I've had two daughters pass their test in the past three years.
The benefit of off-highway tuition is pretty limited, in my opinion, and once she has her licence and insurance you can go to industrial estates in the evening/weekend and practice. The slow speed work you can do off the road is not really the stumbling block - it's handling busy junctions with lights, traffic, pedestrians etc. that causes the problems.
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Tell that to my youngest daughter... its the gear changing thats stopped her trying to drive (and yes, I have suggested an auto!)... being able to change gear smoothly before going on to the public roads is a real benefit, in my opinion...
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Both had lessons, but both got through the test at 17 and six months because I wore my backside numb sitting alongside them for two hours at a stretch driving to, round and back from Oxford (15 miles away). I reckon they had about 20 lessons each, and about another 15-20 sessions as described with me.
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You can try the Go motorsort website: www.gomotorsport.net/
Find a local motor club that does grass autotests, join the club, and enter an autotest PCA event. Drivers can start at 14. Don't be intimidated I did quite well with a 750 Panda! It teaches them clutch and steering control in a safe environment.
I'm fifty miles north of London. If that's in your bailiwick, ask the mods to forward a message and I'll do what I can to help.
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I learnt to drive at age 12 on the depot of my father's business. A large expanse of concrete (at least half an acre) plus two estate roads leading to it. I also learnt to drive smaller HGVs at the same time. This gave me very good confidence in driving on the road, because I was not worried about stalling etc. I knew how to pull away without worry so concentrated on road awareness not basic driving skills; which I already had.
My ability to maneouveur cars and wagons was also very good, and although middle age is creeping up on me now I can still get a bus through car sized gaps.
The problem is that what I did then is probably illegal now due to changes in road legislation and I would need to be insured if I did that today. However if the OPs daughter can find some private land that the public does not use, it will be advantageous.
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Local industrial estate and factory yards aged 11 was first time I drove a car. Not possible now with fences and gates around almost every factory!
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I learnt on an old airfield as soon as I could reach the pedals in the old mans car.
It was a common thing and they had painted bits and cones for practising parallel parking and the like.
It certainly makes learning on the road faster, easier and safer once the mechanicals of driving come naturally without thought or effort.
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My ability to maneouveur cars and wagons was also very good and although middle age is creeping up on me now I can still get a bus through car sized gaps.
Respect to you sir; I come across many drivers every day who are unable to get a car through a bus-sized gap!
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On the road in a 1600 Triumph Vitesse Convertible.
DON'T ASK.
MD
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Don't suppose your daughter fancies working weekends on a farm?
I was brought up on one and driving various vehicles off-road from 11-years-old and a tractor on the road legally at 16.
As another poster has said, it's good for basic control, gear changing etc, but it won't teach you how to pass the test.
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Both my kids learnt with the Under 17 Car Club
www.under17-carclub.co.uk
They really want members to join before they're 16 - I think both mine joined around 13 and thoroughly enjoyed the experience. They will learn in your car, and you will do most of the teaching. There are also volunteer instructors who will test them and grade them.
The training my kids received was excellent - my son passed his car test 6 days after his 17th birthday (in 2000)
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Contact your local council;some offer training schemes.
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My Dad used to take me to Ainsdale Beach to practice, starting when I was 13, which was quite common back in the late 70s.
Passed the driving test first time aged 17 and 3 months.
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Ainsdale! Me too! And Formby. Vivid memories of Dad yelling and screaming at me. Still, it stood me in good stead when I could get out on the open road a year later.
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Ainsdale Beach! Me too, about 13 or 14 in a hire car on holiday. Not been back since.
But then I started at 16 on a moped ( no gears to worry about ), a Lambretta scooter ( learning about gears...and gravel rash! ) and finally at 17 in a Ford Popular ( only 3 gears! ).
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Cardrome in Hornchurch, Essex (or East London if you want to wind the locals up) was where I learnt before I was 17. That was in the mid 70's, but the place is still there. Got my Dad's Hunter up to 60mph on the back straight and to my dad's credit, he didn't say a word.
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I used to live in Elm Park, just up the road and remember it well. My Dad would make me and my brother pile in the back of his M2 Ford Escort when my mum was learning to drive.
I was about to suggest a cardrome and wondered if it still existed.
Cor, what memories.
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I think the value of pre-17 off road driving is over-rated. I agree it teaches confidence and ability at basic steering, gears, clutch, manoeuvring, but it also very easily lets bad habits get ingrained too.
It's good for breeding boy racers, but I'm not so sure it is the best way of producing steady sensible drivers aware that they are handling a deadly weapon.
At its worst it can be completely counter-productive. My farmer uncle employed a tractor driver who had been driving since a boy. He could do anything with a tractor, reverse two trailers in tandem, or avoid getting stuck in Lincolnshire clay. He drove tractors and LandRovers competently but illegally on the roads.
But he repeatedly failed the test and in the end retired never having passed.
He could drive, but was unteachable.
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I disagree that teaching someone the 'mechanics' of driving on private land will teach them bad habits.
Before I learned to drive I was taken on an old airfield. It was scary as Hell to be in control of a ton and a half of my parents pride and joy but it eventually gave me the confidence and co-ordination to be able to steer, change gear, brake and check mirrors all without taking my eyes off the road. It also enabled me to simply get a feel for a car, how it handled if I turned the wheel too hard or braked too hard and what sounds it made at different speeds and revs.
I was then able to concentrate on learning to drive on roads when I eventually started lessons for real with an instructor.
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I agree in the moderate way you describe it can be very valuable, as a precursor to proper tuition on the road. But I think there is a line beyond which its benefit becomes counterproductive.
Driving on the road in the early stages is difficult and demands concentration. Driving around farmyards and on old aerodromes is great fun, but can encourage irresponsibility, and also a certain disrespect for qualified instructors.
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Well it certainly never did me or my brother any harm. Possibly driving old bangers round a farm yard would encourage misuse, but not driving your parents car whilst they are sitting in it which is what the OP describes.
Edited by iqn869 on 11/06/2009 at 14:18
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People under 17 cannot drive a car anywhere 'to which the public has access'. This rules out car parks or green lanes (rights of way with vehicular rights).
I think it's worthwhile teaching a new driver the very basics of getting a car moving, steering, stopping etc. in a non-highway situation, but finding somewhere is not easy.
My son has recently turned 17 and I intend to take him to a very isolated, open minor road on the edge of Salisbury Plain for his first driving experience. But he's 17, so it's legal. Therafter he's going to have lessons from a professional instructor.
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Have you also seen the "Arrive Alive" scheme being run by DSA where for completion of a questionnaire kids get two free itunes?
I did some driving on a caravan site a couple of times (sometimes towing), but I generally think that it gains very little, driving before 17.
Sometimes kids can grow up too fast....
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I used to live in Elm Park just up the road and remember it well. My Dad would make me and my brother pile in the back of his M2 Ford Escort when my mum was learning to drive. I was about to suggest a cardrome and wondered if it still existed. Cor what memories.
Another ex-Elm Parker here!
I took many a pre seventeen year old round the Cardrome before they started their own school and banned other ADI's form using it unless they paid £50 for the session and took all the advertising off the car.
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