New Panda - lack of grip | Technical matters | Back Room Forum

Sat 26 Mar 2005 19:17

New Panda - lack of grip - paulb {P}

Evening all

Mrs B's new Panda (1.2 Dynamic). We've had it 6 months (and 2,500 miles) now and we are both getting increasingly concerned about the lack of grip - it will understeer (or feel like it's about to) at very low speeds (e.g. 10-15 mph turning into a side road). Not confidence-inspiring.

Standard tyres are Continental EcoContact 155/80 R13s. I make an absolute religion of ensuring that the tyre pressures on all our vehicles are spot-on (in fact usually very very slightly over the prescribed pressure, to allow for pressure loss between checks), so underinflation can't be the reason.

I have heard that these low-rolling resistance "fuel saver" tyres can be less grippy than others, and certainly the tread pattern seems a lot less pronounced than, for example, the Dunlop SP Sports on my Civic. My questions are therefore

1) Are EcoContacts particularly bad for grip or is it possible we have a naff set?
2) Can anyone recommend a different tyre suitable for this size of car that will do better? I had thought about swapping the 13" steel wheels for the optional 14" alloys, which come with wider tyres, but we can't really afford that.

Any suggestions gratefully received...

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Sun 27 Mar 2005 08:31

New Panda - lack of grip - AndyT

I've used the Conti EcoContact tyres on a couple of cars with no grip problems. I think you should definitely get the steering alignment checked pronto.
I presume also, without trying to sound patronising, that the wheelnuts are tight...

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Sun 27 Mar 2005 09:54

New Panda - lack of grip - Dynamic Dave

tyre pressures on all our vehicles are spot-on (in fact usually very very

slightly over the prescribed pressure, to allow for pressure loss between checks),

so underinflation can't be the reason.

Underinflation will actually give you better grip as there'll be a bigger footprint on the road surface. However, severe underinflation wouldn't. I would try lowering the pressures by a couple of psi and see if it makes any difference.

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Sun 27 Mar 2005 11:03

New Panda - lack of grip - nick

I'd follow Andyt's advice. Get a 4 wheel alignment check done.

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Sun 27 Mar 2005 12:35

New Panda - lack of grip - Crinkly Dave

How do you check the pressures, with the garage airline gauge, or you personal one?

garage ones are often inaccurate. If your own, check against another gauge

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Sun 27 Mar 2005 16:18

New Panda - lack of grip - ihpj

Why not take it back to the dealer to sort out? Good ness if you're having an 'issue' with your 'new' car then your first port of call should be your dealer. Let THEM worry about it and see if it's under/over inflation or possibly loose wheelnuts or whatever. If you get THEM to sort this matter out it'll save you money since they'd be responsible for the investigation work (so stuff like all wheel alignment check and trakcing etc. would be done by them) and then to set it right.

As for the tyres, my mother's MKIII Golf has always had a set of ContiEco and although thats a 14" alloy they've always been good and stable. 13" is a tyre size that I wouldn't ever choose for any car IMHO for fear of the problems you're having, how thin must that tyre actually be? I hate to think!

As for other tyre...it might be a tread thing - they way the tyre tread falls on the tarmac determines how the tyre itself behanves - but having just bought the car, again, I'd take it abck to the dealer, say you're not happy and get them to put on another set of four tyres from a different make?

It all depepnds how pushy you want to be. If I'd paid for a car that I'm no happy with - I'd be abck in the dealership insisting they set it right stat. No questions, no quibbles no apologies.

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Sun 27 Mar 2005 21:37

New Panda - lack of grip - Bill Payer

I'd agree with other comments that you certainly don't want to be over-inflating the EcoContacts. They're a hard compound tyre.
Has the Panda got electric power steering? My daughters Seat Ibiza has this and you tend to wind a lot of lock on more suddenly than with conventional power (or non-power) steering - so you're almost trying to turn the car instantly at slow speeds.
What do you normally drive - perhaps that's a starkly different type of car, and you're (sub-consciously) tending to drive the Panda as if it's a nippy little go-kart?
I've also noticed, I guess due to how little rain we've had, that the roads do seem very slippy at the moment on the odd occasion that they do get wet.

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Mon 28 Mar 2005 20:27

New Panda - lack of grip - paulb {P}

Thanks for all the replies!

I've owned (or driven) a good number of Fiats with the electric power steering and, to be honest, none has ever behaved like this. My own car is a 5-door Honda Civic, which sticks to the road like glue (well, comparatively speaking anyway) - but then it is a much larger car than the Panda.

With regard to tyre pressures, it definitely seemed that when the tyres had gone a bit soft the problem was noticeably worse. I do use my own gauge but it's a few years old now and I had wondered whether trying a new/different one might be an idea - will do that.

I don't think there's a problem with the wheel nuts - presumably if they were loose, there would be other symptoms such as vibration, which there isn't - the car runs perfectly apart from this one issue.

I hadn't even considered the wheel alignment, although thinking about it (and remembering a much-kerbed Corsa I had the misfortune to have to drive for a day a few years back) it makes perfect sense.

Supplying dealer is very good indeed (my family have bought loads of cars from them over the last 10 years or so), so I'll take it up there in the next few days or so and see what they say. Will let you know re. outcome.

Thanks again.

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Fri 1 Apr 2005 00:18

New Panda - lack of grip - Nickdm

I just bought a new Panda 1.1 last week, with the same tyres.

Remember that these are rather "skinny" wheels and tyres, and with the slightly raised seating position the car feels rather tall and narrow to drive until you get used to it. On the mountain roads around here it does feel like there's a lot of body roll at any speed. No squealing tyres or loss of grip though.

Presumably the bigger 1.2 engine will make your car feel more nose-heavy too?

If you select the "City" mode on the power steering then the steering wheel is so light as to be disconcerting!

In any case, it's probably not fair to compare this car's handling with the Honda!

Conclusion? Nothing wrong, but the car takes getting used to.

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Fri 8 Apr 2005 21:18

New Panda - lack of grip - paulb {P}

Update - I've finally had an opportunity to have the dealer look at it. They have road-tested it, checked wheel alignment, nut torque and so on and can find no fault.

Nickdm, I think you're right - Mrs B had a Punto before and it is just a case of getting used to the Panda's rather different driving characteristics. Also, it probably isn't realistic top compare it to the Civic, which (it must be said) is one of the most sure-footed cars I've owned.

Might still see if I can run to those alloys, though... :-)

Thank you all for your input on this one.

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Fri 8 Apr 2005 21:53

New Panda - lack of grip - Civic8

>>Might still see if I can run to those alloys, though

Wouldnt advise it.Going on older Pandas they get into skid very easily with no control.I would stick with what you have..
--
Steve

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