Reading through NickS's thread "When does a car "wear out"?", some people have replied (notably madf) to the effect that they would "not buy a car from a manufacturer with consistent design or quality problems.. which means never buying a new model until it has had 4 years road experience to show faults". Car makers singled out to avoid include Mercedes (because of the current injector issues), Vauxhall, Renault and Mazda diesels.
What cars are the polar opposite of these? In other words, which cars would Backroomers buy in the reasonable expectation that they would last a good few years and not cost a great deal to keep on the road? If any cars like that exist, of course...
|
|
Well no one make is immune unfortunatly only certain models.
|
Before recent news I think many people (me included) would have rattled a couple of Jap names into a post. If I was buying new with my own money I would buy a C Class - MB have been through the pain of cutting quality and so their cars are probably better tested than most now. In a couple of years from now I will buy a Toyota. Looking at the press about how more models keep appearing on the recall list I am guessing the board have mandated a 'bring out your dead - or possible bad designs' brief to the engineers so they can fix the lot in one load of bad press.
You can bet your bottom dollar that the validation process at Toyota and Lexus will be better than everybody else after this as well.
Like stu says though no one is immune - Honda make some of the best engineered cars on the road but have been caught out by a switch.
I have never heard any bad press about Subaru - although guess that will change in couple of mins.
|
If I was buying new with my own money I would buy a C Class - MB have been through the pain of cutting quality and so their cars are probably better tested than most now
Huh? But they're going through that again with the injector debacle. Not only that, but the new C-class is just a year or two old - what more problems will reveal themselves in the years ahead? Remember, the quality problems of the previous generation E,C,SLK class didn't really emerge until 2002-3 & the previous to that generation of E-class (not the W124)
started its notorious rust & electrical problems 2-3 after introduction too.
|
I know the Suzuki Grand Vitara is one of those cars that doesnt really go wrong, its why my sister owns one and despite no special treatment, its been brilliant.
Its fairly well accepted that the older Toyota Camry is one of those cars that seems to be almost incapable of going wrong. Im actually considering a 2.2 estate atm.
Problem with the majority of new cars is that they have become increasingly complicated and this opens up the chance for more problems. Simple engineering is much easier to get right which is why old-tech new cars that are tried and tested are easier to rely on - it was this reason that we chose my wifes Sirion 1.3 - it has the running gear that dates back 10 years, but over those years it has got a great reputation. Its why it makes such a good long term prospect.
|
|
|
If I was buying new with my own money I would buy a C Class - MB have been through the pain of cutting quality and so their cars are probably better tested than most now
I don't buy that. I think MB are currently still run by the bean counters and they're arrogant enough to think that people will still buy their cars based on the image and turn a blind eye to the inexcusable faults that should not be there considering how much they cost. Although people do.
|
|
|
If I was buying new with my own money I would buy a C Class
Me too, I'm on my third MB, all used ones and I think they are great cars. Several people I know have them too, they all really think their cars are excellent.
|
|
|
|
|
Whether the various reliability reports and indicies are to be believed is quite subjective, however the Mazda 2 ('03 - '07) seems to crop up regularly in such reports as a very reliable car.
As a Mazda 3 (1.6 petrol) owner myself, the 1.6 petrol (pre-mid '06 changes [see 'piston slap' posts]) seems also very well regarded, as opposed to the diesels, which (with their Ford/Volvo and Peugeot sister engines) appear to suffer from the DMF issues. Other than the diesel engines, the rest of the car is very reliable by all accounts - mine has only had one tiny problem (rear passeneger electric window not working), fixed in 5mins for free at service.
I also have a high regard for Honda's reliability generally, but at the time a bought my car, they were much more expensive to buy and run than the Mazdas. Following the recall fiasco, I wonder if Toyota will have to drop their prices to stop their normal client base going elsewhere? I did read on Mike Rutherford's (Mr Money) collumn in the DT that they may be reducing the prices on the Prius.
|
Perodua, Proton, Sao, Hindustan and any other brand that dosn't sell well in the UK if at all?
|
Well, after what could be described as a debacle with their clutches around 2000-2002, I have not heard of serious issue with Hyundai cars since. The brakes can be tricky and expensive to replace on some models but the mechanicals are tough and I've not heard of electrical gremlins.
How much of this is down to lack of awareness and how much paranoid engineering from a company keen to improve market share I'm not sure.
I still wouldn't dismiss a Toyota. As far as the mainstream are concerned they're still a few cuts ahead of the typical Euro car. Petrol Fords, Hondas of course, newer Kias by virtue of their Hyundai links, older VAG cars with PD diesels, Subarus and petrol BMWs seem to be safe enough as well.
A lot of hype going on at the moment, and a lot of sneering by owners of certain French and German cars who should really know better than to be too smug -- that next horror story is surely just around the next corner.
|
|
|
I own a Yaris which is now 7 years old and have bought youngest son (with his money) a 9 year old Yaris.
The MOT failure rates say it is second to the Corolla in lowest MOT fails of all cars..
Says it all.
Anyone who thinks a Mercedes is reliable or cheap to run should join the MB Owners Club Forum (free) and start reading... The list of failures is disgusting.
In contrast the Yaris Owners Club is like tumbleweed in the wind..
(and there are lots more Yaris sold in the UK than MB)..
I find the best judge of reliability is Owners' reports - on the model forums. Say it all, warts and all.
The Yaris one is well - kind of dead- not much to say...
Edit:
MB have a long and distinguished history of engineering cockups starting with the A class, rust, 7 speed gearboxes, electrics etc...
Edited by madf on 16/02/2010 at 20:04
|
*NO* cars will never go wrong. Dont care who makes them, when or where. There will be some issue or other with all or any of them.
|
Over the years I have consistently heard bad reports (99%) about Renault, but I have known loads of folk over the past 40 years that have had them from Dauphine's to 'hand bag change' 4's, company Lagunas and 25's before that and of course my van. In all of that I cannot recall major headaches, i.e. worse than so and so. Maybe it is just my failing mind and 'earing. Eh! wadyasay?
VBR..................MD
|
Suzuki Grand Vitara is one of those cars that doesnt really go wrong
Most Suzuki cars are so basic that there are very few things that can go wrong :)
BTW, I drive a Suzuki myself.
then why won't other car makers offer warranties that match these?
They won't unless they see a sharp fall in their revenue or all media encourage people to buy Kia/Hyundai (& Daihatsu) only.
Edited by movilogo on 16/02/2010 at 20:46
|
Surely the car with the best record is the Mazda mx-5? A good car to start with, and pretty evolutionary development since.
Or Subaru?
Edited by Marlot on 16/02/2010 at 21:14
|
My friend has a top spec Clio 1.2 (2004) it has electric everything and she bought it at 35,000 miles, its now done almost 70,000 (she has only owned it for two years too!) and all she has had done is a two new brake pads, oil change and two near tyres.
It still works perfectly fine but the cam belt, tracking and clutch will need doing soon.
In her first year she had done 20k in it, I did a quick look round and noticed a break light out which I fixed and told her ot replace two tyres which were border line ilegal and it passed the MOT first time.
In contrast her mothers VW Passat is always in the garage.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
As a Mazda 3 (1.6 petrol) owner
Me too, although mine is later 06 with the lower C02 output. At the time, I bought it on the basis that I wanted to run a car from new for a long time and I'm doing ok at the moment (touchwood). Although some of that will undoubtedly be helped by avoiding the ABS/ESP sensor issue (see HJ comment above) and the trouble with HID ballasts by buying a lower spec model. Cheap, Japanese, petrol, chain cam, minimal electronics is where I would put my money.
|
|
|
|
Based on my experiance of company cars since 1981 these cars are the ones that gave me trouble free motoring
Talbot Horizon 1.3 ran to 80,000 miles
Ford Escourt 1.3 two ran to 60,000 miles
Renault 19 137,000 miles
Renault Laguna 157,000 miles both Renaults non turbo diesels
Saab 9000 156,000 miles
Citroen Xsara 78,000 miles
Skoda Octavia 63,000 miles
Rest of the cars I had were poor compared to this bunch and this lot included VW Golf, Ford Sierras, Vauxhall Vectras, BMW 3 series
Really no manufacturer is bullet proof from so called quality German makes to so called poor French makes you can get a good un and a rough un from all
|
Well that was a result, nobody slagging of Fiat.
I am on my second Panda and touch wood no problems with either of them, looks like Fix it again Tony ( or tomorrow) has improved.
|
|
I don't think there any manufacturers who have trouble-free records. Until recently Toyota were seen as dependable - but is that still the case? But at least Toyota has recalled their cars, unlike some manufacturers who just deny that a known problem exists.
|
Hyundai Accent is hard to beat for trouble free motoring, dull as ditchwater though.
|
|
I had an Accent (X reg) and it gave me most trouble - engine leaking oil, ABS sensor packed up, central locking fault, power window not working - that's what all I can remember now.
|
"I had an Accent (X reg) and it gave me most trouble - engine leaking oil, ABS sensor packed up, central locking fault, power window not working - that's what all I can remember now. "
I had a 1997 one and the only trouble I had was a stone through the radiator and a slight weep from the rocker gasket, didn't have any ABS or electric windows to go wrong.
Edited by Bedhead on 17/02/2010 at 17:19
|
The early Mk2 Accents were pretty terrible. They had issues with electrics and clutches -- although the 1.3is were usually fault-free because they were indeed very basic.
I had one and the engine was tough -- ran it for 80K. But the clutch was carp.
|
|
|
|
|
|
