Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - offshore

I am expecting to receive a new 1.2 Leon in a few weeks.

I have always purchased supermarket branded petrol in the past, for my secondhand purchased Fiesta

Is there any advantage / improvement in using a branded or higher than basic grade petrol in a new car of this sort; is it worth it basically ?

I am interested in maintaining the engine mechanically, rather than faster performance.

Sorry if this is a very basic question - I really have no knowledge of this subject.

A good time to start though, as the car is new.

Thanks

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - FP

You will get a lot of opionated views on this.

Points to note: all fuel, whether branded or supermarket, by law has to conform to certain standards.

Branded fuels differ from each other and from supermarket stuff only in the additives used, i.e. the quantity and formula of the additives.

People who advocate the use of branded fuel claim its additives make the fuel burn cleaner/more efficiently/quicker in the engine and/or keep the fuel lines and pump cleaner and even that they will clean a dirty engine. Others say it's marketing hype and/or not worth the price difference.

Alternatively, you can buy your own additive, like Miller's, which claims to raise the octane/cetane levels in the fuel and provide useful extra detergent properties.

There is very little conclusive evidence about the topic, but that doesn't stop people claiming all sorts of things.

My advice to you is to decide whether you want to pay a bit extra to be on the safe side, just in case the branded stuff is fractionally better for your engine..

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - Railroad.

My brother is a Process Operator in a large UK oil refinery. He is actively involved in the process of making petrol and diesel for automotive use. He told me that the base stock for 95RON unleaded, 97RON unleaded or diesel is the same regardless of where you buy it. What is not the same is the cocktail of additives which are added to the fuel by each individual company after it has left the refinery. I have worked in the motor trade all my working life, and driven and worked on thousands of vehicles. I am convinced that in general the branded fuel end product is superior to that bought at the supermarket. Engines do tend to run cleaner and give better performance on Shell, Esso or BP fuel etc. Supermarket fuel is slightly cheaper, but not because they want to do you a favour, it's because the fuel quality is lower.

Edited by Railroad. on 15/05/2018 at 09:33

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - gordonbennet

Presumably your previous car ran well enough on the cheap stuff?

If you want to maintain the engine well, the best thing you can do for it is to ignore the recommended oil change intervals completely and revert to something like annual or 9k (whichever comes first) oil changes, unless you do lots of stop start in which case i'd slip a DIY change in at 6 monthly, using decent quality oil of the correct grade, and treat the engine with sympathy ie allow it warm a bit before using it hard, and allowing the turbo if fitted to run down on tickover for a while before switching off.

If you can afford the good branded fuel then it certainly won't do an harm, we don't generally do this instead i've long been a Millers additive convert for my Diesels (by no means new or low mileage) and the LPG our petrol car runs on (present one being converted at this very moment) doesn't appear to have any different grades.

I did experiment for a while with Shell's best Diesel but could detect no better running nor better fuel consumption, and the Millers keeps the injectors clean, i'd like to post the thread elsewhere involved re Millers but Photobucket's pics have gone west like so many others so no point.

Edited by gordonbennet on 15/05/2018 at 09:54

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - skidpan

We had a Leon 1.4 TSi and now have a Superb 1.4 TSi. Both have been run pretty much exclusively on supermarket fuel (Asda and Tesco) and have been perfect. On the odd occation we have filled with the expensive stuff (when we are on holiday - no supermarkets) neither car runs any different or appears to do more mpg. Wife has just bought a Fabia TSi and that will get the usual supermarket stuff as well.

Regarding additives, most (if not all) of the handbooks I have read simply say do not use oil or fuel additives because any issues thay cause would result in no warranty.

IMHO if cars needed additives the manufacturers would make it a warranty condition and sell snake oil in the showrooms. The fact that they don't must give ypou a clue.

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - Gibbo_Wirral

IMHO if cars needed additives the manufacturers would make it a warranty condition and sell snake oil in the showrooms. The fact that they don't must give ypou a clue.

Nope. Car and engine problems occur long after the warranty has expired and the onus on the dealer to assist is long gone.

Its not in their interests to provide a car that will run and run and run.

That's precisely why they don't warn customers who only do short local trips not to buy a diesel car. The DPF filter will be clogged and causing problems after the opbligatory 3 year warranty has ended.

If it is indeed "snake oil" I wonder why many local MOT places stock Cataclean and run it through the car when it fails the first time on emissions. And in case you claim that it would pass anyway, two emissions sheets are printed - before and after the cataclean.

Some videos here for the OP on different fuels. Asda fuel came out lowest BHP:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8L-X89duEs

Using Redex:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=03nL8Z0dRkI

Edited by Gibbo_Wirral on 15/05/2018 at 14:01

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - Engineer Andy

Whatever you go for - higher grade fuels or additives (or nothing), what you need to find out first is whether you even NEED anything like that:

  • If your car is under 5 years old and does a decent amount (percentage wise) of longer distance driving whereby the engine gets fully warmed up, then it won't need so much treatment, if any, and when it does, it'll do so at an older age. This is of praticular importance for diesel car owners.
  • If you do predominantly urban short trips from cold (less than 5 mins to the shops, school etc) and especially if its a DPF-equipped diesel engined car, then the engine may well need extra TLC and earlier in life to mitigate issues than can arise from such driving, especially associated with the DPF. Some cars seem to cope better with this sort of driving than others.
  • A poorly-maintained car will always need more TLC than a well-maintaned one. Again, the annual mileage and service type, quality and intervals make a BIG difference, as does the quality of the components/fluids used. Scrimping on quality rarely works out in the long term.

Best to:

  • Do your homework on the car you'll be getting, looking at the main and user reviews on this site (including the 'Good & Bad' section in the main review) and on other motoring sites, including (if there is one) owners clubs and forums.
  • Always take people's reviews of additives and fuels with a healthy pinch of salt - some people may be acting as a shill for them, others (often from rival brands or egotistical idiots who didn't use the product correctly in a botched DIY attempt) the opposite - not helped if the person's review doesn't give much detail - such as the condition, make, model and age of the car, etc as described about - this can make a HUGE difference as to what (if any) improvements such products make.

Your car obviously isn't 'brand new' as its a 1.2TSi, which has been superseded by the VAG 1.0 TSi, so you won't have a full usage history (though may have a service history, and you can look up its MOT history [if its old enough] and what each year's mileage was).

If its done low mileage and you cannot guarantee that that was made up of longer trips, then my suggestion would be to go for a relatively inexpensive option - not higher octane fuel (or additives that mimic this) with the extra detergents, but a fuel injector cleaner such as Redex (4 tankfull bottle for £5 - £7) or similar, which is far cheaper than buying 4 tankfulls of V-Power etc over regular unleaded (£5+ per tank more). The overall review scores are a better guide than just reading individual reviews (though some may be). Halfords occasionally have products like this on good offers; other times of the year alternative outlets online have better prices.

I tested both in my 11yo Mazda3 and the Redex seemed make more of a difference in smoothness, and the superunleaded V-Power about 3% or so in mpg, certainly not enough to justify its use all year round, especially as I don't use my car for short journeys. Your car may get a larger improvement (fuel octane) as its of a newer/different design - its a DI petrol engine. This is felt more so in performance terms for the high performance engines such the 2.0T in the Cupra. The price difference (about 8-10% for branded fuels, 5% for supermarket superfuels) is, for standard cars, not worth the extra unless you go for those with the cleaning additives and you don't mostly urban short trips.

Note that DI engines suffer from more problems with carbon build up on the intake valves as, unlike with 'traditional' fuel injected engines, the fuel does 'wash over' the backs of the valves, cleaning them and is directly injected in the combustion chamber. An injector cleaner won't make as much difference on that score on your type of engine as with mine for that reason. Both will help to clean dirty/clogged injectors (likely to be for cars used for short trips and older ones).

If you're not going to be doing a lot of short journeys from cold, then its probably best using a bottle of injector cleaner like Redex or similar once every couple of years (that's what I'm now doing). Its only worth using the superfuels with the extra cleaning additives if you do lots of local driving at low speed and you find the car doesn't drive so smoothly, even after a decent service and/or use of an injector cleaner.

The 'branded' fuel injector cleaners won't harm your car and are a small outlay that you could afford once in a while. No substitue for decent quality maintenance and servicing though.

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - skidpan

Your car obviously isn't 'brand new' as its a 1.2TSi, which has been superseded by the VAG 1.0 TSi,

Not so in the Leon, it was still listed back in March at a very attractive price compared to the new 1.0 TSi, it also had a higher spec. I guessed that VAG were using the Leon to shift surplus units.

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - offshore

Thanks for the replies on this - although not a clear result for or against.

Skidpan is correct - these cars were on offer with the 1.2 engine; it will be brand new.

For me the older engine provides some security, as the design is tried and tested; the newer smaller engine sounded quite 'shrill', a bit like the sound of an old beetle engine oddly enough. I am no mechanic/engineer, but such a small engine in such large vehicles sort of worries me.

Edited by offshore on 15/05/2018 at 22:13

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - skidpan

The 1.0 TSi 110 PS in the Fabia appears to be a good combination so far. We like the 3 cylinder engine sound but its very subdued in the Fabia compared to the Note we had.

With regards to fitting the 1.0 in cars bigger than the Fabia class the jury is still out, need to drive one. It does have a lot more torque than the 1.2 TSi 110 thus it should be OK but the feel from the driving seat is more important than plain figures. Cannot see it working in SUV's such as the Karoq but I am probably wrong.

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - Peter.N.

I have used supermarket fuel ever since they started selling it and have never had a problem, and that was many years ago.

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - Andrew-T

I am no mechanic/engineer, but such a small engine in such large vehicles sort of worries me.

Engine designers have been reducing swept volumes for a long time now, and the results have been impressive - but there must be a limit as smaller motors will be more stressed, therefore needing more TLC and maintenance. That may mean treating maker's recommendations with caution.

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - Andrew-T

If you're not going to be doing a lot of short journeys from cold, then its probably best using a bottle of injector cleaner like Redex or similar once every couple of years (that's what I'm now doing).

If you plan to use Redex (or whatever) occasionally, the best time is to do it annually, just before the MoT, to improve the emissions figures.

Edited by Andrew-T on 16/05/2018 at 12:53

Seat Leon - Petrol - Branded or Supermarket - Engineer Andy

If you're not going to be doing a lot of short journeys from cold, then its probably best using a bottle of injector cleaner like Redex or similar once every couple of years (that's what I'm now doing).

If you plan to use Redex (or whatever) occasionally, the best time is to do it annually, just before the MoT, to improve the emissions figures.

Perhaps, although I'd rather use that sort of product when its needed, i.e. when you notice a drop-off in performance/mpg on the same driving pattern and weather, particularly if that's made up of short journeys. It'll save more money in the long term as it keeps the injectors etc in better order for longer, not just to be used as a 'sticking plaster' to pass the annual MOT.

The CAT cleaners are often only used after a car either almost or does fail its MOT on emissions, as most people don't have the equipment to measure emissions, whereas a rough-running engine or with reduced mpg is more easily identifiable by its owner.