05 2.0 Strange noise, goes when clutch is pressed - C5-55
Dear all,

A few days ago I bought a used Citroen C5 2.0, petrol, 55 reg., 05-08 model, with 26,000 miles, 5 speed manual. I am worried about a noise, and I would appreciate some advice.

The noise changes with engine rev and gear. It happens in all gears. And if the car is parked, with the engine running on idle, in neutral, I can still hear it, but if I then press the clutch down, the noise disappears.

It seems to be from the front of the car, but closer to us than the engine. The source seems to be between the cabin and the engine, as if from behind the dashboard, like behind the radio, or between the dashboard and the engine.

I've opened the bonnet, but from there I can't hear any noise. From inside the cabin it is more noticeable, and it is a bit louder than the engine. Sometimes it sounds like a little person "gurgling" behind the radio! But a bit rougher though. Like a drier gurgling (if that could be possible... Sorry).

It does not stop if I turn the air con off.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. I am trying to get an appointment with the dealer who sold me the car, but they seem to be playing for time. But we don?t have much time, as we have to travel to the continent in 2 weeks.

Thank you very much in advance for any help,

Edited by Dynamic Dave on 28/06/2009 at 13:13

55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - Peter D
Does the gurgling noise stop when the clutch is pressed. If infers the noise is the gear box. I suggest you have the oil level checked initially but there may be a gearbox problem. Doise the noise happen in neutral ?. Is it under warrantee. Regards Peter
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - C5-55
Thank you for replying Peter,
Does the gurgling noise stop when the clutch is pressed.


When the car is parked, engine running idle, in neural, it still makes the noise. BUT if I press the clutch down the noise stops.
I suggest you have the oil level checked initially


Ok, I'll do that. Thanks. Is there a "dipstick" to check the transmission oil level on the C5 (2.0L petrol, manual)?
Is it under warrantee?


3 months, from a chain of dealers, Evans Halshaw. But the one nearest to me, 20 miles away, is a Vauxhall dealer. The nearest Citroen dealer Evans Halshaw is 60 miles away, in Reading.

I'll drive it now and I will check if the noise happen in neutral also, when the car is moving.

Cheers

Mark
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - Peter D
No it is an inspction filler hole in the gearbox. Take it back get them to listen to it and get them to record the diagnosis and remedy and get a copy of that sheet. Does it sounds like a bearing or just gears meshing. Regards Peter
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - Simon
Its not the clutch release bearing is it?
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - C5-55
Its not the clutch release bearing is it?


Simon, I have no idea. Sorry.
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - C5-55
I've just driven it again. I noticed that when the car is moving, pressing the clutch down does not eliminate the noise. And I confirmed that when the car is parked, engine running on idle, then if I press the clutch down the noise disappears.

Evan Halshaw's service dept can see the car only Friday. Since I need to save time, I'm considering having the Citroen specialist in our town replace the transmission fluid (he can do it Tuesday), as it will cost me just £40. If the noise disappears, problem solved, cheaply. And if the noise continues, one possible cause would have been eliminated, and Friday's diagnosis will have a better chance of finding the real problem faster. Right?

Thanks for the good advice on getting them to "record the diagnosis and remedy and get a copy of that sheet".

Whether it sounds like a bearing or just gears meshing, I can't tell. Actually it sounds like something fairly light rotating. Not a big heavy chunky thing, as I imagine "gears meshing" would sound - though I've never heard it.

Thanks again,

Mark
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - Peter D
Changing the fluid may not be the answer. You really need the dealer to listen to it and make notes as this is going to be a warranty issue. Then you can take it in on Friday. If it is loss of fluid then it may have damaged the bearing/gears already. Yes if you are on the move and you dip the clutch the noise will continue as the shaft is still rotating. Try dipping the clutch and putting it i neutral. Usually a clutch release bearing make a noise when you press the clutch not release it. Having another garage may give the deal to the opportunity to void your warranty. Just show up on Monday and as reception for the workshop foreman to listen to the noise. Regards Peter
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - C5-55
Yes! I think you've nailed it. When moving, in neutral, it does make a noise when I press the clutch, but not when I release it.

I will follow your advice, cancel the appointment with the local garage, and just show up on Evans Halshaw as soon as possible, for the workshop foreman to listen to the noise. Thank you!

If I understood you, you think that the problem is loss of fluid, that may have damaged the bearing/gears already. Right?

Now, their warranty is limited to £500 (and 90 days). If it is what you think, would it cost more than that to fix?

We would MUCH prefer to keep this car, as we like it, has low mileage (26k), 1 owner, 55 reg, only£4,000, and it took us months to find it, and we put insurance on it already, and we have to travel in 2 weeks... So, even if it costs a little over £500 to fix, we could even pay some "excess".

But if it will cost a LOT more, then... Could I return the car, as a faulty product? Or get only £500 back? The problem didn't start after I bought it. It must have been there before I bought it. I just didn't notice it in the noise city centre test drive.

Our local garage thinks that the noise is not loud enough to indicate a serious problem, nor permanent damage. Is this possible, or likely? He thinks that I just need fluid.

What do you think?

Thank you very much, again!

Mark
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - Peter D
It may just be a failing bearing and all the oil is still in there. That is why you need the dealer to address the issue. Good Luck. Regards Peter
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - C5-55
Dear Peter, As you suggested I took the car to Evans Halshaw Portsmouth, asked the reception for the workshop foreman, he was ?unavailable?, but a ?senior mechanic? saw it.

I showed him the noise, (engine running on idle, car parked, pressing and releasing the clutch), but at first he could not hear it, from inside the cabin. Then he opened the bonnet, and then heard it. He agrees with you that it looks like the clutch release bearing.

BUT then the warranty small print kicked in: The Services Reception said that they would have to send the car to a Citroen dealer, since they are a Vauxhall dealer. And that my warranty covers only parts, not labour. I said that the problem did not start after I bought the car (7 days ago), that it was faulty already. Hence, this was not exactly a ?warranty? issue, but a Trade Sales Act issue. Then the Service Reception said that this was then a Sales issue, and sent me to Sales? Sales at Portsmouth?s Evans Halshaw said that, as the car came from Evans Halshaw Nottingham, they had to phone Nottingham. Nottingham sales asked Portsmouth sales to have Portsmouth Services ?price it? properly, then Nottingham would think about it ? Portsmouth Sales asked Portsmouth Service to price it, but Service is busy today, and schedule a 1 hour diagnoses for Friday?

I?ll have to wait, again.

BUT, on the way home I passed by my local Citroen specialist, to ask how much he would charge for the service, as I reckoned that he may be cheaper than even labour alone at a Citroen franchise, even if I?ll have to pay for the part.

I told him the story, and ? Another twist: He has serious doubts that the noise is from the clutch release bearing. He said a bearing would be much louder, would get worse fast, and would have failed already, during this week of driving. He insists that it sounds like low level/lack of transmission fluid, as the car also has a little ?gear box whining?. He thinks that I should first at least check the fluid level.

And he said that if it is really the bearing, that then it would be better to go for a whole new clutch. And this would cost me around £600, fitted, inc VAT.

That is it for today.

Cheers,

Mark
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - doctorchris
The clutch release bearing will be noisy when the clutch pedal is depressed.
Noises when the clutch pedal is released almost always come from the gearbox and can be anything from a low level of gear oil to expensive component failure.
You are being given the runaround by the dealer in the hope that you will give up and go away.
Surely even a Vauxhall mechanic could check the gearbox oil level on a Citroen, it's hardly rocket science!
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - Peter D
Make your mind up, at first you did not have the noise when you pressed the clutch now it only makes the noise when the clutch is depressed. Which is it. Regards Peter
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - C5-55
If the car is stopped, the noise disappears when the clutch is depressed. I've always said that.

Update: I had my local mechanic check the transmission oil, and the level is correct.

More: from under the bonnet the noise is very evident. And disappears completely when the clutch is depressed.

Unfortunately my local mechanic can't tell for sure where it is coming from (seems to be from either gearbox or clutch), much less what the cause is.

Cheers,

Mark
55 2.0 Help with noise in a Citroen C5 please - C5-55
Thanks doctorchris,

. "The clutch release bearing will be noisy when the clutch pedal is depressed."
I see. I had misanderstood it. I thought it was the way round. Then it is probably not it.

. "You are being given the runaround by the dealer"
Looks like it. Or: it seems that all these different Evan Halshaw are semi-independent "franchises", and they are trrying to push the hot potato to each other. But the end result is the same.

I'll have my local independent specialist check the transmission fluid tomorrow. I hope this is the cause, as it is the cheapest to fix. And the noise is not loud at all. I hope/think that if it is low fluid, that it didn't damage the gearbox permanently yet. The car has only 26,000 miles.

Cheers,

Mark
 

Ask Honest John

Value my car