? Are we in this post wrong, and just unlucky?
I asked my new insurers this renewal about repairs before paying the money.
Good luck stunorthants.....
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I don't think they can force you to use a recommended repair. RAC Insurance, for example, allow you to use your own repairer but then won't give a courtesy car.
As stated above, these recommended repairs bid for the contract on a piece-work rate and the bodyshop technicians have to get through jobs like the clappers if any money is to be made. Its not really the fault of the guys doing the repairs, its that they are pressured to rush them all. You can have it fast or you can have it good, but its difficult to have both.
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As I keep reminding me wife.
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Shoddy work by approved repairers should be something the financial ombudsman should look at or the OFT. It is disgusting the average punter is fobbed off with substandard work. How many people have dangerous cars due to defective repairs by these people? Price is no excuse. Once people start complaining and refusing to accept poor work and returning the vehicles multiple times until they are satisfied insurance companies will discover it is cheaper to pay a decent rate for decent work rather than having to pay the body shop for the extra time and materials (assuming the ins co pay). If the body shop are lumbered with the extra cost due to ins co demands then I suggest as many companies as possible boycott insurance work until insurance companies start paying decent rates.
I wouldn't touch an approved repairer with a barge pole now. I took one car to them and they did a decent enough job but they said how difficult it was to repair the cars for the price they were given, it was £25 an hour then and I think the rate is similar now! It wouldn't surprise me if these cheapo insurance companies started shipping cars off to Poland etc to get the jobs done on the cheap there instead of paying full rates here...
If the other insurance company didn't agree the estimate I'd sue the person that caused the damage through the small claims court. Legally you have to be put in the exact position you were in before the loss occurred so some rubbish repair is not what I'd accept. Some approved repairers are also well known for writing off sports and fancy cars for low values so they can sell them on at a profit. I've heard of many that immediately move a decent car off miles away to make sure the owner can't get it back easily either. It's more tricky if you are at fault and claiming on your own insurance but you should still demand a decent standard of repair.
teabelly
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Aprilia
"I don't think they can force you to use a recommended repair"
You are right. I work for the RAC dealing every day with bodyshops and fleet drivers' repairs. You can use your own repairer regardless of what your insurance company says.
However, there are various issues in doing these that can slow down the whole process.
For example, the approved garage will have an imaging link straight to the insurance company assessor who can authorise the work more or less straight away so there is no need for a physical inspection. Your own garage may not have this facility, or have a direct link to your insurer which means a physical inspection is required which in most cases can take several days (if not weeks).
The labour rate and parts costs can also be sticking points that require endless discussion as the insurance company will do whatever they can to avoid paying a higher labour rate as they will have calculated a particular hourly rate
Also, if you are using your own garage, the insurance policy will normally state a courtesy car is only provided if you use an approved repairer. Contrary to what most people think, the courtesy cars are actually funded by the garages and not the insurance company. The cost per day of these cars is really quite low (£10 per say or even less) but it is still a cost that has to be factored in to the whole calculation of repair time, number of repairs, parts costs, etc.etc. You can go to you own garage who may have c.cars to offer you but this would be funded by that particualry garage and clawed back in the repair cost anyway.
If you are not in a rush for the repairs, there is no problem using your own garage, the main issue would be delays.
Cheers
jdc
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there is no problem using your own garage, the main issue would be delays.
I would say that the main issue seems to be that if there's a dispute about the quality of the work then you're on your own if you chose the repairer. And the repairers are apparently well aware of this.
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"if there's a dispute about the quality of the work then you're on your own if you chose the repairer."
Absolutely, and why should your insurance company have any responsibility for work done outside of their own control ?
At least using an insurers network there is some guarantee that eventually any dodgy repairs will be fixed. My job is liasing with repairers daily and I am amazed how much rectification work needs doing that must have a serious impact on the repairers profit margin. Have just been dealing with a Jag (repair bill about £10k) where the driver has reported a whole list of problems after the repair. These has been back at the repairer now for over 2 months and I would think the repairer will be heavily in the red on just this one job. We are forever pressurising them to get it right 'first time'. Having said that, there are hundreds of jobs a day that go through without a hitch, on time, and repairs OK - it's just that these are never noticed.
I think it also depends on the quality of the insurance company. Some 'cheap and cheerful' companies will certainly cut corners on this and drive the repairers rates down.
The repair industry is is a state of flux at the moment with many smaller bodyshops unable to stay in business due to the competitive nature of the insurance work. Most insurance companies will now stipulate a minumum level of equipment, including digital imaging and on-line tracking, something the corner-shop style bodyshop could never afford. There is now a trend towards large, more state-of-the-art bodyshops that deal with many insurers thus ensuring volume. There are even specific chains developing (like the Norwich Union Solus operation) where smaller outfits have been taken over, upgraded and re-branded. Repairers are definitely getting more high-tech but they have a long way to go before they fill the average customer with confidence and this is something we are trying to improve every day ......
jdc
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