Fairylights, reading your initial post, I fully expected to see you get a finger wagged at you for considering daring to drive a Matiz down country lanes with children on board...
Surprised no-one appears to have mentioned a Polo, especially PoloGirl herself, as she used to swear by the solidity of hers.
A lad at my work recently went to view two very tidy-looking P & R reg ones which were on private sales for about £600-700 if I remember correctly, so there ARE some about, you may just have to cast your net further afield.
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Sorry, Fairylights - I'm sure no-one meant to upset you. Most of the people who contribute to BR are male (not me, though), so the advice can seem to be a little more direct than you may get elsewhere. I don't mind, but it can look a little forthright to new posters. My suggestion of a slightly bigger car was based on experience - we quickly outgrew our little Colt and as the biggest expense is purchase/depreciation, buying a car that will last a few years may be a good idea. Plus, small cars do command a premium at the moment. I hope we haven't put you off the BR!
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Hi Fairylights. Have you looked at the problem from the other end? Perhaps you should keep the Seat, which you love, to transport the children and yourself happily around the lanes especially as your mileage will be quite high with the to and fro nature of school runs/activities in the country. Meanwhile your husband could get a cheaper, comfortable larger car for his commute?
It really does seem that larger cars are cheaper whereas small cars are at a premium.
If you opt for a Matiz, make sure you have a long test drive - I absolutely hated a Matiz hire car in every way, having always thought it looked quite dinky.
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Stay away from any Polo that has got DKF VW gearbox in, my 1.4 had one and 83k I had to replace it and that's when I found out there's a known fault with these gearboxes which means when you go to buy a second-hand one the scrappies charge you more than what they should be!
Have a look at Toyota Starlet, not many around but a sound car! We've had 2 so far in our family and they've been bomb proof, dad's got one with 112k on it and its going strong. You should be able to pick one up within your budget. All the best.
Let us know what you got at the end.
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What about a Fiat Bravo/a (I'm not sure of the difference between the two?). They're cheap because they're Fiats.
I think, Fairylights, your desire for a CD player has pushed the choice of car.
£200 will buy you an early 1980s Polo with 12 months' MOT, no rust, and mechanically very simple. It will be like driving a tin box, but it will be a very cheap, reliable tiny car.
But there won't be a tape player, let alone a CD player; and even if there were, road noise would mean that you wouldn't be able to hear it anyway.
So you want a more modern Polo, but expect to pay £1,500 - that's a lot for a CD player.
On the other hand £400 might buy you a 7 year old Mondeo; it'll be rather leggy, but probably with aircon, possibly with leather seats. Fair enough, you don't want to drive one, but the topsy-turvy nature of the price of second-hand cars (big cars costing less than small ones) means that we would be neglecting you if we didn't mention it.
And then safety. Some people on here - and in the real world - get very obsessed with the relative safety of different cars. Cars have been getting safer as time has gone on. But a big old car will almost certainly beat a small new car.
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What about a Fiat Bravo/a (I'm not sure of the difference between the two?). They're cheap because they're Fiats.
1996 on Mk1 Fiat Bravo 3dr, Brava 5dr
Cars have been getting safer as time has gone on. But a big old car will almost certainly beat a small new car.
Didn't you see Channel 5's recent show which put a Renault Modus against a twenty year old Volvo 7/9 series ?
I would go for a FIAT but would advise anyone not familiar with the marque to take along someone who is. With regular servicing they do last, rust is pretty rare on these cars up to 10 years old and because people still think they are rot boxes from their 70's reputation can be had pretty cheaply.
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>>Didn't you see Channel 5's recent show which put a Renault Modus against a twenty year old Volvo 7/9 series ?
The view on here was that the test was fixed as it hit the Volvo on a known vulnerable corner.
Oh yes, and wouldn't OP be better off with a 5-door car as she has two child seats? Bigger cars have more space for child seats.
Edited by Mapmaker on 16/10/2007 at 11:48
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Oh yes and wouldn't OP be better off with a 5-door car as she has two child seats? Bigger cars have more space for child seats.
Not sure I agree - it's not personal Mapmaker :) - we had a Peugeot 206 before buying a Volvo S60 and I'm not sure our daughter has any more legroom in the back of the Volvo. Yes, the Volvo has SIPS and airbags coming out of every flat surface, this swallows up the extra size of the car, in my view.
More protection yes, more space ? I think it very much depends on the model and even down to the specification on individual models.
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And then safety. Some people on here - and in the real world - get very obsessed with the relative safety of different cars. Cars have been getting safer as time has gone on. But a big old car will almost certainly beat a small new car.
Did you not see the test crash between an old Volvo and a new small Renault? (Fifth Gear I think - could have been Top Gear) The Renault came out far better. Not that its relevant to this thread as we are comparing big old cars with small OLD cars.
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Fiat Bravo/a (I'm not sure of the difference between the two?)
Bravo is the 3 door version, Brava has 5 door. The Marea is the saloon and estate form.
If a CD player is essential, Fairylights, just buy a car with a standard DIN sized radio (or radio bay if one's not fitted. Then pick up a CD player in Argos or a car accessory shop - you can literally slide the old radio out, plug in the new one and slide it back in place.
Keep the old radio so that when you sell the car, you can put the old one back and transfer the new one to your next car - or sell it separately. After all, it may well be the most valuable single component of the car by the time you sell it (as I realised *after* SWMBO traded in her end-of-life Vectra with its year-old CD deck still in place!)
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Fiat Bravo/a (I'm not sure of the difference between the two?)
Bravo had 3 doors, Brava was uglier and had 5. Two of the least reliable cars ever made. Stick to Far-Eastern manufacturers and you won't go far wrong.
Some people don't seem to understand that you only want a cheap and cheerful shopping trolley to ferry the kids around in, not a 15y/o aircraft-carrier. Anything with a Nissan badge and service history will do the job, as will a decent Hyundai.
It annoys me when someone specifically says "I don't want a big car, something Fiesta-sized will do", and the whole BR replies "You should get a Mondeo". I had a choice of an Almera and a Primera when I last went car-shopping, and I settled for the Almera purely because I didn't need a bigger car, nor am I likely to do so in the near future. I hope a small minority of the replies have been of some help to you, and pointed you towards the best things to look for.
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Hear Hear - why do some threads have to turn into a race for some seasoned posters to get down their default posts as fast as possible, often ignoring the OPs requirements, and then defend their position forever!
I would agree with Gromits suggestion of buying a good example of anything that comes up, having come up with a list of contenders. In amongst the noise of this thread there's quite a lot of cars to look out for that would do the job.
Small car wise I went through exactly this exercise recently and ended up with a pretty standard Micra/Corsa/106/Saxo list. In the end I got an incredibly basic Corsa 1.2 because one came up from a known source, with history, long MOT, long tax etc..all of which helps reduce the risk of a big bill. I want to run my car on the smallest budget so things like lowest insurance group were also important and definitely in the £115 VED category rather than £180 (<1.5ish litres). Mechanical simplicity, lack of toys to go wrong and local mechanic friendly also got votes for me!
Good luck Fairylights - there should be a cheap, reliable, unfashionable car out there that is fit for purpose.
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It is true that Fiat owners complain about their Fiats. It is true that they are held together with chewing gum and parcel tape. It is true that there are no Fiats left from the 1980s as rust has devoured them. However they are dirt cheap, and warranty direct does not consider modern cars to be unreliable. A quotation from HJ's car-by-car breakdown on the Bravo/a:
"FIAT had 2nd lowest average cost in warranty claims for cars up to 10 years old in 2002 Warranty Direct index. In 2003 Warranty Direct Reliability Index. Bravo/Brava scored an excellent rating of 30. FIATs generally had below average warranty repair costs in 2003 Warranty Direct Reliability index (index 75.82 v/s lowest 31.93), narrowly beating VW. 7th from top in 2006 index, still beating Golf IV. Link:- www.reliabilityindex.co.uk"
The reason that there have been many suggestions for non-small cars is that OP's original post gave plenty of opportunity to make alternative suggestions. Many car drivers think that a tiny car will be cheaper than a larger car. We would be doing OP a disservice not to point out the error of this assumption and the many advantages of a larger car (economy, comfort, safety and a newer car, all for a smaller budget).
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Anybody who buys a bravo/brava with that 1400 engine in it thats made of chocolate needs their bumps felt
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I totally agree about some posters always recommending Mondeo sized cars, totally ignoring the requirements of the poster or the needs!
Quite sometime ago when I asked what small car I should get for pizza delivery, everyone suggested Mondeo, Pug 405, caviler etc.. even though I specifically asked for small car opinions and at the end I got nothing out of that post.
As the poster is specially after a tiny car, my suggestion would be Toyota Starlet, Suzuki Swift.
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I totally agree about some posters always recommending Mondeo sized cars totally ignoring the requirements of the poster or the needs! Quite sometime ago when I asked what small car I should get for pizza delivery everyone suggested Mondeo Pug 405 caviler etc.. even though I specifically asked for small car>>>>>>>>
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<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
www.honestjohn.co.uk/forum/post/index.htm?t=43104
looks all good to me the advice given? even mine :-)
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Bell boy in that thread I was specifically talking to Pug 106 and anyone suggesting a bigger car in that thread would had looked a bit silly.
I'm sure it was another thread.
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Wife had a Matiz for 2 years - Bought with 19k for £2500 sold for £1200 with 45k.
All it needed in that time was Brake Pads and 2 Tyres.
45mpg round town in summer in traffic with Air Con, 65mpg on a run.
I have driven cars such as the New 1.25 Fiesta and a 6 month old 1.1 Mitsubishi Colt which because been heavier probably have about the same lack of power.
Saying that we went on Holiday for a week in ours fully loaded and it was fine, even out dragged a Agila up a hill !
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We went through a similar exercise recently - needed a small, economical second car, which also had to be automatic.
Took a while, but eventually ended up with a 7 year old Honda Logo CVT with 34000 miles on the clock (serviced annually by Honda).
Looked at a bunch of other cars including a Daihatsu Sirion, Smart, Kia Picanto, but most of these were newer and hence too expensive.
If you want a small car (easy to park, cheap to run), it's no good recommending Mondeos....
Yes, you pay a bit more for small cars, but you save money running them; the Honda uses *half* the fuel of the bigger car it replaces, returning 45mpg around town.
Edited by pyruse on 17/10/2007 at 11:55
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