Whilst driving round the M25 (in a truck)this afternoon I had to stop as I witnessed an accident. A French LHD artic pulled out from lane 1 in to lane 2 and on the way picked up a car on his front bumper, It remineded me of the thread a while ago about people sitting in blind spots of trucks. Now on this occasion no blame could be put on the car driver as he was overtaking the truck and the truck driver was just not aware of what was around him, the car was not a pretty sight but the driver was ok, just quite shaken (as one would be after having been pushed sideways by 44t of artic for 200yds). Now we are all aware that vehicles have blind spots, so why does someone not invent a warning system such as used on Planes so if you move within say 2 meters of another vehicle you are warned of their presence!!!
Also, with regard to the thread on Hazard lights, I was glad people paid attention to mine at the time as I could see the traffic behind not stopping as quickly as I was!!
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I always remember the saying "if you can't see my mirrors, don't expect me to see you"
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I always remember the saying "if you can't see my mirrors, don't expect me to see you"
I've seen that on loads of lorries, and said to myself 'Ok, makes sense'. Then I had to hire a 7.5 tonner for a day to move house, and suddenly, it makes an awful lot more sense than it did before - a lesson that I'm still very aware of, three years later.
TU - proximity sensors ? well, seriously, they'd have to be pretty sensitive, because on a multi lane road like a motorway, you can be very close to something in the next lane, and if they were fitted to front bumpers... well, who does travel 'two chevrons apart' ?
Go on, get out of the car...
www.mikes-walks.co.uk
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TU - proximity sensors ? well, seriously, they'd have to be pretty sensitive, because on a multi lane road like a motorway, you can be very close to something in the next lane, and if they were fitted to front bumpers... well, who does travel 'two chevrons apart' ?
I was thinking more along the lines of all road vehicles are fitted with transponder type things, the vehicle that is changing lanes only activates the reciver when the indicator is on or it senses the white lines, so knowing a lane change is underway. Totally senseless idea I know - but hey, we can live in hope!
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Must admit that I don't sit alongside a foreign truck for any length of time if I can help it, always tend 'to make progress' and pass them promptly.
My wife does think that I'm sad in that when we're out in the car I 'always' note what nationality a truck is before passing by making a mental note of its number plate or the signwriting on the trailer as I approach.
My argument is that I've seen far too many incidents like the one you describe, and even more near misses, when I'm out in the van to not learn to take, what seems to me, a simple precaution to not put myself in a hazardous position.
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HJ himself espouses the answer to this. LHD trucks should not be allowed on British roads without extra RH blindspot mirrors. I beleive the opposite applies in Europe, so why not here?
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From what I can work out an identical (albeit slower) thing happened in Hammersmith today, outside my office. Except the car driver (a woman) stopped and refused to move her car until the police arrived, backing traffic up right down Glenthorne Road. If it had happened a couple of days ago it would have been much worse.
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What would be handy would be to have an infra red sensor fitted to the bottom of the trucks mirror frame (similar to the ones fitted in houses to detect movement) that is activated when the relevent indicator is switched on & alerts you via a buzzer that something is within sensor range in your blindspot.
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I always check where the truck is from and try and get past without lingering in the blind spot,seen too many on the M3 and M27 that have been side swiped by a LHD truck.
Got to say though the trucks that seem to just pull out regardless on the A34,M3 and M27 are usually container trucks going to/from Southampton Docks and also the trucks making deliveries to the Transit factory at Southampton.Must have a lucrative bonus system.
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I always check where the truck is from and try and get past without lingering in the blind spot,seen too many on the M3 and M27 that have been side swiped by a LHD truck. Got to say though the trucks that seem to just pull out regardless on the A34,M3 and M27 are usually container trucks going to/from Southampton Docks and also the trucks making deliveries to the Transit factory at Southampton.Must have a lucrative bonus system.
Or paid by the load
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I see that some trucks whether they are UK or not, have a mirror over the top of the nearside door(UK) looking down to the kerb area. As these are convexed they show a wide area, mostly when manuovering but also when travelling.
These would prevent the blind spot in such accident as above, where the normal mirrors cannot see as they are looking back not down and out.??
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Most trucks come with a kerb mirror and a convex mirror as well as a normal mirror on the passanger side, these do not cover the blind spot by the front bumper at the corner, the only mirrors I have seen that cover this area are big round ones that are mounted just above the front windscreen (they look like the type you see in corner shops) on the passanger side. But I would think they have a limited life span as they will be the first thing to get smashed when maneourving in tight spaces.
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Many coaches are now equipped with mirrors on the end of long stalks dangling fom the roof like droopy antenae.
They look like a good idea. I have not noticed them on trucks.
What are the pros n cons from a professional trucker?
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Those mirrors on coaches look very vulnerable, and very expensive, which is why, I believe, they are known as P45's
Go on, get out of the car...
www.mikes-walks.co.uk
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Pros are that they would be like the old wing mirrors on a car (not that I am old enough to remember-but have been told) in that you can see the whole length of the vehicle, problem I could see with them on a truck is that they would end up getting knocked off on a regular basis. Trucks, as a general rule, have tighter places to get into with more obstacles to avoid (or not as the case may be!!) Not even sure if they would give the visability needed anyhow, based on the fact that in these coaches the driver sits low down and the mirrors are up high so his view is different. Also the coach has a huge great door/window covering his passenger side blind spot, Most trucks don't have this luxary, some rigids do have a glass panal in the bottom of the passanger door that does help.
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Thanks for your comments from on high to me down there.
I thought there would be good reasons for them not being fitted least of all a probable high mortality rate.
I have certainly appreciated your contributions and other truckers. I now have a greater understanding cos I like so many have not experienced the scene from up on high. The closest is a coach trip if I get the front seats but I do not get a commentary.
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Your very welcome sir, and your comments are gratefully received.
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This topic was once covered by Top Gear (or Fifth Gear) in which the situation that can give rise to such accidents was recreated on an airfield by VBH and colleagues.
During the programme, Cheshire Police were credited with stating that such accidents happen very frequently on the stretches of motorways which pass through its area, especially the M6.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
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Just back from Gatwick. On the M25 J9 to J8 there was a car with very battered nearside doors sitting on the hard shoulder facing the wrong way. A few yards ahead was a continental truck stopped.
I can only guess what happened.
It reminded me of forum advice re LHD trucks and there were dozens on my short trip.
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Some way of stopping the truck drivers falling asleep at the wheel would prevent hundreds of accidents...Ask any motoway policeman
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Some way of stopping the truck drivers falling asleep at the wheel would prevent hundreds of accidents...Ask any motoway policeman
Or Reps, they are just as likely as truck drivers - if not more so as they don't legally have to take breaks from driving after 4.5 hours.
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Or Reps, they are just as likely as truck drivers - if not more so as they don't legally have to take breaks from driving after 4.5 hours.
Or even managers, I know a middle manager in a large multinational who is expected to drive from Essex to Newcastle and back on the same day, not allowed overnight stay or time off day before or day after for travel even if he was happy to pay his own hotel bill. This is to attend management meetings with his senior managers, who do get overnight hotel. Journey is about 300 miles each way, meetings start promptly at 10:00, it is frowned upon if he is late, meetings normally finish about 19:00. He normally leaves at 04:30 and rarely returns home before midnight. You figure it out whether you consider him safe on the road and if you'd be happy sharing the A1 with him late one winter evening, I don't think would be. Apparently this is far from rare, he knows many in similar positions, indeed, one of his colleagues does the same but from Exeter to Newcastle. Anyone fancy the southbound M5 in the early hours?
Personally I think it's little short of criminal that he has that sort of pressure put on him to flout commonsense safety.
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Yup I saw that one too. I saw probably one a day in the days when I coomuted Chatham to Bracknell daily. I find the foreign lorry drivers are hugely more aggressive in their driving than the UK ones. And I suspect on some if the ones from further afield their standards of maintenance leave a lot to be desired.
A few years ago their was a HGV check on the M5 in Glos. (not high foreign truck numbers) & 1 in 3 trucks had defects with 1 in 5 serious faults most of which resulted in prohibition notices. A recent TV prog on Men & Motors showed coaches stopped in Yorkshire where they served stop notices on 1 in 10, one was missing wheelnuts & some of the others were finger tight!!!!!
Not seen a truck stop session by the police for years! There is one on the Thanet Way but judging by the dust & filth it hasn't been used for ages.
Nowt to do with pressure from the Road Haulage Assoc of course?
Jim
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You ought to have a look in the MSA's Jim, there are lots of VOSA checks carried out every week all over the country. Along with that, down here in Hants they have VOSA vehicles that do stop and check lots of trucks, but VOSA seem to rarley use laybys for checks now - no doubt a H&S issue.
Oh, and the RHA are not worth tuppence - if it dosent involve them getting funds then they are not interested.
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tr7v8 obviously doesn't drive a wagon for a living . I expect to be pulled in for a check several times a year , sometimes for the full mechanical examination , sometimes just a check on the Tachos or a weight check .Rest assured they are out there but I agree that road safety would benefit if the funds were avaiable for more roadside checks .
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Checks regularly mounted around the West Midlands.
tinyurl.com/a4ym6
From last week : usual results - always a reflection of poor maintenance + persistent overloading
Phil I
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Quite right I don't drive a truck these days but used to see loads of checks either in laybys which I accept doesn't meet H&S rules these days or in the proper lay bys. But just saying in the 20-36K miles I do a year I can't remember the last time I saw a vehicle check, this living in Kent where we have the highest proportion of foreign lorries around because of the ferries & tunnel.
Jim
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I would imagine the reason you don't see them is because of where they are now carried out. Last time I got stopped at one it was in the services on the M40 at J10. I was coming down the A43 towards the M40 and a Police car just put his follow me lights on and pulled me into the services where they had set themselves up out of the way. They also do the same on the A34 at Sutton Scotney, so unless you are actually looking for them you are unlikely to see them. I suppose again, doing it this way is safer for everyone involved, stopping vehicles at the road side is not the best way to avoid an accident!!
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