Cant get deposit back - Anthony parker

Hi all

I went and looked at a car today took it out for a drive it seemed alright but needed MOT, they said they would do it for me. So I gave them a deposit and went to sign a contract but there printer wasn't working, so they said they would send me through email to review expecting to go and sign it later. I called the dealer an hour later saying I was no longer interested. They said I couldn't have the deposit back because I had agreed to the car verbally and they had took it for a MOT. I have also heard that you have one business day to cancel it. I haven't signed anything and neither has the dealer. My partners uncle works for a used car dealer and he says people cancel all the time within a day and they have to pay them back.

I want an idea of what I can do?

Cant get deposit back - oldroverboy.

If you paid a deposit in cash you are on shaky ground, it wasn't a holding fee, but if you paid using a card contct your card issuer. They might help..

Was it from a small independant or main dealer?

How much deposit? age of car?

Value?

Cant get deposit back - Anthony parker

It's a 9 year old Fiat Punto for £1650 and it's from an independent dealer. Yea I paid with card as a precaution.

Cant get deposit back - scot22

The dealer is wrong. More knowledgeable people than I will post advice which should be listened to.

However, do learn from this. You must not drive a car without a MOT unless driving to test. You and the garage are at fault. The dealer would have to have had it MOT'd to get the best price.

Why put down a deposit unless you have a receipt ? if you have one there should be no problem

Cant get deposit back - Anthony parker

Yea I wasn't as cautious as I should have been I'm buying my first car and don't really have anyone to go with me that knows anything about cars but I should have done my homework. The only receipt I have is from the deposit.

Edited by Anthony parker on 09/11/2016 at 19:10

Cant get deposit back - RobJP

The dealer is wrong. More knowledgeable people than I will post advice which should be listened to.

I'm not sure that the dealer is wrong.

Though I'm happy to be corrected, I don't believe there is any 'legal' right to get your deposit back just because you've changed your mind. Card issuer (assuming Credit Card) might not be any help either, as it wouldn't come under S.75, as there is no good reason to request the refund due to failure to supply the goods within a reasonable time.

Unless something has changed at a recent point in the law, of course ...

EDIT : just seen your latest post.

In future, ALWAYS take someone with you that knows a bit. NEVER sign (or pay !) anything at the time, ALWAYS go and have a coffee (away from the garage) and think about it properly.

Edited by RobJP on 09/11/2016 at 19:14

Cant get deposit back - RT

My take is that verbal contracts are just as binding as written contracts - but more difficult to prove/disprove. My understanding of "cooling off" periods is that it only applies to finance agreements, not to buy/sell decisions.

Cant get deposit back - SLO76
There would be no point in taking a deposit if people can simply change their mind and ask for their money back so don't pay one unless you're certain you want the goods.

When I worked as a salesman for a large dealer in the 90's we encountered this constantly. Deal done, deposit paid, admin processes paperwork, car goes to the workshop for prep, money is spent on it then Joe Punter cancels and expects their deposit back. Unless there was good reason, a change in circumstances or bereavement then this was refused or they were able to transfer it to another car.

See it from the other persons perspective. Another potential buyer may have been declined because you've put your name on it. Don't sign anything until you're certain... Plenty more cars out there if someone else got it anyway. 9yr old Fiat isn't the best option at this money either.
Cant get deposit back - Anthony parker

See I just need clarification that it's a binding contract or not as I have not sign anything and have not been give any T&Cs I have agreed to or told that I couldn't have my deposit back if I changed my mind. I dunno if they have to go through these things with you before you commit to the car or if it solely rest on my shoulders. It says that the refund is no refundable on the blank contract for they have gave me but I didn't think it applied until I went through with it.

Cant get deposit back - Terry W

My admittedly somewhat out of date understanding is that a verbal contract is as binding as a written contract. Different rules apply to property and probably a few other items but as far as I am aware, not cars

Even if all you and they have is a credit card slip this is some evidence of a transaction.

Strictly speaking I suspect they have more right to pursue you to complete the deal than you have to cancel - unless something major has happened - eg: major advisories on MoT, new accident damage etc. Realistically you need to decide whether to write off the deposit or go through with the deal.

I wish you luck!!

Cant get deposit back - pd

A contract can be verbal and I would say the dealer has a very strong case. If you and the dealer were not discussing a contract why did you hand over your card? It is pretty clear you knew you were entering into a contract to buy the car by making the deposit payment.

The only possible get out is if the deposit was out of line with any costs or damages incurred by the dealer from you breaking the contract. So, if it was £100 I'd for get it. If it was £500 you could argue this was excessive and ask for a portion of it back.

You do not have a cooling off peroid in such circumstances unless you entered into a finance agreement of some sort.

My sympathies tend with the dealer here - when you handed over your card you must have know that you were placing a deposit on a car with the intention of buying it? Why else would you do so?

Unless there is some material difference in the car which has come to light (failed MOT etc.) then there has to be some personal responsibility here I'm afraid.

Edited by pd on 10/11/2016 at 10:54

Cant get deposit back - leaseman

"You do not have a cooling off peroid in such circumstances unless you entered into a finance agreement of some sort."

Just to be clear, there is no automatic right to cancellation nor any "ccoling off period" if a Finance Agreement is signed on the trade premises of the dealer, and this includes temporary trade premises at a show or display area etc.

Cooling off periods apply in Distance Selling Contracts, where there has been no face-to-face discusssion and/or "Doorstep Agreements" signed at home or elsewhere than the bona fide trade premises of the seller.

Cant get deposit back - Bromptonaut

Contact the Citizens Advice consumer helpline on 03454 04 05 06

Cant get deposit back - oldroverboy.

I have just reserved a car I am selling for someone. I have given the buyer a receipt for £300 and will keep it for them till they can pay for it 1st december.

I have said that if they do not pay me they will not get the money back.

I have also said that they will not get the logbook till I have the cash.

It is too easy if people can change minds.

Cant get deposit back - argybargy

A dealer will reserve a deal on a specific car for you if you pay a refundable deposit; if, for example you see it advertised online and want them to hold the car till you get to check it over in the metal. If you then drive the car and don't like it, you get the deposit back.

It might be an idea to ring the Citizens Advice Consumer Service, describe the circumstances in which you handed over the money and ask them whether you have any grounds for demanding your money back, and if necessary proceeding to Small Claims. I tend to agree with those who say that you probably do not.

Cant get deposit back - RobJP

Contact the Citizens Advice consumer helpline on 03454 04 05 06

Bearing in mind how utterly wrong CAB were, both on CRA issues and on licence/points basics when I had a look at their website the other day regarding a thread :

www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=116532

I'd be very cautious about viewing anything they say as correct.

Cant get deposit back - argybargy

Aye, and be careful not to "lose" points on your licence. ;0)

Cant get deposit back - Brit_in_Germany

From my basic understanding of contract law, this would seem to be a "sale subject ot contract" or effectively an agreement to agree, which I was taught is unenforceable.

Cant get deposit back - pd

Perhaps I'm just a bit old fashioned but I can't help but think that if two grown adults knowingly and willingly enter into a deal it is a deal.

There has to be some personal responsibility in life.

If there is a good reason the deal cannot be completed then fair enough, but if you agree to buy something and place a deposit on it anyone must be aware at that point that if they back out without good reason then they will probably lose said deposit?

Why else would you do it?

Cant get deposit back - TheBroker

Hi when it comes to contract law there are a few key elements:

1) Offer: The dealer has offered a car to you for a price

2) Acceptnce: You accepted the dealers offer verbally and by your actions

3) Consideration: Money has passed hands and he has now held that vehicle for you

4) Capacity: You were both in a capacity to enter into a contract (unless you are under the age of capacity or mentally incapable in law)

5) Intention to Create Legal Relations: You both intended to do the deal both verbally and by actions

6) Reliance: Based on your agreement and deposit, the dealer has relied upon this and sent the car off for MoT.

I would say, by you wanting to pull out you are then in breach of contract and the dealer has a right to exercise some sort of liquidated damages clause (penalty clauses are unenforceable except for the dreaded ParkingEye parking ticket saga). I would say that you have very little chance of seeing that deposit and the dealer in fairness is not being unreasonable, unless in his standard terms of business he states deposits are refundable within a certain timescale.

In theory, you could argue the retention of the whole deposit constitutes a pentalty clause rather than a liquidated damages clause (which must me a genuine pre-estimate of loss incurred) as he is unlikely to have spent £500 on the MoT and admin associated with the deal. But you would need to test that arguement in court which is entirely not worth it in reality.

I would go back to them and ask for a copy of their T's & C's just to check you don't have a get out and if you dont, then ask nicely for some of it back pointing out they will not have lost £500 in the sale not going through if you cancelled so quickly. Perhaps ask to meet in the middle hoping they are nice. Otherwise you can either go with the car anyway, ask the deposit to be moved to another car on the forecourt or just mark it down to experience.

Good luck

The Broker

Displaimer: Of course the above does not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. We recommend you seek legal advise from a professional or CAB.

Cant get deposit back - jc2

You admit in one of your posts that you saw a blank contract that stated "deposits were not refundable" but did not expect it to apply to you-please explain to us why not.

Cant get deposit back - Avant

Very good point, JC2, as a supplement to the Broker's excellent summary of contract law. Many thanks to you both.

You may be able to avoid a contract (in this case, get your deposit back) if the terms were (a) not the normal ones for this type of transaction, and (b) not made clear to you at the time of entering the contract.

Is that the case here? It doesn't sound like it.